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Ron Paul just kills his own campaign...

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by MobBoss, May 12, 2011.

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  1. Formaldehyde

    Formaldehyde Both Fair And Balanced

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    The article I posted earlier claimed the actual cost was $4-6 trillion.

    I just wonder when I'll again be able to carry a regular-sized shampoo bottle onto a flight without 3-year-old girls being frisked.

    So what's the excuse for the US not doing so over the course of nearly 10 years when they knew which country he was located?

    The US hasn't been able "eradicate" "Islamist terrorists" in either Iraq or Afghanistan, or anyplace else. What makes you think a country with far fewer resources and a far smaller military would be able to do so, especially since their own "terrorists" aka Pakistani Taliban weren't really bothering anybody that much until provoked by the US in an attempt to ethnic cleanse them from their own country?

    And how exactly was bin Laden going to "get away"? Describe a scenario where he would been able to escape that compound when surrounded by two dozen SEALs and other US governmental assets which had been there for months.

    Compared to US incompetence in this matter, it is really minuscule. Why aren't you blaming the truly incompetent in this matter instead of a minor player? Do you blame US state governments when fleeing federal felons are finally located in their state?
     
  2. GhostWriter16

    GhostWriter16 Deity

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    When we elect Ron Paul...

    BTW: I don't remember where I found it, but do you remember the video where Ron Paul rants against this and proposes a law that Congress must follow the same laws they pass on others?

    But they won't do that, it would take away their precious power...
     
  3. Aegis

    Aegis Deity

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    Pakistan is a big country and our effort to water board his specific location out of people in Guantanamo was not working for some strange reason.
     
  4. Formaldehyde

    Formaldehyde Both Fair And Balanced

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    In other words, by far the largest manhunt in the history of the world was riddled by incompetence right up to the very end.

    It took the US months to finally even try to see if bin Laden was there. He apparently could have easily escaped again in the interim. If he had, I seriously doubt we would have heard a word about yet another failure in a long string of failures.
     
  5. Aegis

    Aegis Deity

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    More like it was incompetent from the start. The intel, surveillance and operation which led to his eventual killing was not incompetent. Not on the US' part, at least.
     
  6. Brian Shanahan

    Brian Shanahan Permanoob

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    Even before the start, look at the way the investigations of suspicions of what turned out to be the 9/11 bombers were handled so disjointedly by various law enforcement groups, and lets not forget the spiking of other investigatios which were leading to them, because Bush didn't want to embarass his daddy's (and his former) employers, the Saudi royal family and their cronies (including most of the bin Laden clan). We wouldn't be having this debate if US law enforcement officers had done their jobs in ther first place.
     
  7. Terrapin

    Terrapin Prince

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    I have seen a lot of foolish things written about Bin Laden and GWoT lately, but this may be the dumbest of all. For years, Bin Laden was living in a mansion next to military base outside Islamabad. If our "relationship" with Pakistan meant anything at all they would have handed him over to us a long time ago. SO we have a dead terrorist and nothing of value lost.
     
  8. Formaldehyde

    Formaldehyde Both Fair And Balanced

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    It has been incompetent all along, and the last 6 months or so are certainly no exception. They shouldn't have spent more than a few days assessing this compound, deciding to surround it so nobody could possibly escape, and calling in the appropriate Pakistani police authorities to determine exactly who was inside.

    Instead, they did none of that while risking that bin Laden would yet again move someplace else.

    And I think that statement is "foolish" and "dumbest of all". You have absolutely no proof that the Pakistani government was complicit in any of this. There may have been one or two people in high places who had a general idea where he might be, but claiming that that Pakistani government are essentially terrorists is patently ridiculous.

    It would also mean the US government is completely incompetent by not identifying them as being state supporters of terrorism long ago.
     
  9. galdre

    galdre Emperor

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    the US wanted full bragging rights

    will OBL being dead change anything? No, but now we get to hear about how we killed him for weeks.
     
  10. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Partisan?

    I'm a republican.

    Isnt Ron Paul a republican?

    How is it partisan then?

    :confused:

    @Formaldehyde, so you think our people were incompetent in finally finding and killing OBL. What qualifies you to make such an observation and state it as fact? I mean you even give precise details on what they 'should' have done, as opposed to what they actually did, so what do you offer to indicate that your opinion of their incompetence and what they should have done is valid?

    Point is, they did involved the Pakistanis previously just like you suggested and it resulted in mission failure. They actually changed away from what you say 'should have been done' in this mission, and it succeeded. The factual history of such missions actually indicates if they had done what you suggest, this would have failed also.

    So I am really at a loss as to why you claim this was incompetence when it was successful, and yet the suggestions you make had been tried previously and failed? That makes no sense to me what-so-ever.
     
  11. Aegis

    Aegis Deity

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    The Pakistanis didn't know who was inside for the past six years, yet you think their surveillance is going to be better than that of the US'? :crazyeye:

    Surrounding the compound isn't going to accomplish much if there was an underground escape tunnel (Bin Laden was an Engineer specialized in tunneling), plus waiting for political channels would have given them time to react and open the door to possibly incompetent/corrupt Pakistani police to F it all up. This country did not need another Battle of Tora Bora. Taking matters into our own hands was the best way to ensure that the job was done correctly. We got in, got the job done, and got out before anyone could react.
     
  12. JollyRoger

    JollyRoger Slippin' Jimmy Supporter

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    Though partisan typically refers to poltical party, it can be more narrowly construed to a faction of a party. You can be partisan against someone that you share a party label with. Just look at my all-Republican county here in Texas. You have two camps of elected leaders all trying to get indictments against each other. The safest thing to be is a D because no one is gunning for you. If you are a R, you are treated with suspician until it become known which camp you are in and then you are either loved or hated. It is viscious enough to make national politics seem like a game of pattycake.
     
  13. GhostWriter16

    GhostWriter16 Deity

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    Well, from my experience with you, you being partisan isn't usually part of your character, so I consider this the exception, not the rule.

    Second of all, that's just the thing. Ron Paul is unorthodox in his views, not fitting the GOP in every point. Thus it makes logical sense that more mainstream Republicans would dislike him. But to basically call him an idiot because you don't agree with him on foreign policy is simply ridiculous.

    And I highly doubt that statement will hurt Ron Paul's chances much, or at least what chances he had in the first place.

    So you are admitting to him being correct?;)
     
  14. JollyRoger

    JollyRoger Slippin' Jimmy Supporter

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    Dommy is making progress in the humor department. :goodjob:
     
  15. GhostWriter16

    GhostWriter16 Deity

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    :lol:

    Actually, I was being serious. Nobody is perfect. But I think most of us make an effort.
     
  16. amadeus

    amadeus Bring back the Civ2 theme!

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    Are you saying you opposed FDR's goading us into war with the Axis powers? I never got that impression from you before. It seems like the only other times you endorsed the use of violence is when Fidel Castro or the ANC was doing it. Furthermore, I like how 9/11 was blowback and the bombing of Germany was unjustified aggression.
     
  17. GhostWriter16

    GhostWriter16 Deity

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    I don't give FDR credit for any of that. In fact, I don't give anyone credit. That whole war was the fault of the negiligance of Britain and France*

    (*I'm well aware the literal blame falls on Hitler, but he WANTED the war, and so he succeeded in getting it. Britain and France wanted to avoid a problem, and so they caused the problem of a world war. And strictly speaking, it was Britain and France who forced Germany into an unjust treaty in WWI, which started the entire issue in the first place.
     
  18. Behind The Mask

    Behind The Mask King

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    I suggest not opening this can of worms; too many differing opinions and quite someways from the topic at hand.

    Save that for the history section, eh?
     
  19. Japanrocks12

    Japanrocks12 tired of being a man

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    Pakistan sucks. It's not worth preserving our relationship with them.
     
  20. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Especially not for the amount of money we send them a year....
     
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