RSG5 Emperor 20K

[Raliuven]

Okay, I'm going to finish my turns tonight (finally).

I didn't see any preference on trading other than CKS. I usually default on making the trade in a normal game. I will check our enemies (and post them, not sure why I didnt' do that this time?) and if no one has Alpha I will reconsider. If one of them has alpha, I'll trade immediately, just in case.

My remaining goals will be to bust the fog and get an escort for our settler and send it on the way (getting settler in place is the primary goal).

Overseer - good to have you onboard, I'll make you active on the roster!

 

[Raliuven]

Turn 14 [3300BC]
Continued

Here is the line up – I’m also updating the OP so it is easy to find.

Spoiler :

Celts (Agricultural/Religious) UU: Gallic Swordsman (replaces swordsman: 3/2/2 Shields: 40)
Ottomans (Scientific/Industrious) UU: Sipahi (replaces cavalry: 8/3/3 Shields: 100)
Sumeria (Scientific/Agricultural) UU: Enkidu Warrior (replaces spearmen 1/2/1 Shields: 10)
Babylon (Scientific/Religious) UU: Bowman (replaces archer: 2/2/1 Shields: 20)
Russia (Scientific/Expansionist) UU: Cossack (replaces cavalry 6/3/3 Shields: 90 *Blitz*)
Inca (Expansionist/Agricultural) UU: Chasqui Scout (replaces scout: 1/1/2 Shields: 20 *Ignores Terrain*)
Hittites (Expansionist/Commercial) UU: Three-Man Chariot (replaces chariot: 2/2/2 Shields: 30 *Terrain Restriction*)

We are not the only one’s with apha – the Hittites have it as well. We also have 3 expansionist civs so I think contacts are going to happen relatively fast – on top of the 4 scientific and 2 agricultural civ traits! The good news – no militaristic civs.

I decide to make the trade. We give them Alpha for CB & 35gp.

IBT – 2/2 barb suicides on our warrior. Clean defense.

Turn 15 [3250BC]

3/3 warrior vs 2/2 barb to keep the road clear to our new settling land. Flawless win.
Warrior #1 S. Yes, that’s a fish in the lake!
Lux to 40% due to city size (4).

IBT – last barb goes north to cow at river mouth.

Turn 16 [3200BC]

Seoul: Settler=>Warrior
Send warrior #1 to deal with barb. Warrior #2 returns to escort settler.
Lux back to 10%.

IBT – Barb forts on cow.

Turn 17 [3150BC]

Settler moves towards warrior #2 for escort.
Warrior #1 attacks barb – victory, -1hp.

IBT - zzz

Turn 18 [3100BC]

Settler and warrior merge on hill E , SE, SE of Seoul.
Fort warrior #1 to heal.

The Celts have pottery & wc and they think we are technologically backwards but they are impressed with our culture. Hmm?

IBT - zzz

Turn 19 [3050BC]

Seoul=>Warrior=>Warrior (worker?) Next player can veto if desired.
Warrior #1 wakes up, send him SE to hill to finish scouting possible 2nd city area.
Fort our 3rd warrior in the city for the moment.

IBT - zzz

Turn 20 [3000BC]

Mine on cow is down, we are at 5fpt, 5spt. Worker should road next.

Not sure if we want warrior #3 to scout to our south. I have him forted to control happiness for the moment, but not sure if that is really critical.

Our settler is entering the area of the 2nd city placement, as desired. I think we settled on the hill that Warrior #1 is currently standing on?

 

[LKendter]

You may want to post a picture with the grid on. There are a LOT of possible combos for your 20K city.
If you give up the 2nd cow, you can pick up a lot bonus grassland in the north.

 

[CKS]

At first glance, 1 N of the cow looks good - 5 BG, a cow, 2 hills and a mountain - but I won't be able to do any shield counting until tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Elephantium]

We should settle the grassland between the cow and the fish. I crunched the numbers for that site and the hill 1N of it, and we'll get 3-4 more shields next to the fish:

Either way, we'll be working a Grassland Cow w/Mine, 4 BGs, 2 Hills, 2 regular Grasslands, and a Mountain (total 20 food, including city center). That drops the difference to just two Citizens: The Plains cow and the Hill under consideration as the city site. If those two tiles aren't available, those citizens will work a BG and a regular Grassland tile. Of course, the city center will get an extra shield on the hill vs. the grassland, but that still leaves the hill site 3 shields behind the grassland site.

Forest (Plains) Cow: 3 food, 3 shields
Mined Hill: 1 food, 3 shields

Mined BG: 2 food, 2 shields
Mined grass: 2 food, 1 shield

LKendter, do you see anything I might have missed in my analysis? I tried to be thorough, but you never know

 

[LKendter]

LKendter, do you see anything I might have missed in my analysis? I tried to be thorough, but you never know

Without the grid on to hard for me to figure out.

 

[Elephantium]

I downloaded the save and poked around to get my figures!

I didn't calculate anything for the hill that Warrior #1 is standing on, though. That site compares to #1 from my last post with:

Same 2 cows
same 3 of Hills
6 Grassland tiles (but only 2 of those are BGs)
Mountain

So the Warrior hill loses two BGs compared to the valley location. Well, probably. The forest where our Settler is right now could be hiding a BG.

All in all...I'd say the grassland site next to the fish is our best bet.

 

[CKS]

The grass site between the cow and the fish doesn't have 2 regular grass tiles to work, so it would substitute an irrigated plains tile. It is a very nice site. The eastern BG which you can't see in the screenshot (NE of the lake) makes this grass site better than my first guess, the 1N of cow site (28 shields vs 26 at size 12).

The only other site that I think is worth considering is the BG tile 1N, 1NE of the cow. It would work the cow, 6 BG, 2 hills, 1 mountain, and 2 regular grass tiles at size 12, and pick up the extra shield in the city center. This gives 27 shields. The advantages to this location are:
6 forests to chop rather than 4.
Greater chance of finding BG under the forests.
No water tiles, so all tiles get an extra shield with railroads.
Slightly closer to the capital (7 instead of 8), so possibly we get an extra shield uncorrupted.

The disadvantages are:
27 shields vs 28 shields at size 12
3 steps to get there vs 2 steps

Each location picks up 8 shields at size 20. The fish location has the fish to balance out the plains a little. Corruption calculations aren't my strong point, but I expect that each location will get at least 25 uncorrupted shields at size 12, and this is the big deal.

I'll play tomorrow afternoon, so if you have a preference, reveal it soon.

 

[TheOverseer714]

At some point, we can build a courthouse and the FP to fix the corruption. I agree with Elaphantium's spot, we need the most food and shields, and that site has that combo. It's closer too. I think we should build a temple first, move the other warrior in as the second mp when needed.

 

[ThERat]

Following this game with great interest.

Memories of the insane LK 20K AW come to mind

 

[LKendter]

Memories of the insane LK 20K AW come to mind

LOL - forgot about that one. Early AW rush and a city not helping out with troops.

 

[CKS]

Turn 0:
Warrior on hill goes south, settler pair goes east, worker roads. Turn up science.
IBT: Seoul warrior to worker

Turn 1:
New warrior forts as mp. Settler pair in place. Warrior goes south. Turn lux down. Change my mind, lux up, new warrior goes south.

Turn 2:
Build Pyongyang, start temple - one of our two shields is corrupt. Celtic warrior is near Pyongyang. Warriors explore south.
IBT: Seoul worker to warrior. Celtic warrior approaches Pyongyang.

Turn 3:
New worker heads toward Pyongyang.
Old worker mines BG. Warriors go south.

Turn 4: Warriors go south.
IBT: Seoul warrior to worker.

Turn 5: Warriors explore.

Turn 6: Warriors explore. Find Celts, dyes. Realize that I can get an extra commerce working the fish, without changing food or shields in Pyongyang.
IBT: Seoul worker to settler.

Turn 7: Warriors explore. Worker chops forest near Pyongyang, second worker heads toward Pyongyang.

Turn 8: same. Worker roads toward Pyongyang.
IBT: Pyongyang grows.

Turn 9: P works cow and bg, we get 2/3 shields. Worker moves to road.

Turn 10: Continue exploring.

Worker on Seoul BG should road & mine it. Second worker should road to Pyongyang. Pyongyang worker should finish forest chop and then mine.

The settler should go nearby Pyongyang, so that the second ring of Pyongyang tiles near it come into our culture. 1S of that little lake in the north would give Pyongyang a BG, and it has a lot of BG to work. 2 SW of the plains cow would give Pyongyang the second cow, but it has mostly plains tiles to work.

The Celts got mysticism and the wheel very quickly, so I think they've met someone else.

 

[splunge the 2nd]

I'm up, right? Should be able to play some this weekend. After Temple, do we want to start on Pyramids in Pyongyang?
For the third city, I think I prefer the southern site to buffer against nothward spread of the AI. We can build on the site "1S of the little lake" later in my opinion.

 

[splunge the 2nd]

OK, I'm on turn 8 and it's been pretty quiet.
Before I make a tech trade and set research priorities, I'd like folks' input. Here's my turn log to this point:

Spoiler :

Turn 31
Chop finishes. Temple in 20 in Pyongyang
Workers road where they are. Warriors explore. Lux to 20%

Turn 32
Seoul settler>warrior
Science to 100%

Turn 33
Worker starts cutting forest between Seoul and Pyingyan for roading. Settler slowly heading to 3rd city site.


Turn 34
Pyongyang worker moves to western cow

Turn 35
Seoul build warrior>settler. Grows to 3 in 1.

Turn 36
Happiness to 20%, loses a turn to writing, but can't be helped. Science to 50, still writing in 2.

Turn 37
Exploring warrior meets Ottomans. We're very behind them and Celts in tech. Debate Masonry vs Mysticism for Alphabet. Take Mysticism for Alpha as we can probably buy Masonry cheaply later, the pyramids and the oracle are both 4 culture and no one has started any wonders yet.

Turn 38
Learn writing. CoL in 30 at 80% science
We're broke and running -2 per turn so skip embassy for now.
We can get Warrior code, masonry, pottery and all of Osman's 70 gold for writing and trade Breanus Writing plus 70 gold for the wheel.

Do I make the deal losing our monopoly on writing and risk the slingshot? Should I do it and switch from researching CoL to philosophy so I don't miss the slingshot, but will have to research Philosophy? Alternatively, should I keep it all to myself and hope to sell it later but lose archer deterrence? I really don't want a war right now. I don't expect any contacts real soon, but maybe I'll bump into Breannus' other trade partner in the fog.

Callling it a night

 

[CKS]

I would prefer not to trade writing at this time. With mysticism, we have a wonder to build, so there isn't any rush. Keep looking for other trading partners.

I would have preferred masonry, so we'd have a palace prebuild, but the oracle is the better culture wonder (fewer shields), so it works out okay.

We want to get a coastal city - by the dyes and fish - pretty soon (for curraghs), and probably a couple of other cities, but then we should put Seoul on worker duty. Pyongyang can grow to size 6, but we should then join workers to get it to size 12 ASAP (as soon as the tiles are improved).

 

[TheOverseer714]

I agree with not trading Writing, it's very easy losing the Republic sling by trading it. I also agree mostly with CKS about the capital mostly building workers, but after every 3 or 4 workers, we need a settler to continue our expansion, at least out to a couple of rings for a viable empire. Gotta be able to defend ourselves.

 

[splunge the 2nd]

OK, it's full speed ahead to CoL and holding on to Writing.

Here's the last 3 turns

Spoiler :

Turn 38
LEarn writing. CoL in 30 at 80% science
We're broke and running -2 per turn so skip embassy for now.
We can get Warrior code, masonry, pottery and all of Osman's 70 gold for writing and trade Breanus Writing plus 70 gold for the wheel.

OK, no trade for writing. Worker irrigates cow by Pyongyang

Turn 39
Found Wonsan SSW of Pyongyang. warrior in 10. Pyongyang wrks the cow, temple now in 8.

Turn 40
Seoul Settler>worker (for now- growth in 4, completes in 3, so might switch to a warrior to get in sync with growth)
Worker near Seoul moves to improve around Pyongyang. It's a long walk as there's rivers to cross, and I hate to waste worker turns, but if Seoul is staying low pop to make workers, no reason to improve much more for now)
Settler heads NNE towards the inland sea NW of Pyongyang.

Here's the save. Overall uneventful turnset.
Elephantium, you're up and Toxicman's on deck.

 

[Elephantium]

I could use a swap. Toxic, do you have time to play in the next 2-3 days?

 

[Elephantium]

Or Overseer...I won't get to this game before the weekend because of Rat44.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Me either, I am a weekend warrior, these days.