[RD] Russia Invades Ukraine: The 7th Thread Itch; scratch it here!

[keli]

"Far-right" doesn't mean neo-nazi.

The Kremlin is not innocent.

So what, you have not so far proved that I've had a pro-Russian agenda.

But I've enjoyed playing the devil's advocate. That was my only true intent since the beginning.

There's no way the US has the moral high ground when the strategy is "kill kill Russia and China at all costs using whatever neo-nazi cannon fodder you can muster". That's just ridiculous. And in the end, it just goes to prove what I always tried to do as a devil's advocate: that whatever evil the Russians have done or present in the current world stage, you're forgetting about the real real elephant in the room which is the US and its predatory interventions, interests, and manifold efforts to muster whatever they can to weaken their geopolitical rivals.

Ukraine is just another instance of that. But nuff said, case in point, and this thread will keep on forever but I just refuse to see Zelensky and the US as the "angels" and the "good guys" of this story.

And really, calling me "racist" for evicing occasional pro-Kremlin sympathies is ridiculous, when it's your party that is helping the nazis win again in Ukraine, just like Germany in 1933. I rest my case.

It's funny that in your hatred for the US you throw under the bus the whole of Ukraine and Europe. You sound real balanced in your views.
Unfortunately for you however, the US and its allies are the good guys which now also easily coincides with the morale high ground as well. Better luck next time.
It looks like it hurts quite a lot that Russia is going down once again and will make it's way to the trash heap of history in the 21st century too. Ay, don't be bitter, you can always emigrate there if you are not in Russia already

Constantly calling Ukraine nazis and puppets and whatnot and never calling out Russia, then writing "occasional pro-Kremlin sympathies". With your own words, LOL

 

[Lexicus]

But I've enjoyed playing the devil's advocate. That was my only true intent since the beginning.

evicing occasional pro-Kremlin sympathies

Protip, try to avoid directly contradicting yourself in the same post

it's your party that is helping the nazis win again in Ukraine, just like Germany in 1933.

Even to the extent this is true (which it doesn't seem to be, much) the Russian invasion is what is creating the conditions for the political success of nazis in Ukraine.

I don't like Stepan Bandera or the Azov brigade boys either and I've said so before in these threads. The problem is that in declaring Russia the lesser evil here you are revealing your hand. By any possible measure according to which Ukraine is "nazi" Russia is about ten thousand times worse. Russia is a bandit state and now increasingly taking on the color of a totalitarian dictatorship. "Leftists" so blinded by their hatred of the liberal west that they lose sight of the difference between bad and worse are not really helping anything they claim to want to help by implicitly defending these right-wing dictatorships.

 

[REDY]

"Far-right" doesn't mean neo-nazi.

The Kremlin is not innocent.

So what, you have not so far proved that I've had a pro-Russian agenda.

But I've enjoyed playing the devil's advocate. That was my only true intent since the beginning.

There's no way the US has the moral high ground when the strategy is "kill kill Russia and China at all costs using whatever neo-nazi cannon fodder you can muster". That's just ridiculous. And in the end, it just goes to prove what I always tried to do as a devil's advocate: that whatever evil the Russians have done or present in the current world stage, you're forgetting about the real real elephant in the room which is the US and its predatory interventions, interests, and manifold efforts to muster whatever they can to weaken their geopolitical rivals.

Ukraine is just another instance of that. But nuff said, case in point, and this thread will keep on forever but I just refuse to see Zelensky and the US as the "angels" and the "good guys" of this story.

And really, calling me "racist" for evicing occasional pro-Kremlin sympathies is ridiculous, when it's your party that is helping the nazis win again in Ukraine, just like Germany in 1933. I rest my case.

You are not devils advocate, you are just parroting Russian propaganda. Thats what makes people wonder if you are not just a tool.
If you are truly in the Czech Republic, you can gather information on your own. There are many Ukrainian refugees who can enlighten you.
By the way, you mentioned 1968 and that we have every reason for what you call "Russophobia." Either we have all the reasons or it's not a phobia. Vrbětice were few years ago, since then we were officially in the Russian list of 2 hostile nations.
However, it still doesn't compare to what the Russians have done to the Ukrainians in past, including annexation, gulags, and the Holodomor. And it's nothing compared to what they are doing right now. Just today, the marketplace in Donbass, about 16 dead civilians.
And you would also know that Putins excuses just copy pasted Hitler´s campaing against Czechoslovakia .

 

[keli]

I think the way it works is there are quite some people with minority/victim complexes and once Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022 they were so hopeful, that finally someone would show it to the pompous US and its lackeys in Europe. Even if this meant Ukrainians were thrown under the bus. But what do a few Ukrainian lives matter if the US can be humiliated. You can even do a few mind tricks to convince yourselves that the Ukrainians deserve it (Bandera nazi nonesense), so you don't have to feel bad for their suffering.
I don't think our newest poster hates Ukrainians specifically whatsoever, they are just a vehicle for beating the US.

Then when Russians turned out to be paper tigers and Ukrainians as mighty warriors and reality didn't meet expectation a lot of pent up frustration started to build up. Then these people started to lash out at others for example on this forum spewing incoherent, morally questionable phrases and also being angry at Ukrainians for beating the Russians.

 

[MPorciusCatoCivver]

Pathetic, "occasional Kremlin sympathy". I've shown occasional Kremlin sympathies. And occasional Chinese and Venezuelan and Iranian and even NK sympathies. Doesn't mean I was tied to them. It means nothing.

In the broad tactical game, Russia today is a declining country. A declining birthrate, weak economy, geopolitical isolation and weakness, esp. to NATO on its backdoor.

On the broad scheme of things, Russia needs China to keep up the international clout. It's no longer even a great power, but a secondary one. The threat that Russia poses, broadly, to international peace and the amount of its international influence are nothing if compared to the puppet master way the US does things.

And in the end, I remain convinced that the US is spinning the Ukraine story against non-aligned powers and using Zelensky as a pawn. The Syrians agree, the Venezuelans agree, so what, everybody who just didn't lend his own safety and devliered the car keys naively to the US knows this.

The US is fighting a proxy war against Russia and China in Ukraine and that's all. And Zelensky himself has become an acessory of this geopolitical spin and strategy.

[snip] Moderator Action: Once again I have snipped your off topic comments about the US. Birdjaguar.

 

[keli]

And Zelensky himself has become an acessory of this geopolitical spin and strategy.

How? By not capitulating to the Russians?

 

[saamohod]

And in the end, I remain convinced that the US is spinning the Ukraine story against non-aligned powers and using Zelensky as a pawn.

Or maybe Kremlin propaganda is using you as a pawn.

Your fixation on Zelensky as if he was some sort of sadist usurper like Pootin is another red flag (or should I spell it red_flag). Rest assured, if Zelensky ceases being president of Ukraine, barely anything will change with regard to the general Ukrainian attitude towards the Russian invasion and barbarism. It's not like Ukrainians grudgingly follow his will or something, but otherwise are willing to revolt and join maza rasha. I can't believe you guys seriously mean this.

You and your kind are just recycling the old tropes, but with Zelensky instead of Poroshenko this time.

 

[Remorseless1]

Russia is an authoritarian state, where enemies of the state are routinely imprisoned, executed, or murdered, even those opponents may live in other country. Russia is severely homophobic, works arm in arm with the Russian Orthodox Church, and has invaded numerous small countries since 2006.

And yet it's Ukraine that's fascist. That is as twisted as can be.

 

[REDY]

Dunno about numerous small countries since 2016.

 

[EvaDK]

Biden Administration Announces Additional Security Assistance for Ukraine​

The capabilities in this package, valued at up to $175 million, include:

• Equipment to support Ukraine's air defense systems;
• Additional ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS);
• 155mm and 105mm artillery rounds;
• 81mm mortars systems and rounds;
• 120mm depleted uranium tank ammunition for Abrams tanks;
• Tube-Launched, Optically-Tracked, Wire-Guided (TOW) missiles;
• Javelin and AT-4 anti-armor systems;
• Over 3 million rounds of small arms ammunition;
• Tactical air navigation systems;
• Tactical secure communications systems and support equipment;
• Demolitions munitions for obstacle clearing; and
• Spare parts, maintenance, and other field equipment.

https://www.defense.gov/News/Releas...s-additional-security-assistance-for-ukraine/

The first batch of Abrams M1s are expected in Ukraine around a month from now. Blinken confirmed that the Ukrainians are receiving depleted uranium ammunitions for those.

 

[REDY]

In the broad tactical game, Russia today is a declining country. A declining birthrate, weak economy, geopolitical isolation and weakness, esp. to NATO on its backdoor.

Ok, this is definately not Russian propaganda. But the reality is not that bad. Russia is still largest country in the world with biggest resources and with GDP per capita higher than China. It actually can attract millions of people and become country on par with EU. It just needs mediocre leadership, open market and no war.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: I removed a bunch of posts that were heading in the wrong direction. Please stick with the news folks.

 

[Remorseless1]

Dunno about numerous small countries since 2016.

Fixed it. Dang fingers..

Ok, this is definately not Russian propaganda. But the reality is not that bad. Russia is still largest country in the world with biggest resources and with GDP per capita higher than China. It actually can attract millions of people and become country on par with EU. It just needs mediocre leadership, open market and no war.

Yeah, well, the Russians have a very poor record of having semi-decent political leadership, the same for its economy, and does not hesitate to use its military to solve problems. Corruption and authoritarianism are endemic in Russian history.

 

[FriendlyFire]

(AZOV commanders) Prisioner exchange, no big deal.
Where's the supposed moral high ground that Zelensky and the US have when they're backing neo-nazi stooges that are far worse than the entire history of Russian imperialism since the Middle Ages?

Amazing
Neo Nazis far worse then ENTIRE history of Russian imperialism since the middle ages, and also No big deal

 

[Farm Boy]

What kind of people really think like that ?

They're flat telling you. One coin.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I rest my case.

Sweet.

 

[red_elk]

Unsurprisingly.
I guess Julian is the next one to join the club of "Russian propagandists", after the Pope.

 

[Yeekim]

No, I'm actually a Civ3 hobby player and I live in Czech Republic

Really, IRL, and on my own, I'm far far away from all this crap

Does not compute.

 

[Gedemon]

Unsurprisingly.
I guess Julian is the next one to join the club of "Russian propagandists", after the Pope.

IIRC, he had a long time ago, when he was reporting that the Kherson offensive was failing badly.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Unsurprisingly.
I guess Julian is the next one to join the club of "Russian propagandists", after the Pope.

Not a problem when Russia fires into Romania, or strikes on civilian homes, churches, and hospitals though
Well Its Russia so its alright, when they "miss" by a lot and bomb the wrong country