[RD] Russia Invades Ukraine: The 7th Thread Itch; scratch it here!

[Akka]

Ukraine condemns 'sham' elections in Russian-occupied regions

Many taking part in early polling have been asked to vote in the presence of armed Russian soldiers.

www.bbc.com

This is what Russian liberation looks like.

But USA bad and evil Western imperialism !

General Andrei Mordvichev interview:
- The war will take a long time. There is no point in talking specific dates... If we talk about Eastern Europe, what we have to do
- of course it will take longer...
- Is Ukraine just a stage?
- Yes, exactly. It's just the beginning.

Basically a russian general confirming russian imperial deliries in russian TV. They cant take a couple of bordering regions to Ukraine and want to take over whole eastern Europe.

Ah, so something that will get completely ignored by the tankies.

 

[saamohod]

something that will get completely ignored by the tankies.

I doubt it will. They will blame NATO/USA/West for it as well.

 

[Thorgalaeg]

But USA bad and evil Western imperialism !

Ah, so something that will get completely ignored by the tankies.

I do not expect anything minimally interesting coming from that ilk anyway.

 

[Snowygerry]

Sure, just reflection. Go ahead and pretend you haven't read it.

Switching to insults when having no real argument is usual tactics of our Ukrainian propagandons.

Well as others have noted, those Twitter links are worthless, but with some effort, I gather this from your post there :

"judging from where people look (...), a (...) likely reflection on a car, (...) the rocket(sic) came from the NW..."

Is that what they call "evidence" in Russia ? No wonder you lot are losing this war (and your spacecraft crash on the dark side of the Moon),

it'll be a while before you win another imho.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Well, if you support Russia, you need to be grasping at straws to ward of the notion that the nation you support is killing Ukrainian civilians instead of liberating them as you have convinced yourself.

How else do you square ten thousand dead civilians with being the right side? How else can you accuse Ukraine for oppressing civilians while your country is commiting genocide?

"Wir haben es nicht gewusst" becomes "We knew, but didn't want to face reality."

 

[Snowygerry]

Yes, but you can at least show some intellectual honesty, if only for your own benefit.

At least the German scientists were useful after the war.

And they did not try to pretend the V2s on London or Antwerp were "misfires", or god forbid "Black Flag operations".

 

[red_elk]

Yes, but you can at least show some intellectual honesty, if only for your own benefit.

Reading complaints about intellectual dishonesty from Ukrainian supporters here is beyond amusing.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Yes, but you can at least show some intellectual honesty, if only for your own benefit.

That would mean dealing with the fact your country killed thousands of Ukrainian civilians. The same civilians you claim your country is liberating.

It's easier to go: "wasn't us, was Ukraine." And not think any more about it, because that escape from reality doesn't fly for all of the thousands of civilians killed.

 

[saamohod]

Reading complaints about intellectual dishonesty from Ukrainian supporters here is beyond amusing.

Because supporting Russia in this war out of sheer tribalism and jingoism is an intellectually honest thing to do.

 

[Sarin]

Reading complaints about intellectual dishonesty from Ukrainian supporters here is beyond amusing.

You try to be snarky, but you sound hollow, like someone trying to convince himself.

We've been hearing this kind of rhetoric from Putin, members of his government, Duma and his propagandists for some time. And it is backed by actions-not only the invasion of Ukraine, but also persistent meddling in our politics, hybrid warfare ranging from spreading misinformation to cyberattacks on hospitals and banks by groups affiliated with Russian government and FSB killing two people in the act of sabotage against my country.

For these reasons, I consider Russia clear and present danger and support Ukraine. And there's nothing dishonest about that.

 

[Verbose]

Russia hasn't just mislaid the truth, it is actively denying reality itself at this point.

And this will likely go on until Putin is gone (the way of all flesh in the end, regardless how he actually ends), and then a new ruler in the Kremlin will walk Russia back from the road Putin set it on, and at least try to normalize relations with Europe, and Ukraine – by pinning it all on Putin.

it has some merit. Putin is effectively betting he will outlast both the Ukranian state and the Ukranian people at this point. It's him against them, but Russia is made to help out in that contest.

Something along the lines recently pointed out fx by Mikhail Shishkin is likely:

https://news.italy24.press/world/809957.html

 

[red_elk]

Blindly repeating like broken tape recorder "Russia is losing" is, of course, not "grasping at straws" and "denying reality".

 

[Verbose]

Blindly repeating like broken tape recorder "Russia is losing" is, of course, not "grasping at straws" and "denying reality".

Problem is that the Russian idea of "winning" is "someone else loses more bigly"... That's all it offers.

Actually, the real tragedy for Russia would be to militarily win this war. Then the real misery is going to begin. It just might be that others might become even more miserable than the Russians for it, and by the extremely low standards Russia has set for itself here, that might count as a "win" in Russia.

If Russia militarily defeats Ukraine, and Putin outlasts both the Ukranian state and nation, the cost of that will simply monstrous, and on Russia's head. And then this Russian bloody circus will move on from Ukraine, it at all able to. Until it breaks down somewhere else.

Russia can't win. Even in military victory in Ukraine, there is no peace to be won there, and it will lose sanity in the process, while moving on to its next war. The situation Russia has created for itself really is that insane.

Otoh the coming Russification of the Ukranians, for which Russian military victory is a prerequisite, is something of an order of nuts that in the end, if everyone is lucky, it is the Ukranians who Russify the Russians in the image of the Ukranians. That could be an ok outcome.

 

[Akka]

Blindly repeating like broken tape recorder "Russia is losing" is, of course, not "grasping at straws" and "denying reality".

Russia has already lost. It went in expecting to vassalize all Ukraine in three days, and by now it's highest goal is to keep the half of its initial gain it still occupies by hiding behind its defensive lines, against a foe several times smaller.
That's already defeat, just not a complete one.
And it's certainly much less denying reality than pretending that Russia and its calculated invasion for imperialistic conquest running on deliberate war crimes, terror and tyranny is "in the right".

 

[leif erikson]

Moderator Action: Back to war news please.

 

[keli]

US likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to Ukraine for the first time: Officials

The United States is likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to help Ukraine defend itself, officials tell ABC News.

abcnews.go.com

US likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to Ukraine for the first time: Officials​

The Biden administration is likely to send Ukraine long-range Army Tactical Missile Systems, or ATACMS, to help in its fight to repel the Russian invasion of its territory, according to U.S. officials.

"They are coming," said one official who had access to security assistance plans. The official noted that, as always, such plans are subject to change until officially announced.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Longer range missiles for the win!

 

[REDY]

I still feel frustration, the same story about the aircraft. Why not a year ago? Especially big Western European countries can help much more.

There are also some scandalous claims by Bild about UN offerings to Russia possibly canceling sanctions.

Where are the diplomatics pushes on countries like China and North Korea?

And Musk publicly, proudly claiming that he saved the Russian navy.

This costs people lives and wasting our resources.

 

[Lexicus]

And Musk publicly, proudly claiming that he saved the Russian navy.

This costs people lives and wasting our resources.

It looks like a pure ego move - I read that he thought the attack might start a nuclear war; that strikes me as nonsense and I think Musk probably knows it.

 

[Remorseless1]

US likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to Ukraine for the first time: Officials

The United States is likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to help Ukraine defend itself, officials tell ABC News.

abcnews.go.com

US likely to send long-range ATACMS missiles to Ukraine for the first time: Officials​

The Biden administration is likely to send Ukraine long-range Army Tactical Missile Systems, or ATACMS, to help in its fight to repel the Russian invasion of its territory, according to U.S. officials.

"They are coming," said one official who had access to security assistance plans. The official noted that, as always, such plans are subject to change until officially announced.

Well, its about time, time to start expanding the war Russia started into Russia proper. Hopefully the Ukrainian will hit airfields, supply depots, kazerenes of Russian soldiers and vehicles, and of course, that bridge bridging the gap to Crimea. Russia started this war so any pain inflicted on them is well-earned.