[RD] Russia Invades Ukraine: The 7th Thread Itch; scratch it here!

Its ok because the right will cover the planet in each other's blood again and then none of this will matter for quite some time.
No, it’s not ok. The problem is that the left is living on a completely different planet and is unable to give perspective to the people they supposedly represent. Which is a freaking tragedy in a world where the far right is capturing more and more of the votes and a credible alternative is missing.

If your first thought about the Russian invasion of Ukraine is ‘but what about America’ or ‘maybe Russia is a victim’ then don’t be surprised that the people who are actually attacked (firstly Ukraine, then Europe) will wish you to hell.

Same about the Israeli - Gaza conflict. If you feel much more about Gazans than jews who are harassed in Europe by immigrants don’t be surprised that people will react accordingly. If you don’t represent our (as in European/US citiznens') interests then you are lost and will be left with the feeling of intellectual superiority in solitude. As such, your side is also part of the problem why the far right is rising.
 
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Polish truckers continue to blockade border crossings with Ukraine since Nov. 6.
Looks like "simmering tensions" between Poland and Ukraine, which started over grain exports, continue to deepen.
Some Ukrainian sources reported the blocking already started to affect fuel supplies.

 
Possibly because everyone's been pretty clear since the start of Russia's invasion that it was bad (other than a small handful), meanwhile Palestine's right to exist is continuously seen as a debate. The contexts aren't the same, and as such, treating people's attitudes as comparable (for a gotcha, no less) isn't going to get you very far.

Also, this is a flippant take on peoples' reactions to what's going on in Gaza and the West Bank. But I guess it's okay when you're the one being flippant. It's hard to tell?
You can pretend that having someone coming in the thread just to raise whattaboutism and then flippantly throwin "yeah yeah Russia bad Putin bad" isn't, well, being flippant, but you won't look sincere nor convincing.
 
You can pretend that having someone coming in the thread just to raise whattaboutism and then flippantly throwin "yeah yeah Russia bad Putin bad" isn't, well, being flippant, but you won't look sincere nor convincing.
I think most of us are regular participants at this point. Nobody's really dropping in, though I guess some folks do post for drive bys. But that isn't exactly limited to Estebonrober. It's typically only when it's the "other side" it gets picked up on. But this has been the case since the early threads on Russia illegally invading Ukraine.

As for flippant, either it's bad, or it isn't. It only being bad when some do it, and justified when others do it, makes it useless to point out.
 
I think most of us are regular participants at this point. Nobody's really dropping in, though I guess some folks do post for drive bys. But that isn't exactly limited to Estebonrober. It's typically only when it's the "other side" it gets picked up on. But this has been the case since the early threads on Russia illegally invading Ukraine.

As for flippant, either it's bad, or it isn't. It only being bad when some do it, and justified when others do it, makes it useless to point out.
I wonder why...

do you have example about the opposite, we have a lot of "I'm not pro-Russian, but what about...", but I don't remember any "I'm not pro-Ukrainian but what about...".
 
I wonder why...

do you have example about the opposite, we have a lot of "I'm not pro-Russian, but what about...", but I don't remember any "I'm not pro-Ukrainian but what about...".
Well, exactly. But it's not those sides that are being read into here. It always comes back to "the West" as though its a monolithic block that deserves equal and fair treatment just because it happens to be supporting Ukraine in this instance.

I support Ukraine against Russia. But the moment people try to make it about "the West", I'm not obliged to agree in the slightest. Nor would "the West", if a different country was invading Ukraine.
 
I wonder why...

do you have example about the opposite, we have a lot of "I'm not pro-Russian, but what about...", but I don't remember any "I'm not pro-Ukrainian but what about...".
As you can imagine, in Russian forums there are plenty examples of latter and none of former.
 
As you can imagine, in Russian forums there are plenty examples of latter and none of former.

and aren't they pro-Ukrainian or opposed to the actual Russian government ? are they hiding it under a pretense of "neutrality" ?

Genuinely curious here.
 
and aren't they pro-Ukrainian or opposed to the actual Russian government ? are they hiding it under a pretense of "neutrality" ?

Genuinely curious here.
That would depend on what's following after "but what about..."
This may mean, for example, "I support Russia, but oppose some decisions of the government"
 
And I'm just saying, I notice the very stark difference when it's about Palestinians getting invaded and blown up, where you are full-speed ahead in the outrage and laments about it, and when it's about Ukrainians getting invaded and blown up, when you are pretty flippant and crass.
The only common point seems to be about seizing a pretext to blame the West. What a surprise.
Or, actually...

... not a surprise at all.
Oh give me time I'll get flippant about Palestinians and our ignoring of their plight... the only truly common theme here is my disdain for my nation's foreign policy, its general ignorance of the world at large, and its massive guilt in past atrocities. So yea your finger wagging is pointed at the wrong person.

No, it’s not ok. The problem is that the left is living on a completely different planet and is unable to give perspective to the people they supposedly represent. Which is a freaking tragedy in a world where the far right is capturing more and more of the votes and a credible alternative is missing.

If your first thought about the Russian invasion of Ukraine is ‘but what about America’ or ‘maybe Russia is a victim’ then don’t be surprised that the people who are actually attacked (firstly Ukraine, then Europe) will wish you to hell.

Same about the Israeli - Gaza conflict. If you feel much more about Gazans than jews who are harassed in Europe by immigrants don’t be surprised that people will react accordingly. If you don’t represent our (as in European/US citiznens') interests then you are lost and will be left with the feeling of intellectual superiority in solitude. As such, your side is also part of the problem why the far right is rising.
Actually, to some degree I agree with you here, other than your strawmen and misrepresentations of my positions. I agree about the left but disagree about the solution.

I wonder why...

do you have example about the opposite, we have a lot of "I'm not pro-Russian, but what about...", but I don't remember any "I'm not pro-Ukrainian but what about...".
I'm not pro-Ukrainian but what about the nazi problems here in the US? See? mission accomplished.
 
I can't bring myself to watch actual war footage on Telegram. ISW reports and the daily updates that are censored for Youtube only. It doesn't seem like the front is progressing but there seems to be more and more engagements.
 
The Left is losing ground everywhere across the globe and these people have no idea why.
You do know that Putin's Russia is popular among the right wing, right? Ask Trump or Orban adherents.
 
I can't bring myself to watch actual war footage on Telegram. ISW reports and the daily updates that are censored for Youtube only. It doesn't seem like the front is progressing but there seems to be more and more engagements.

I have this strange theory that the intensity of the fighting is inversely proportional to the quantity of youtube (and similar) videos.

It is to do with the local winners concentrating on fighting, rather than digressing into making videos, and thereby suviving.

And those who decide to make videos, being distracted from fighting are more likely to get killed, so their videos are never published.
 
You do know that Putin's Russia is popular among the right wing, right? Ask Trump or Orban adherents.
This doesn't invalidate what I said. The right will not vote left, those who would more or less vote for the left will not vote them seeing their response to the two major conflicts. There's no one left (literally).
 
Russian MoD reports about 20 Ukrainian drones shot down over Russian territory last night, few of them downed in Moscow suburbs.
Larger wave than usual. Absense of reports about successful drone strikes in Moscow and elsewhere are apparently not for the lack of trying.
 
Russian MoD reports about 20 Ukrainian drones shot down over Russian territory last night, few of them downed in Moscow suburbs.
Larger wave than usual. Absense of reports about successful drone strikes in Moscow and elsewhere are apparently not for the lack of trying.
You're juts posting that because Russia carried out the largest strike on Kiev to date. It's more Russian whataboutism.
 
You're juts posting that because Russia carried out the largest strike on Kiev to date.
Yes, it was most likely Ukrainian attempt to retaliate.
Though I heard the strike against Kiev was unsuccessful, everything was shot down. So they say.
 

Russia is poised to take advantage of political splits in Ukraine​

Politics has returned, but the fighting has gone nowhere
<..>
Cracks have emerged not only on political lines but, most worryingly, between the military and political leadership. Relations between President Volodymyr Zelensky and his commander-in-chief Valery Zaluzhny are understood to be terrible. The differences of opinion were first reported in summer last year. A recent candid interview by The Economist with the general, in which he declared that Ukraine’s war had reached a stalemate, brought that conflict into the open. Mr Zelensky publicly rebuked his general for the headlines. In a later interview he appeared to warn Mr Zaluzhny to stick to military affairs rather than “do politics.”

A senior government source suggests the open conflict in the leadership was a “predictable” result of a stalled counter-offensive operation that had “not gone to plan”. The official says Mr Zaluzhny was possibly unwise to contradict the more optimistic public positions of his president, but few inside the government could quibble with his sober conclusions. A blame game is now underway about who is responsible for the failure. “The politicians are saying their generals are Soviet-trained twits. And the generals are saying the politicians are interfering twits. Victory has many fathers, but no one wants to parent a stalemate.”

Mr Zaluzhny has not declared any political ambitions, and his few steps into the political arena have been anything but deft. That does not mean he poses no threat to Mr Zelensky. The president, a comic performer as recently as 2019, knows how quickly Ukrainian society can make and break its leaders. Internal polling seen by The Economist suggests the president, once lauded for his role in defending the country, has been tarnished by corruption scandals in his government and by concern over the direction of the country. The figures, which date from mid-November, show trust in the president has fallen to a net +32%, less than half that of the still revered General Mr Zaluzhny (+70%). Ukraine’s spychief, Kyrylo Budanov, also has better ratings than the president (+45%).
 
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