Russia or Canada poll

[Pietato]

The half-price lavra plus dance of the aurora/work ethic plus monumentality still make Russia the best tundra civ for me. By turn 80 you can have double-digit cities, each with 20+ production. From there you can go down whatever path you want.

What kind of giant isolated tundra maps do you play, mate?

 

[kb27787]

On deity, I love the surprise war immunity... so I'll say Canada. (amazing if they spawn with tundra camp luxuries).

Russia is strong if you can get away with teching to Lavras though... but on deity going astrology first is always risky.

 

[TCBB]

I know the OP’s question asked who was the better tundra civ, but I think it’s worth adding this:

Often, I don’t spawn anywhere near tundra as either Russia or Canada (I’m convinced there’s something wrong with my RNG). In these situations, I definitely prefer Russia.

While Canada’s immunity to surprise wars means you can be greedy with spamming settlers in order to expand towards the tundra, Russia is still just the better Civ overall regardless of access to tundra (b/cos of extra land upon founding & the flexibility of guaranteed first religion).

 

[mrwho]

I'm Canadian and honestly don't even think Canada should be in the game period, Australia too for that matter, so I go with Mother Russia being better in Tundra or without Tundra for life.

Imagine the backlash if Firaxis decided to balance civs based on their percieved real-world success! The inevitable controversy and outrage over individual civs would be one for the ages...

 

[Haig]

Canada but Russia is my favorite in other aspects.

 

[Socrates99]

Russia is still a top tier civ and will likely breeze to a CV before Canada gets a chance to get much out of their parks. I voted for them because they're just stronger overall.

That being said, Canada can sure build better cities in tundra. Can't deny that.

 

[bbbt]

I still find Canada's abilities a little at odds with each other - you want to improve the tundra but have to built your national parks where there are no improvements.

With Russia, it's basically build along the edge of the tundra for your main cities, and then I'm fine with little 4 pop cities in the deep tundra that will likely just be a lavra and a theater square and then faith bought national parks.

Granted, there's no reason you can't basically do this with Canada as well.

 

[Pietato]

Russia. Canada's music is bad.

 

[Vargas1]

What kind of giant isolated tundra maps do you play, mate?

I typically play on emperor, so I do account for that in terms of likelihood of an early war declaration. But assuming I spawn in tundra (or, even better, half-in/half-out), I settle my first city in tundra, and try to settle my next one or two along the edges to block off other civs. There's usually plenty of space then to fill in the remaining tundra areas with a half dozen other cities, especially since without much food they're not going to need to grow large for a while. But building a quick lavra lets me use them for harbors (if coastal) or campuses/troops if inland.

 

[Archon_Wing]

(I’m convinced there’s something wrong with my RNG).

As of now, I am STILL trying to spawn a Canada start with more than 2 camps and at least some in the tundra. The game I ended up posted had like 10 tundra tiles total on the entire continent, and most of my empire was like grassland or something. :S

 

[Oberinspektor Derrick]

Russia is strong if you can get away with teching to Lavras though... but on deity going astrology first is always risky.

Not really.

 

[Oberinspektor Derrick]

Russia is miles ahead, it's just no contest.
A broken-tier civ, so strong and easy to play compared to other civs that it's about as broken as it gets.
Whenever I pick random civ on deity, spawning as Peter is like playing on King difficulty instead.

 

[Leucarum]

As of now, I am STILL trying to spawn a Canada start with more than 2 camps and at least some in the tundra. The game I ended up posted had like 10 tundra tiles total on the entire continent, and most of my empire was like grassland or something. :S

Try the new non-true start location earth. I played a game there with Canada spawning in Siberia and the yields were eye watering.

 

[Menocchio]

Russia is miles ahead, it's just no contest.
A broken-tier civ, so strong and easy to play compared to other civs that it's about as broken as it gets.
Whenever I pick random civ on deity, spawning as Peter is like playing on King difficulty instead.

See, but playing as Canada on Deity is quite literally like playing on Settler, again because the AI cannot declare war on you. Russia is among the strongest civilisations in the game, but it is not "broken" like Canada is broken, in that basic gameplay elements unintentionally do not apply to it.

 

[Oberinspektor Derrick]

See, but playing as Canada on Deity is quite literally like playing on Settler, again because the AI cannot declare war on you. Russia is among the strongest civilisations in the game, but it is not "broken" like Canada is broken, in that basic gameplay elements unintentionally do not apply to it.

Yeah yeah, Canada om deity is like playing on settler difficulty, absolutely.
Let's talk when we're not playing make believe, huh?
The AI can perfectly declare war once they denounce, which is a very common way the AI goes about on deity.

Canada isnt bad, but not nearly at the level of Russia.
Come back when you're not making things up completely.
Settler, lol.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Russia is miles ahead, it's just no contest.
A broken-tier civ, so strong and easy to play compared to other civs that it's about as broken as it gets.
Whenever I pick random civ on deity, spawning as Peter is like playing on King difficulty instead.

Very true in terms of general power. However, the question is not which Civilizations is better generally, the question is which Civ is better suited for Tundra.

 

[Menocchio]

Yeah yeah, Canada om deity is like playing on settler difficulty, absolutely.
Let's talk when we're not playing make believe, huh?
The AI can perfectly declare war once they denounce, which is a very common way the AI goes about on deity.

Canada isnt bad, but not nearly at the level of Russia.
Come back when you're not making things up completely.
Settler, lol.

Go ahead and try for yourself, and you will find the answer. Our games are no different, so all you have to do is play Canada on Deity to test it out instead of dismissing it out of hand.

 

[bengalryan9]

The AI can perfectly declare war once they denounce, which is a very common way the AI goes about on deity.

Are you sure about that? Because unless it finally changed in the last patch I have NEVER been able to get an AI to use a cassus belli on me as Canada, and I've tested it a lot. Doesn't matter if I denounce everyone I see, antagonize them endlessly, forward settle them, and have literally no standing army... I haven't ever seen an AI declare war on me one time no matter how much I try.

I know what the ability is supposed to do, but I don't think that's how it actually works (at least in my experience).

 

[Leucarum]

Are you sure about that? Because unless it finally changed in the last patch I have NEVER been able to get an AI to use a cassus belli on me as Canada, and I've tested it a lot. Doesn't matter if I denounce everyone I see, antagonize them endlessly, forward settle them, and have literally no standing army... I haven't ever seen an AI declare war on me one time no matter how much I try.

I know what the ability is supposed to do, but I don't think that's how it actually works (at least in my experience).

And we're back to this argument... I've had the AI denounce me early game as Canada twice on deity. Once from Egypt, once from Arabia. Only one of these led to a declaration of war. Canada is my favourite Civ, and those denouncements were rare enough that I remember them happening as something very unusual. I kind of wish I'd kept track of the total number of games played on deity as Canada to be able to give actual stats (since GS I have never had an early game denouncement against Canada).

And honestly, later on if the AI denounces you (i.e. once you do something to annoy them), it probably doesn't matter.

 

[bengalryan9]

And we're back to this argument... I've had the AI denounce me early game as Canada twice on deity. Once from Egypt, once from Arabia. Only one of these led to a declaration of war. Canada is my favourite Civ, and those denouncements were rare enough that I remember them happening as something very unusual. I kind of wish I'd kept track of the total number of games played on deity as Canada to be able to give actual stats (since GS I have never had an early game denouncement against Canada).

And honestly, later on if the AI denounces you (i.e. once you do something to annoy them), it probably doesn't matter.

If it can happen, I'd be happy to hear about it. All I know is that a) every time I try to get an AI to declare on me as Canada, I can't do it, and b) all anybody has ever been able to give me here any time I bring it up is anecdotal evidence ("I think I've seen the AI go to war with Canada before") or a provide a situation that doesn't really prove anything (ie, Canada gets declared on... but only because someone declared on their ally and not actually Canada).

I'm about to start a new game as Canada right now. We'll see if things go any differently this time.