Save/Reload Cheating

[Piemaster]

From reading the forums, it seems like a lot of players cheat by saving the game regularly and then reloading if something goes wrong. This is just a question to find out how many people do it, and if so to what extent.

For those who do save/reload, do you still consider it a real win if you beat a level by doing this? Are you satisfied/proud if you win a game by cheating or is it hollow? Do you think it's right that the AI should be given advantages to compensate for this?

 

[Royal]

I only ONLY reload if my settler is killed by an animal. But if I suffer a military defeat, etc, I do not.

 

[RED1]

I only do it if early in a game something catastropic happens when the other option would be to slowly loose, or never really be able to catch up.

I dont consider it cheating in the same way entering a code to give you 10k gold is cheating. Although thinking about it now, i would consider it cheating to enter a code and see 10 turns into the future.......

hmmmmm, maybe time to rethink.

Although in the hints when the game is loading im sure it gives the keyboard shortcut to load a game, what other reason could this be for?

Looking forward to seeing the results of this poll.

 

[Monkus]

I only ONLY reload if my settler is killed by an animal. But if I suffer a military defeat, etc, I do not.

Well yeah because that's game over anyway! That would be unlucky to have a lion put next to you though! Build quickly because the lions run away from cities!

 

[CorruptAssassin]

good thread, there was something similar to this in the R:TW boards.

No, I dont use the save/load exploit in this game, or any other strategy title for that manner. It simply takes the fun away; where's the fun and challenge when you simply reload after making a mistake? People also do it to 'predict' the future; by saving the game, running a few turns, and seeing what the AI does. Then they can reload, and exploit the AI, already knowing what they are going to do.

 

[Teutonic_Knight]

I have used it once, when my settler was killed by a bear. I try to complete a game from start to finish, fair and sqaure, even if I am lagging behind.

 

[Bast]

I used to do it with Civ III but with Civ IV I can't be bothered any more. It's just a game and it's better to leave everything as it is rather than tamper with it.

Besides, it's a big waste of time. I play games to play. Not just to win.

Also, I used to only do it if I'm at war and I want to make sure that I'm not losing too much.

Now I don't care anymore.

 

[Psyringe]

People who save/reload when things go wrong will never have this great feeling of accomplishment that you get when you *still* win the game.

That said, I'm not religious about it. I *do* use save/reload occasionally in my current games, mostly to learn the effects of different actions, which helps me master the game. I don't consider this a "pure" win then however.

I also sometimes save/reload when, for example, I sometimes falls on my keyboard and I lose three units because of that. But I take care to reproduce all steps I took since the last save then.

 

[Byrath]

I only reload when I am unsure of how something functions in the game. In that case, I specifically save my game prior to taking an action, and will reload that save if it works differently than I expected. As an example, I was unsure of what would happen if I used a spy to sabotage production and she got caught, so I saved first. She did get caught, and I recieved a -1 to my relations with the Chinese, which seemed fair, so I played on.

 

[Paalikles]

Iron man all the way.

Which means, only save on quit, and no reload.

 

[King Flevance]

I occassionally do but not for the sake of cheating. I rarely save because, well if I have something bad happens, it happens. Maybe next time I will be paying attention.
However, when I do reload it is not to cheat but rather, I get mad about something and quit that game. Sometimes, though rarely I will go back to look and get some ideas about where I was messing up. (usually this save was from WAY before I got screwed over or messed up.
Yeah, I get further on the second time around. I would be stupid if I didn't but I am always aware I cheated. Even though the game never railroads the same way because the AI takes different steps this time too. If I save closer to the time of defeat, I always delete as, the computer is already handicapped by programmed intelligence. I get no satisfaction out of exploiting its programming for a false victory if I can do 1 small thing to change the outcome.
This is maybe 1/20 games though. For the most part, its from beginning to end.

 

[Sadan01]

Civ4: Never saved and reloaded except when the game crashed (and that was using the auto-save to reload!)
When I first started playing Civ3, I would save and reload (with preserve random seed off) so I could learn the game. This become very much "un-fun" very quickly so I stopped the save and reloading and also turned the preserve random seed option back on again. It makes you a much better player to learn by your mistakes.

In Civ4, I have never saved and reloaded (except for the crashes occasionally) and there is really no point, at least for battles as there is no random seed option to turn on or off.

If making a mistake with say a settler and you lose it to barbs, then I just grin and wear it. That is all part of the game and if you continually save and reload when you make a mistake, you are not learning the game properly. Learn from your mistakes, not from just reloading and doing something different.

Even though it is nice to win at the end, winning is not everything. Some of the most memorable games I've played on Civ1, Civ2, and Civ3/C3C are games that I have LOST. Yes, I have lost them but the fact is, those games will always stand out as I didnt cheat and I tried my hardest to win (even taking 1 hour a turn at times) but I just wasn't able to stop a runaway AI or I got my ass kicked at the end (thinking that I could take on every Civ on the map!). I play Civ to have fun and to think about strategy etc; winning is just the consolation prize at the end.

Edit: Oh and I am not saying that when I win a game, it is because I cheated! Just reread that last paragraph and I think I need to go to bed. It is 12:10am in Sydney. *Yawn*

 

[kaslks75]

I only reload a game in the few cases where I had intended to do something before the end of a turn, and due to the fact that I'm getting older and more forgetful - I press the end-turn button without doing what I had originally intended to do! I have actually started keeping a potsy-note handy to write myself reminders...LOL!

 

[mzprox]

In my last game (emperor level) Montezuma has declared war on me and in the same turn He put 22 unit next to my capital from his galleons. I had to decide to start a new game or reload (I won that game )

 

[Flak]

I have no problem with anyone reloading or myself reloading the game after a saving before a critical moment. It's just that for Civ III the turns would sometims take ages. That alone is enough to break one of the habit. I just wanted to get through turns. For Civ IV unless it's something blithely stupid like an animal killing my settler, I'll just take my medicine and make the best of it.

By the way, this isn't really cheating in my opinion. It's just how some people like to play on their own machines to make the game fun. If it's their machine and they spent their money on the game, who cares how they play it as long as they have fun with the game and are in line to buy the next installment?

 

[Velvet-Glove]

I will reload a game if, as I hit the 'end turn' button, I remember that I have forgotten to do something important e.g. removing a worker from the border of a civ I have just declared war on so they don't grab him. If my intention was to do that action anyway I don't think it's a serious cheat to go back and fix an oversight like this.

 

[Junuxx]

In Civ1, you couldn't reload without quiting, so I didn't.

In Civ2, reloading took 0,1 second, so I did it all the time.

In Civ3, loading took at least 10 seconds, up to a minute, so I started out not doing it, did it more and more, until it wasn't fun anymore and I put random seed back on.

In Civ4, loading takes forever and I haven't reloaded at all, yet. Iron Man indeed.

 

[Chuda]

It depends...

If I'm playing on a higher difficulty, then, yes I use the save/load quite a lot. Let's face it; the computer on these levels is cheating like mad, so I see it as a legitimate tool to redress the balance.

Not that it's helping though. Even with blatant exploitation of save/load I'm still getting absolutely wasted on Prince difficulty, every... single... time.

On the other hand, if I feel the AI is playing fair, then so will I. Last night I completed a Noble game via the space race victory, with no save/load cheating at all. 26 hours of play, and I was only on session 6 at the end (and that was with session 5 crashing on me after 2 turns! - Windows threw a wobbly). Score; 18K+, is that good?

Couple of interesting points...

1) Why is it that I can absolutely walk Noble difficulty - won it by 1852, no other Civ had even thought about the possibility of starting a space ship yet.

But, if I move up just one difficulty level to Prince, I get wasted every time. I usually make it to about one third of the way through, and then suddenly, several other Civs declare war on me and they turn up with massive armies that I haven't a hope in hell of defeating, and it's all over.

2) I just started another Noble game - there are things that I could have done better; I want to try and get all religions in all cities, for example. Anyway, I noticed that the Spanish started very close to me, but that they seemed to have managed to build 2 warriors quicker than I could.

So, I restarted, entered World Builder and dropped a spy on them on turn 1.

They built their city, started to build their warrior and got a 12 resource bonus! Hang-on, I thought the computer didn't cheat on Noble? What are the quicksave/quickload keys again?

 

[Panda]

Less than when I first got Civ 4. Normally after I hammered the keyboard once something went really badly.

 

[VoxDei]

I almost never do it. Unfortunately, I have problems stopping myself when something's really gone to hell. Not a simple military defeat, but in my last game I used it twice when trying to sabotage production of an enemy's last SS part (justified that by the fact that I hadn't realised that the reason it wasn't letting me was because I didn't have enough money, and still didn't manage it anyway), and in my current game I used it when I sent my first worker off alone and he got killed by a lion - stupid way to seriously disadvantage myself. Both times I felt bad for doing it.

But in the normal course of a game, no.