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SCENARIO: The Napoleonic Wars

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Creation & Customization' started by Jon Shafer, Sep 8, 2002.

  1. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

    Joined:
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    2,102
    Location:
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    4th Project update:

    I've completed some major work regarding the map in the past couple days. What I've done is eliminated roads altogether (hold on), and given each city a people 'resource' underneath, which allows each city to be able to produce certain nationality units depending upon what kind of 'people' resource is tucked away underneath each city. This allows the British to create 'German Line Infantry' in Hanover and Bremen, but no where else (since the 'German' resource isn't present anywhere else that Britain controls). It took forever to think out, and another forever to create, and a 3rd forever to make it work. In addition to that, I eliminated jungle, transforming into a sort of 'pseudo-road' which looks identical to grassland, but gives the same sort of bonus as if it were a road. Check out my thread in the general forum about '1-Tile Road Suggestions' (or whatever I named it) to see what I've done regarding that.

    I'm working on a completed unit list, with unit strengths and types and all that fun stuff. Expect that fairly soon in the next update. I've gotten all of the units to work in the game (without it crashing) so far, so that's a step in the right direction. Now I just need the units to stick into the scenario. ;)

    I've changed the standard 'mine' graphic into a small village sort of thing. It looks more accurate, and kind of cool also. :)

    I think that's about it for now. More in the next update.

    Project Details:

    So yes, this is my next project. I originally planned to do this one first, but I got a case of Civil War fever, and the rest is history. This time around though, I plan on spending more time on working on the scenario. For my Civil War scenario, I simply wanted to be the first one to get out a 'good' complete large-scale scenario, but now I want to make a 'great' scenario, no matter how long it takes. :) That coupled with the fact that I have about an hour to myself every day means that the pace for the creation of this scenario will be much slower.

    The current list of civs in the scenario is: Prussia, Russia, Spain, France, Britain, Austria, the Ottoman Empire, Sweden, Poland, Northern European Minors (Denmark, Portugal, Holland, etc.), Northern German Minors (Saxony, Kleves, Mainz, etc.), Southern German Minors (Bavaria, Wurzburg, Baden, etc.), Northern Italian Minors (Venice, Romagna, Tuscany, Switzerland, etc.), Papal States, African Minors (Libya, Algiers, Tunis, Morocco), and (of course) Barbarians (bah). I had to fit it within the 16-civ limit, and I think that was the best way I could do so.

    Currently, the basic unit list is like so (most infantry/cavalry units have a 1792 and 1805 variation):

    Code:
    Line Infantry 1792 (Basic infantry)
    Line Infantry 1805
    Grenadiers 1792 (Heavy, veteran infantry formations)
    Grenadiers 1805
    Light Infantry 1792 (Skirmishing light infantry formations)
    Light Infantry 1805
    
    Dragoons 1792 (Standard cavalry like the one in Civ 3)
    Dragoons 1805
    Cuirassiers 1792 (Guys on horses with big swords that ride fast)
    Cuirassiers 1805
    Hussars 1792 (Fast cavalry forces with swords, used mainly for skirmishing and scouting)
    Hussars 1805
    
    3 Pounder
    6 Pounder
    9 Pounder
    Howitzer
    
    1st Rate Ship of the Line
    2nd Rate Ship of the Line
    3rd Rate Ship of the Line
    Frigate
    Sailed Transport
    Keep in mind all land units require 1 population point, as they are rather large formations for the time.

    I've placed all of the nations navies on the map now. I'll give you the numbers that each has of each type of ship. If I don't name a unit, then it doesn't have any ships. The total warship count at the end doesn't include transports.

    Naval Disposition

    * All total counts do not include Transports
    ** Nations that have one fleet have it located outside their capital city

    Code:
    Nation			1st Rate	2nd Rate	3rd Rate	Frigate		S Transport	Total*
    
    BRITAIN			6		15		9		15		7		46 ships
    
    	London		3		7		4		6		7		20
    	Brest		2		4		4		5		1		15
    	Gibraltar	1		4		2		4		2		11
    
    N. E. MINORS		2		14		11		11		3		38 ships
    
    	Copenhagen	1		5		4		4		1		14
    	Amsterdam	1		5		4		4		1		14
    	Lisbon		0		4		3		3		1		10
    
    SPAIN			2		10		8		10		3		30 ships
    
    	Valencia	2		8		6		7		2		23
    	Naples		0		2		2		3		1		7
    
    FRANCE			2		10		8		8		4		28 ships
    
    	Le Havre	1		5		3		3		2		12
    	Bordeaux	1		2		2		2		1		7
    	Toulon		0		3		3		3		1		9
    
    RUSSIA			0		6		6		7		3		19 ships
    
    	St. Petersburg	0		4		3		5		1		12
    	Sevastopol	0		2		3		2		2		7
    
    OTTOMANS**		0		4		5		5		2		14 ships
    
    SWEDEN**		0		2		1		3		1		6 ships
    All cities and improvements are placed on the map currently. I'm tweaking cities a bit, to modify production and population values to try and make them more accurate, along with tweaking city names.

    Here's the current terretorial breakdown.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Stormbringer

    Stormbringer The Brick and The Rose

    Joined:
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    I think you should leave Sweeden alone, and merge Holland and Denmark into one civ. Denmark and Holland had pretty much the same goals during the time so it makes sence, but Sweeden fought wars against denmark, and making them one civ doesn't make sence.
     
  3. CivGeneral

    CivGeneral Valkyrie Cybernetic Grand General

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    Smoking Mirror's Napoleonic Riflemen would go great with this Scenario :D.
     
  4. ViceRoy

    ViceRoy of Brave New World

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Brave New World
    I suggest you wait for that Smoking Mirror infantry and Dark Sheer colonial musketman.

    You should get also some new cavalry that would fight with lances and swords. There are some of my previes of them in "early industrial units"-thread.

    I would like to see unit that would combine infantry/cavalry/artillery in to one unit. No, I don't mean like army but like unit that could look like the industrial leader unit but when attacking the animations would be those Inf/cav/art attacking.

    If you give that unit high attack/defence and also high shield and possible population cost it would represent real army. Giving it "leader" option will also give chance that it will be named from the great leaders option bar so leaders like Wellington and Napoleon would be there. I think this would be nice add for the scenario and these "army" units would be mostly used to battle the most important battles when other units could concentrate into scouting etc.

    I suggest making also "homeguard" units that can be produced in cities but are just defending units without the chance to move (immobile).

    I think you need some more units though as there are only few for the period.
    Also one problem is the tech tree. What it would describe in the scenario. Same goes to the buildings/wonders. Otherwise your scenario is brilliant idea and it would be nice to see if you could get someone help you and maybe get it ready someday.
     
  5. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    I would make Sweden its own civ, but unfortunately I have a severe lack of slots to put civs into. That means I had to lump Denmark, Sweden (ouch), and even Holland (spare me Lord) into one civ to allow for a more diverse map-wide group. Of course, those civs aren't set in stone, so I may end up changing things around a bit, and if I did make one more 'independent' civ, it will certainly be Sweden.

    Those are the two units I've been waiting for don't worry. :goodjob Just take a look at DS' Musketman thread, I'm drooling all over the carpeting watching and trying to be patient. ;)

    As far as the units, I'll certainlly take much more time to tweak and add and modify than I did on my last scenario. Here's the current list:

    Musketman
    Rifleman
    Imperial Guard
    Dragoon
    Lancer

    3 Pounder
    6 Pounder
    9 Pounder
    12 Pounder
    Howitzer

    20 Gun Frigate
    30 Gun Frigate
    40 Gun Frigate
    60 Gun Ship of the Line
    80 Gun Ship of the Line
    100 Gun Ship of the Line
    120 Gun Ship of the Line
    Galleon (Transport)

    I may (probably) end up reducing the # of artillery and naval ship choices available (who really needs 6 kinds of warships at once?), but I wanted to start off diverse. The Rifleman unit represents the crude form that only the British used in the Peninsular Campaign, not Civil War era riflemen or anything. I know that the Imperial Guard unit could probably be simply considered elite Musketmen, but it's just more fun to have an actual unit named that. :) Any other ideas for units would be appreciated. :)
     
  6. W.i.n.t.e.r

    W.i.n.t.e.r Frozen!

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  7. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    At the time, Napoli, aka 'The Kingdom of the Two Sicilies' was under direct Hapsburg (Spanish) control at the time, so all the land in Italy up to the Papal States will belong to Spain at the start of the scenario. If it were possible to make the Neopolitans allied to Spain at the start, then I would do it, but I don't see that happening, and I'm out of civ-slots as it is. :p
     
  8. Civanator

    Civanator Chieftain

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    hey, when i'm done with the mercenary hoplite i could probably help with the cannons, and maybe the guys with the guns. ;)
     
  9. ViceRoy

    ViceRoy of Brave New World

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    But is example Portugal more important to be there as civilization than Sweden?

    And what years exactly your are going to use for this scenario?

    Also that many ships and artillery are in mind unnecessary. I would but more focus into "national units" that would have little bit different stats than just lot of general units that are available to all.
    Also is in your scenario possible be played with any of the civs or just with France example?
     
  10. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    Thanks Civanator, that would be a great help, since I'm graphically inept, but unfortunately quite ambitious. ;)

    Good point ViceRoy.
    *Switches Portugal with Sweden*
    Portugal is now part of the Northern European Minors (who else could I add them to?), while Sweden is independent.

    The scenario will start in 1792 (or 4000 BC, theoretically :rolleyes:), and go until whenever. It will be playable by anyone (which must be set in the editor by changing players though), and I will make '.SAV scenarios' for each major power, which will have all build orders done, all units fortified, and diplomacy tweaked a bit for a more realistic feel.

    I know what you're saying about the artillery and ships. I'll certainly cut down, I just want to start broad, and see what values work best. I'll probably reduce the numbers to around 3 or so each in the end. I'll also have different nationalities of units, i.e. "French Patriots", which will be available to only France at the beginning of the scenario who fight very well, but are later replaced with regulars.

    Also, another thing I would like assistance with is the leaders of each country. I could look them up myself, but I'm lazy and I'm sure you guys out there can help me. :) I'll probably just start France with Napoleon, since I can't change it later on, and he's what the entire scenario is about anyways. :p
     
  11. W.i.n.t.e.r

    W.i.n.t.e.r Frozen!

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    Spain at the time was under the reign of Carlos IV of the Borbon Family, NOT Habsburg! His son, Fernando VII would succeed him as king of Spain after the fall of Joseph Bonaparte !!!
     
  12. W.i.n.t.e.r

    W.i.n.t.e.r Frozen!

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    I would also give Portugal to England as their alliance was very close- to the extend that the Portugese Islands were defended sololy by British forces after the "War of Oranges" between Spain and Portugal. This is comparable to the Polish army fighting under British command during WWII.
     
  13. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    Okay, - Hapsburgs then. :p
     
  14. Gorgoroth

    Gorgoroth Chieftain

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    Hmmmmmm not bad scenario idea, too bad that I dont really like the 1800s era.
     
  15. W.i.n.t.e.r

    W.i.n.t.e.r Frozen!

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    The Habsburgs rule Austria !!!!!!!!!!! - another reason why it doesn't make sense to put Spain under Habsburg rule (apart of historical inaccuracy)
     
  16. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    I meant as far as Spain. Spain and Austria were under the same leadership for the most part for a certain period of time, and a lot of Flanders and some other locations switched between Spain and Austria every so often.

    Don't worry about it. :p Spain controls the Kingdom of the Two Sicilies, Austria controls a few spots in northern Italy and Flanders, and everyone goes home happy. :p
     
  17. Civanator

    Civanator Chieftain

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    Trip, the colonial musket mane is out!!! just thought i'd tell you. ;)
     
  18. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    Don't worry, I've already got it working. ;)
     
  19. Smoking mirror

    Smoking mirror Ships Captain

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    Trip, have you thought very hard about the size of the map? I think a standard size europe map would be a much better idea, turns on a giga map would take for ever. On random civ II maps, there is about 70% water, where as a map of europe only has about 20-30% water at most, so a standard europe map is actualy quite big (I tried it the other day, and a standard map has plenty of room for historical cities and such like as well as all the important islands.

    On a different note, Iv'e just finished the Napoleonic rifleman, I'm going to post it in a few minuites.
    Heres a preveiw;
     

    Attached Files:

  20. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

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    On the side note, thanks for the unit. ;)

    Don't worry about the size and turn length. Not the entire map is covered in cities, and the ones that are there are pretty well spaced out. France has about 20 or so cities, Britain has 15 (including Gibraltar), and each of the minor country civs has about 6 or 8. I may end up making a smaller map version, but it wouldn't have the detail I wanted.
     

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