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Scout scout

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by _Dachannien, Aug 13, 2014.

  1. _Dachannien

    _Dachannien Chieftain

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    This is probably a noob question, but I'm asking it anyway. I've seen a lot of people on here favor a starting build order that starts with two scouts. Is this a necessity at the highest difficulty levels?

    Since I've only been working on my first game on Emperor, and will probably be at that level for some time, is it as important on that difficulty? Stealing a worker is a longer proposition on Emperor as compared to Immortal/Deity since the AI doesn't get any free starting workers, so if worker theft is the primary motivation for having the extra scout out there, it seems like I'd be better off using those turns to start a worker (i.e., scout, start worker, shrine, finish worker, do something else, and two settlers once my cap hits size 4 or so). Does that make sense, or is the second scout still that important?
     
  2. neilkaz

    neilkaz King

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    I'm a big fan of building two scouts first on any map where you start on a decent sized landmass with other civs and CS. It is so important to grab ruins and meet CS quickly and meeting other civs is usually good as well. I've been playing some on Small Continents with raging barbs for a change of pace and even then the 2nd scout is usually useful.

    Now in last night's game I ended up on a small island all by myself except for one CS. OK I didn't need the 2nd scout, but didn't know it at the time. Obviously, I had to go quickly to optics and by then, having a 2nd scout was useful.

    A decent starting position should be able to build a scout in 5 turns, so your 2nd scout should be done about the time pottery is and you can then build the shrine if needed/desired for a pantheon.

    I really couldn't imagine not starting with 2 scouts on a standard 8 player Pangaea map.
     
  3. HelloGoodbye123

    HelloGoodbye123 Warlord

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    Apart from getting ruins, meeting cs, meeting other civs and stealing workers, scouts can be placed in key locations to be on the lookout for enemy invasion, specially when they gain the +1sight through a few barb experience farming, I tend to have 2 for those reasons
     
  4. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Scout earn you gold, increase happiness through wonder discovery, can give you a free pantheon, ruins, steal worker... the list goes on.
     
  5. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    Scout with sight promotions can also be camped in a strategic location to keep barbs from spawning and pillaging trade routes.
     
  6. Mutineer

    Mutineer Deity

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    In some cases I build 3 scout as first 3 items. ( land mass big or some scout got used for worker stealing/escorting)
     
  7. BlackWizard

    BlackWizard King

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    If I go tradition I usually build 2 scouts in row because there is no need for monument. If going liberty or honor it's usually scout, monumet,scout. I usually skip shrine if there isnt anything super tempting.
     
  8. budweiser

    budweiser King of the Beers

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    Where are the huts?

    They are all over the place. After you settle, send your Warrior out in one direction. Keep going 2 or maybe 3 turns until you see the hut. Now circle around either clockwise or counter clockwise. There should be tons of huts out there an equidistance from the cap. If all you want is huts, you can get 5 or 6 no problem. A scout first can clear the other side while the warrior finishes his side.

    But, I have been going worker first a lot lately because I have been doing AH>BW.
     
  9. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    This is map type specific, (e.g. on both large islands & tiny islands you don't need a scout at all for most civs), but most people play on a map type where one or two scouts is always useful.
    And yes, if you build two scouts its best to build them back to back to get the most use out of them.
     
  10. tetley

    tetley Head tea leaf

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    On tiny island maps as Polynesia, I like scout-scout-scout-scout. :)
     
  11. _Dachannien

    _Dachannien Chieftain

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    Okay, I'll give it a shot in my next few games and see how it goes. Thanks all :D
     
  12. Memoryjar

    Memoryjar Emperor

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    I would say, this a necessity as we progress in difficulty levels. It's a run for discovering first ruins, CS, other civs, good spots to settle.
     
  13. dragonxxx

    dragonxxx King

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    Even without the steals, getting 2 scouts is good. You get more early gold by meeting CSs, you get more ruins and you meet the other civs faster. Scouts can die from barbs too.
    And its timing is nice,as the second one is ready when you are done with pottery, so just go for two. Its a good habit to start doing that at emperor :)
     
  14. deniz6

    deniz6 Chieftain

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    My earlier post in another forum: "Here is my Shoshone strategy I use in my games (Continents-Emperor-Huge-Domination): In addition to the pathfinder in the beginning, I produce extra two and buy one as soon as I have 220 gold. With a total of 4 pathfinders, it is highly probable that you will get your pantheon belief in 20th turn or a bit later and that you will have three composite bowmen. Production queue is as follows: pf, pf, pf, monument, granary, Stonhenge, Temple of Artemis, Pyramids, (I pick Liberty and first get my worker ). Sun God belief (+1 food Food for each Banana, Citrus, and Wheat resource) plus granary result in a city which grows very fast. Since you don't interrupt its growth with settlers you will have lots of hammers. The only disadvantage is founding cities rather late in the game but once you start to found them your civilization expands unbelievably."
     
  15. dragonxxx

    dragonxxx King

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    that's kind of joke, right? That's pretty much awful way to play this out. You can get away with this awful build order on low levels, but I don't see a reason to suggest such joke strategy.
     
  16. asura_

    asura_ Chieftain

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    Fun is not in the rigid build order, fun is in winning while playing 'like a fool'. Just do what you want.
     
  17. MrDumpstertrash

    MrDumpstertrash Chieftain

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    Do this. If you learned anything from this topic this is priority #1
     
  18. deniz6

    deniz6 Chieftain

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    Well, I don't assert that this is the ideal strategy for the Shoshone and you need to be lucky to get the wonders. However, there have been times it worked quite well on the emperor level with proper map conditions. Nowadays, I am trying the Babylon with 5 scouts.
     
  19. consentient

    consentient Domination!

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    Now that I'm starting to win on Deity a bit more often, I have kinda settled into 2 different play styles depending on map.

    If I want to do a tradition thing, then it's Scout x3, Settler, Archer. Liberty is still Scout, Monument, Scout.

    I only ever build a 3rd scout on liberty if I sacrifice one stealing a worker.
     

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