Second cities

[amadeus]

Not to be confused with Second City the comedy troupe and TV show, what are the second cities of the world?

New York, London, Paris, Tokyo, they all take the spotlight. But what’s the #2 city in each country? Here I think Osaka is the undisputed #2 cultural and business hub of the country, probably Los Angeles for the USA.

How about other countries like Canada, Italy, Germany, etc.? I think one obvious ones would be St. Petersburg in Russia.

 

[PhroX]

The UK's second city is generally taken as Birmingham.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Canada? Well, Ottawa is the capital, but nobody thinks of it as our first city. That's just for politicians and Remembrance Day ceremonies at the National War Memorial. Actual first place goes to Toronto.

The second city, depending on which half of the country people live in and what language they usually speak, would either be Montreal or Vancouver.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

In Italy, Milan or Florence? Barcelona for Spain? I'm speaking as a foreigner to both countries of course

 

[amadeus]

Rotterdam, Krakow?

Capital cities are kind of interesting. Would Ankara count as Turkey’s “first” city, or would that honor go to Istanbul as I imagine it would?

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Ankara wouldn't even count as a second city

 

[Gorbles]

Manchester or Birmingham for England. Glasgow for Scotland (the good and the bad), but maybe (maybe) Aberdeen or Inverness. Wales has a few, Wrexham's gained a bit of popularity due to the football, but Swansea or Newport are more identifiable (or even Bangor).

I'm separating these out on purpose! Good luck suggesting an English city to a Scot, or vice versa

 

[Tee Kay]

I live in one! Melbourne, second to Sydney in Australia.

Melbourne is about to overtake/has already overtaken Sydney in population (depending on how you count) but most big corporations are headquartered in Sydney, the national media has a very Sydney-centric lense, more international flights arrive in/depart from Sydney, the Opera House is there, houses are 50% more expensive in Sydney, infrastructure projects in Sydney are prioritised, etc.

Melbourne has the larger container port, the bigger main stadium, and generally a higher ranking in global 'liveability' indices.

The other country I've lived in is Thailand, and it's harder to identify the "second city" there, as Bangkok is arguably the world's most extreme primate city. Chiang Mai is the lead candidate, as the second largest urban area after Bangkok, but with less than a tenth of the population. It's in the far north, which is not actually a populous region outside of Chiang Mai. Khorat (3rd in population) and Khon Kaen (4th) are in the more populous Northeast region. Khorat benefits from proximity to Bangkok, Khon Kaen is more central for Northeasterners and is where big organisations have their HQs.

Now for some countries I haven't lived in:

United States: so many honourable mentions but Los Angeles still stands above the rest

Canada: Montreal over Vancouver, as Anglo-French relations/differences still have an outsized impact on politics in that country as I understand it.

Russia: undisputedly St Petersburg. The vibes I get is that Moscow and St Petersburg enjoy First World living standards while the rest of Russia has barely changed or regressed since Soviet times.

Italy: Milan, as that's where the money is.

Germany: probably Frankfurt, or Rhine-Ruhr if you count it as a single city. Actually, as I understand it, Berlin may be the capital but it's otherwise so poor that it is arguably second.

France: I believe this would be Lyon. It's the only other city in France covered by a special territorial authority.

Turkey: Ankara, second to Istanbul

New Zealand: Wellington, another case of the capital being second

Indonesia: has to be Surabaya.

Malaysia: two candidates: George Town (Penang) or Johor Bahru, just across the causeway from Singapore. I think George Town still has a higher prestige but Johor Bahru is increasingly where the money is.

Vietnam: undeniably Saigon/Ho Chi Minh City

Japan: has to be Osaka

Taiwan: Kaohsiung is generally recognised as second to Taipei. It's the main port, and arguably the cultural capital of the Taiwanese Hokkien majority, compared to Taipei which developed later and had more Mainlander influence as the capital.

China: Shanghai of course

 

[Yeekim]

For Estonia, it is Tartu.
Second largest & has had an university since 1632.

 

[Tee Kay]

Rotterdam, Krakow?

Netherlands: well, is Randstad one city, or four?

If they're separate cities, The Hague can also claim to be second as that's where the government is based.

Poland: It's Katowice. Including its suburbs, it's larger than Warsaw. Edit: Poznan is also a contender.

Canada: Montreal over Vancouver, as Anglo-French relations/differences still have an outsized impact on politics in that country as I understand it.

Another point in favour of Montreal: I hadn't realised how small Vancouver is. It's the same size as Brisbane at 2.6 million when I was imagining a city of 4 million. Montreal is 4.3 million.

 

[lymond]

I'd think that population would not always be a determining factor, though a big one. But yeah, LA is second to NY in that regard. But is LA more important than DC?

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

No one mentioned Wroclaw for Poland yet??

 

[Smellincoffee]

Chicago has long billed itself the Second City, though that was probably truer in previous decades.

For Germany, would Frankfurt am Main be a good guess?

 

[Farm Boy]

There is just so much screwed up with Chicago dragging it down. It hurts to watch. I blame single party rule and aldermanic privilege as primary causes. They've sold even the things that are nailed down, like the toll roads and the parking spaces. Hell, Cook County this past year saw a median increase of property taxes for the south and southwest suburbs, containing cities like Harvey and Ford Heights, of 19%(so has ABC(subsidiary of Disney) been reporting). It hoses up the whole state.

 

[Hygro]

I too reluctantly give it to Los Angeles.

Chicago crossed my mind, but nope. Houston, but more nope. Boston for historical reasons, but super nope. A united Bay Area? Nope — foreigners don't even give us #1 in our state. Dallas/Miami/Seattle? Nope. DC? Not a chance. We start getting way into the weeds with claims of being second only to NYC. Detroit, Bmore, St Louis, the Twin Cities... Denver lol.

But Chicago is #3 and could be #2.

 

[Samson]

IN the UK everyone says Birmingham, but I do not know what Birmingham is. London is demarcated by the M25 in my book, Manchester and Liverpool have the M6 to divide them, but I never know where you draw the borders of Birmingham that is bigger than Leeds, Manchester and Glasgow but is not the whole of the West Midlands. Here is a map that gives a border, but surely Sutton Coldfield is not Birmingham?

Spoiler Birmingham? :

 

[EnglishEdward]

While it could be argued that Birmingham is England's second city, I don't regard it as the UK's second city.

I regard Edinburgh as the UK's second city.

After that there is Cardiff and Belfast.

 

[Narz]

probably Los Angeles for the USA.

So many better choices

 

[Gorbles]

Here is a map that gives a border, but surely Sutton Coldfield is not Birmingham?

It's very much considered Brummie territory!

 

[Samson]

It's very much considered Brummie territory!

I would have given Solihul to Birmingham before Sutton Coldfield, but perhaps just because of the motorways and I have driven on them much more than actualkly gone there.