Given some of the current conversations I've seen about various leaders on the forums, I thought it might be time to "take the pulse" a bit and determine which civs everyone thinks could use a second leader, which leader you want, and why. I'll start off with a few caveats. My idea of what constitutes an actual leader have changed over time. I used to be more persnickety about which leaders ought to be included, obsessing over who was a "real" leader of the civ. I have since come to the conclusion that the things that matter most are whether a given leader is iconic, representative of their culture, and fun in terms of their depiction and personality. I've left aside most other considerations. In determining whether a given civ needs a second leader at all, my main considerations are whether the current leader adequately represents my expectations for how that civ should act, or if there is a different facet of that civ that is significant enough to be represented by a second leader. I think the Pericles/Gorgo differences are a great example of this. Now to get down to a just a few ideas for civs needing second leaders. Note: we're already expecting that Spain may get Isabella sometime down the road. 1. India The obvious place to start. A lot of people seem to be suffering from Gandhi fatigue. My main suggestion would be Ashoka. After some initial warmongering, he converted to Buddhism, became a pacifist (well, sort of) and committed himself to good governance. Under Ashoka, India should be friendly, religious, cultural and non-aggressive unless provoked (and then Ashoka should respond with fury). He could get some bonus cards for government as a trait. Some people also want to see Akbar for India. My concern is that he might be even more aggressive than Gandhi. Also, some people want to see a separate Mughal civ a la Macedon, which might rule him out if that happens. 2. Russia Russia hasn't always been known as progressive. I recommend Ivan the Terrible be included to serve as a counterpoint to Peter's forward thinking agenda. Ivan has a big personality and would be a challenging opponent. He could get the strelets/stretlsy musket unit as part of his leader trait. As his agenda, he could just receive a second secret agenda to represent his unstable personality. The agenda could even just be called "Grozny." Some people want to see Stalin here, but I think Firaxis has tried to distance themselves from dictators as of late. There's a reason we haven't seen Stalin or Mao for the better part of a decade. While Ivan was not a nice guy either, at least there's no one still living whose family members he actively tortured or killed. 3. Egypt The obvious suggestion here is Ramses. Instead of Cleo's cozying up to strong neighbors, Ramses might clash with neighbors with strong militaries. Or he might be a reverse Qin and dislike you if your wonders do not equal or exceed his own. A more eclectic suggestion could be Akhenaten, who would be über-religious but also very diplomatic and eager to trade. Agenda or ability could be: "Aten Worshipper" or "Amarna Letters." 4. China Wu Zetian might be the default choice here because of a need for more female leaders. She could focus more on science and education than wonder-building. Emperor Taizong is another good possibility. He's already been in CivRev2 and the Chinese version of Civ4 (as Mao's replacement). The main concern would be differentiating him enough from Qin. Probably not Mao. See above re: Stalin. Plus China seems to dislike his portrayal in games. 5. France Lots of great options. I propose Cardinal Richelieu. He's infamous but might just be too similar to Catherine in his underhanded agenda. Louis XIV could be a cultural expansionist. Unlike some fans, I really don't have a problem with Joan of Arc. Although a military leader, she's also a religious and cultural icon. I'd prefer not to see Napoleon this time. He's been done a lot already and I'm tired of his bad behavior, esp. In Civ4 and Civ5. 6. England Henry VIII. He's iconic and a big personality. I have a whole thread in the ideas forum on why/how he could be a great addition. If not Henry, then I'd love to see Alfred the Great. It'd be awesome to have an English leader speaking Old English (Anglo-Saxon). He'd be strong all around -- religion, culture, military, infrastructure. Unique ability could be "Burhs" or "Burghal Hidage." Free wooden palisade walls around districts, perhaps. No William the Conqueror or Richard the Lionhearted, if only because no one wants an English leader who mainly speaks French! I'd still prefer a medieval or renaissance leader since Victoria is from the industrial age, hence my earlier suggestions. There are lots of other possibilities. Which civs do you think deserve a second leader, which leaders should be included, and why?