Settle the Land -- Choosing a Site for your Capitol

[RFHolloway]

Scenario1
D

Scenario2
I probably would have gone A from the off and left the worker in place. Having moved the worker would be thinking about L, but that depends on the difficulty level and how soon I will need the Lux - probably come down on A then M (then maybe F & C) but I play complete not vanilla.

I certainly wouldn't have tracked the settler through C nothing I could see through the forrest would make me move from the cows

by the way there are two I's in the diagram!

 

[Skullsplitter]

Never mind what I posted here a minute ago. I forgot the cows were on plains, not grass...

 

[Spoonwood]

Neat thread! Keep the screenshots and questions about where you want to place the capital coming!

 

[Lanzelot]

I say settle B and second city G would be a good plan.

Yes, either this or settle the second city on top of the incense hill! (Lot's of early commerce and the lux is connected easily.) But that depends on what the early scouting shows up at G and the incense respectively.
In any case, I think B for the capital is best. Three cows allow an easy 4-turner, the 4th can be given to the second city. My preferred build order would be something like warrior, warrior, granary, worker and then tons of settlers.

Lanzelot

 

[Skullsplitter]

OK, first question. Move to the other hill or not? Or something else entirely?



Next question: Should I be shrinking these, or putting them in spoils/hides or what?

 

[Skullsplitter]

Just plop it down on the bonus or move to the forest or what?

 

[Skullsplitter]

My inclination:

Spoiler :

First town at A, next probably at D, then C.

 

[Skullsplitter]

Is it worthwhile to move to fresh water? Or are you better off just leaving it so it can't grow past 6?

 

[ChaosArbiter]

Next question: Should I be shrinking these, or putting them in spoils/hides or what?

Put them in spoilers so you can have multiple pics in one post instead of taking up four posts.

(German) First Pic: My natural inclination is to simply settle in place, but if I decided I had to move, I'd move to either of the Plains to the NE or NW - both still get both Hills and have a Wheat to start with (although only the NE one gets both Wheat in the Fat X).

Second Pic: I would settle in place. The only other option I would consider would be moving straight South to get more Hills in the Fat X for higher production, but that won't make too much difference early-game, and late game other cities can use them even if the capital can't.

Third Pic: I would go for A, then plant another city either NW or SE of C.
(Reads inclination - that would probably work better than what I figured)

Fourth Pic: Wouldn't it get Fresh Water from that position? In any case, I would rather build an Aqueduct than let a productive city stagnate at 6. That looks like a good spot, albeit a bit production-light for my tastes.

Caveat: I play Regent-Monarch and don't play particularly well/competitively anyway.

 

[Spoonwood]

First pic: Move settler to the other hill. You get the bonus square earlier, and you have a floodplain square.

Second pic: Plop down immediately. Not taking care of your cows is sacrilege! Oh... it's great production and food earlier also.

Third pic: First town at A. Next town at D.

Fourth pic: Move to the freshwater. It won't get freshwater where it is right now.

 

[DWetzel]

1. I'd move NW and settle there -- flood plain, plains wheat, 3 BGs (that's the flowers, right?), looks like a settler factory to me. Keep the hills for later-game production, second town can go CxxC on the coast to use the other wheat.

2. Blearg, settle in place I guess. Second choice move NW along the coast and settle there, but that loses a cow for a while, not worth it.

3. I'd plop in place; second town between scout and D (it'll eventually get a flood plain and the cow) third town somewhere to the east. I don't see a big advantage in moving, personally.

4. Definitely move to the fresh water. Most obvious one of the bunch.

 

[Lanzelot]

I agree with Spoonwood here completely.

1. Move N. This is the only way to get 5fpt (and a settler-factory)
2. Settle in place, it won't get any better. An interesting plan might then be:
   Go for Philo and pick Map Making as free tech. Mine the cow and then chop half a dozen forrests to speed up a granary and a harbor. Granary+harbor should again allow a SF (at size 4.5 - 6.5)...
3. A, if the water is indeed the coast. If it's only a lake, then we might as well settle in place?!
4. Move 2 NE. However, the main reason would be the extra commerce. Irrigation can also quickly be achieved by building a road on the cow, then moving to the wheat and starting irrigation from there. (The worker has to start with a road anyway, as it can't yet irrigate as long as the capital does not yet provide it with access to fresh water.)

 

[RFHolloway]

1 - if Agri you might consider staying as you will be 5FPT and the BG's will come in handy. NE is the other candidate - you will have a SF, and can mine both hills when out of despot. Defensive bonus is probably not a consideration.
2 - no point moving
3 - A - I considered going SE if that is on the coast, and if that might be important, but A is stronger.
4 - Move NE then either N(if no other forrest available) or NE (if there is). I think you can eventually get a settler factory out of where you are without the river (irrigate both cows, the wheat, 2 plains and mine one plains gives 6 shields at pop 4, 7shields at pop 5 and a 2 spt square to work on growth) but by moving N and NE you could easily save some worker turns (6 for the forrest - no need for the mine and 4 each for any BG's) If there are 2 bg's and a forrest then you have a combi factory.

Please number the scenarios - it makes following them much easier!

 

[templar_x]

@ RF @ 4 - if you want to use that single visible forest but see whether another one is available and still keeps you on the river, you have to move NE on the mountain first and then north, in case you don´t see another one.

templar_x

 

[RFHolloway]

You are right - too much civ 4 (well FFH2) I forgot those were not peaks and you could actually move on them! I have ammended the post above

 

[Desertsnow]

1: It's a tough call, but move to the other hill. You'll still have a potential settler factory, and room for another city on the coast.
2: Stay right where you are. Beaucoup food from the outset, and the fur will be available when on cultural expansion.
3: A. Next city at D or the tile southeast of it.
4: Yes, move to fresh water. This city could be a powerhouse.

 

[Skullsplitter]

Re: post #25, I don't understand the recommendations for plains instead of the hill. Cet. par., aren't you always better off on a hill than on the plains? Between the foregone opportunity for irrigation and the defensive bonus, it seems hard to justify. Or does it have to do with future development potential?

Re: post #28, if I understand the fresh water rules, I'm going to move twice, then settle NE of the mountain. Right? Is there some general rule of thumb about how many turns to forego settling? Two? Three? One per bonus food?

 

[DWetzel]

1. It's basically the extra shield (non-despotism) from the mined hill. If you need the defense bonus in your capital, you've probably got more problems than I want to know about.

2. As far as the settling location goes... right. No, there's no set rule, everyone will feel differently. Basically, I don't think I personally would ever move farther than 2 spaces (OK, maaaaaaaaybe 3, but that's only if I was moving 2 to an awesome spot and revealed like six more cows if I moved the third time).

 

[ChaosArbiter]

Re: post #25, I don't understand the recommendations for plains instead of the hill. Cet. par., aren't you always better off on a hill than on the plains? Between the foregone opportunity for irrigation and the defensive bonus, it seems hard to justify. Or does it have to do with future development potential?

I don't consider the defensive bonus to be worth much for the capital (again, I play at Regent-Monarch, so I don't get my core attacked too much) - for later cities when I'm looking at strategic implications, Hills are preferred for Fort-Cities. I'm not terribly sure what you mean about the irrigation ... if you're talking about losing the potential food from lacking that irrigated tile, I consider it balanced by the later Shield production from the Mined Hill.

 

[RFHolloway]

I don't consider the defensive bonus to be worth much for the capital (again, I play at Regent-Monarch, so I don't get my core attacked too much) - for later cities when I'm looking at strategic implications, Hills are preferred for Fort-Cities. I'm not terribly sure what you mean about the irrigation ... if you're talking about losing the potential food from lacking that irrigated tile, I consider it balanced by the later Shield production from the Mined Hill.

Exactly - I am not expecting my capital to get attacked (if it is the 50% defensive bonus won't save me) and I would prefer a mined hill (1F3S out of despot) to a irrigated plains (2F1S) in the late game primarily to give more options in a food heavy start.