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settlement plans

Discussion in 'Eagles' started by Calis, Jan 8, 2011.

  1. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Here is a very firt plan (as we actually do not have a good overview, yet. But the early bird, you know...

     
  2. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    I like the more Northern of the red dots. The Hill would still be a good spot, especially if something nice is on the other side of it.
     
  3. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Well, actually my idea was to settle them both.

    It's just a start of a complete dotmap. Of course we need to see more for other sites.
     
  4. CharlemagneXLII

    CharlemagneXLII Prince

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    We need to start thinking about which site to send the next settler to, either towards the ivory or downriver to the floodplains. We should go for the northern dot with the ivory, not sure where exactly for the other spot yet. I don't want to build the city directly on the FP, and it seems that we will have room for at least two cities in that direction. Here are some thoughts for both sites:
    Ivory:
    -hooking up that first luxury is very important to keep our science slider up
    -we don't want to waste a worker on a colony
    -longer travel time for the settler(maybe)
    -this city will likely be more productive right away
    FP:
    -this city can act as a second worker/settler pump, which is crucial if we wish to build the Great Lighthouse in the capital
    -in order to do that, it needs to build a granary, grow, and have its tiles improved, so the earlier it is founded the better

    Both cities are going to need workers, we need to build a road to the ivory at the very least, and the FP city needs those floodplains to be irrigated in order to be at all useful. With the capital building a granary (and its worker mining BG's to speed that granary), the first build in either city must be a worker. We must also get a clear idea if connecting the ivory will in fact give us a shorter research time- the FP city will probably net us more gpt, which could counteract a lack of luxuries. In short, we'll need more spreadsheets, and to do that we'll probably need to see a bit more of the FP site.
     
  5. CharlemagneXLII

    CharlemagneXLII Prince

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    Sorry for the double post, but I've tried a bit of spreadsheeting and realized a few things:
    1) The most efficient way to combat unhappiness is through Military Police, since it makes unhappy citizens content. (Luxuries and the luxury slider make content citizens happy, and are less efficient at making unhappy citizens content.)
    2) Ivory will save us 1 gpt on luxuries generally, though in some cases it will not allow for lowering the slider.
    3) The best tile for the ivory city to work is the sugar hill, which is called to be worked by the capital in Calis' spreadsheet.
    4) The ivory city will net us 3 beakers/turn on founding, and if it produces warrior-->worker, then the ivory can be hooked up by turn 32, assuming the original worker does not help. So, at turn 32, the ivory city is boosting research by 4 beakers/turn. The warrior it produces can also be used as MP in the capital, so a maximum of 5 beakers/turn by turn 32. At turn 35 it will grow to size 2 and can potentially make another 3 beakers/turn, so call it 8 beakers/turn by turn 35 at the very most.

    What we need to know then, is if the FP site will have a similar research output as the ivory city. If it does, then we should go there for certain. If not, then we need to decide if long term growth is worth sacrificing short-term research (important for the philosophy race). Keep in mind that there will be no workers available to improve the area around the FP site until it builds its own, or after the cap builds one, and that the best spot for the ivory city to work will overlap with the capital, slowing production.

    As an aside, Aerie does have a chance to catch disease, so be prepared to throw out all spreadsheets in that event.
     
  6. EvilConqueror

    EvilConqueror Warlord

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    First settler due in 3.

    Has anyone had a chance to determine the research output of the FP site?
     
  7. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Actually the settler will complete in two turn, due to the soon mined BG.

    And honestly, I did not see a god spot to settle around the FP so far.
     
  8. Chamnix

    Chamnix Chasing Time

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    What will the corruption rate in our second city be if we settle at a distance of 3-4 away from the capital both before the city is connected to our capital and after it is connected? How many net coins/shields will we get if our city is producing 2, 3, or 4 gross?
     
  9. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Whom are you asking? :p
     
  10. AutomatedTeller

    AutomatedTeller Frequent poster

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    If we settle the FP site, based on what I see now, I'm thinking the coastal plains site SE of the hill. it will give us an extra gold for being coastal, plus access to a 2nd FP.

    I believe we should settle the FP site, myself - food being king.

    At this point in the game, a lux and an MP are the same for happiness.
     
  11. CharlemagneXLII

    CharlemagneXLII Prince

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    It corrupts one gold automatically, and won't corrupt another until 8 gpt. It will corrupt one sheild at 3pt, and is good to 6 sheilds per turn at least. Connecting the city doesn't seem to make a difference.
     
  12. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    If you're talking about the Coastal Plains 2E1NE of Aerie, (no grids), the according to this turn 13 pic settling there will give us access to 4 FP.

    Thats fine. It seems the majority opinion. I disagree. We've already restricted our research (give up on beating Lanzelot to Philo), and we've cut back on production. And using your logic, a lux and an MP are twice as good as an MP. Don't forget we're going to be building a Granary. Will the FP commerce keep us content?
     
  13. Chamnix

    Chamnix Chasing Time

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    Thank you :thumbsup:.

    CharlemagneXLII, obviously :mischief:.

    The center tile will produce 2 coins if it is on the coast or if it is on the river :dunno:.

    I may be flip-flopping on this issue. Food is king, but as often as I have said that settling near the ivory doesn't help us until the ivory is connected to our capital, it is also true that settling by the flood plains doesn't help us until the flood plains are irrigated which will also not be that soon since our worker is busy for a while. It looks like either city may be working a 2/1/x tile for the first 10 turns, and x=2 is better than x=1.

    The main thing that concerns me right now is will a potential ivory city be able to work the sugar hill until the ivory is irrigated, or will our capital need that tile before then? If the capital needs that tile, the ivory city does not have a decent tile to work until some other tile is improved.
     
  14. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Well, the capital can work the 2nd BG tile. That would be one fewer commerce, but not too dramatically.

    Our worker after granary could start roading towards the ivory.

    Next turn, we should take some more time. Our turn clock is full (96 hours) anyway, so we can take the time we need to decide on this issue.
     
  15. CharlemagneXLII

    CharlemagneXLII Prince

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    Actually, based on what we can see now, the best spot for the FP city to work is either a 2/0/1 or a 1/2/1 (FP or forest). Given that we want a worker to irrigate those floodplains to make them useful, then we can build a worker there in 10 turns by working the FP. (It grows after 10 turns with +2fpt, and finishes the worker in 10 turns with 1 spt.) The ivory spot, if working the sugar hill, can crank out a warrior and a worker in that time- the same growth rate but double the production. The warrior can be used for MP in the capital (or explore if the other one is taking on MP duties), and since we will get a luxury connected with this city, and the commerce for the ivory city is actually better, at least in the short term, we should definitely build there. It will be better for research now no doubt- did Cyc say something about not giving up the philosophy race?

    Once we have three workers, one or two of them can go irrigate those floodplains in anticipation of our first settler post-granary.
     
  16. Chamnix

    Chamnix Chasing Time

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    The capital won't need the BG to its E-SE until turn 31, so a city by the flood plains could work that tile for the first 10 turns and build a warrior and a worker similar to the ivory city.

    The capital would like to use the sugar hill on turn 27. We can replace that with the other BG tile, but then we lose a commerce in the capital. It is not a big deal, but since the whole point of settling by the ivory is to improve commerce, gaining one in the second city at the expense of one in the capital is pointless.

    I think the capital must work the sugar hill on around turn 33 in order to get 30 shields within 4 turns for the first settler. If the ivory city is built on turn 19, and the worker completes on turn 29, then I think we will have to irrigate the ivory before we can build that road. It is also not a disaster, but it does again mean that ivory is not getting hooked up that quickly even if we settle there first.

    :hmm:

    I am not necessarily giving up on the Philosophy race, but I don't think we should base too much on that plan. We became underdogs in the race as soon as we discovered we were facing Carthage, and our chances dropped even more upon learning that Carthage has their bonus wheat on the river, and we don't. We may have a chance because our capital will be at 5 fpt, and theirs won't, but I am not optimistic we can make up the ground before they get to Philosophy. We can reevaluate once we complete Writing.
     
  17. Cyc

    Cyc Looking for the door...

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    Looking at the 3300bc (turn 14) pic, if we settle 3 tilles SE of Aerie on that desert tile, we'll have immediate access to 3 FP tiles, with a Worker close.

    On the other hand, if we send the Settler to the Ivory location, and have it build a Worker and the 3 MP Warriors, and Calis sends the next Worker roading towards the Ivory, we can develop the Ivory and Sugar tiles. Irrigated and roaded (I think we should road first) the Ivory would be 2f/2c/1s. Mined and roaded the Sugar would be 2f/2c/2s. Plus there's a River Grassland along the way. Those are pretty healthy roads leading from the Capital to Touscan Talon, which will improve drastically with a change in government, plus give us a luxury. And Touscan Talon could be an optional ship builder.

    I know, I'm rambling again.
     
  18. AutomatedTeller

    AutomatedTeller Frequent poster

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    I have another site to think about, which is the gold hill to the south.

    I think it's coastal, plus has a BG. Settling on it will give us an extra 5 cpt and give us a warrior then a worker then a curragh.
     
  19. EvilConqueror

    EvilConqueror Warlord

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    With the help of the road, we'd also be able to settle there quickly.
     
  20. Chamnix

    Chamnix Chasing Time

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    My fog-gazing skills are pathetic, but I don't see anything that looks like coast around there. Which direction do you think the coast is in?
     

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