Severed Souls destroying/exploring lairs?

Discussion in 'Fall Further' started by heisenberg, Oct 9, 2008.

  1. heisenberg

    heisenberg Lost in Erebus

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    I'm not sure if it has been mentioned before, but i just realized that severed souls (no not the actual hunter) can destroy animal lairs and explore ruins etc.
    Not sure if its intentional, but this allows the sidar to very easily destroy lairs and safely explore them without fear of negative effects (though you do lose the possibility of getting those positive unit upgrades). It is highly significant too as these severed souls are invisible and are able to explore guarded lairs. i.e. those annoying lizardmen spawning lairs in jungles (which used to take 2-3 warriors to dig them out) can now be safely dealt with--send a severed soul to clear it out and you might even find goodies with it~
    This kinda feels exploitive but... i'm enjoying it now when i'm Sidar lol :lol:
     
  2. [to_xp]Gekko

    [to_xp]Gekko QCT junkie

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    it does seem like an exploit rather than a feature... not a bad one, but still an exploit I guess :D
     
  3. xienwolf

    xienwolf Deity

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    Mildly flavorful for the Sidar to do such a thing :) I actually found myself doing almost the same last game I played. Long string of bad results from lairs so I started having the Hawk explore instead of the Hunter. Withered/Diseased/poisoned Hawk... not so bad. Still flies straight ;)
     
  4. BeefontheBone

    BeefontheBone Windbag of the sea

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    Should some unitclasses not be blocked from exploring? Say Animals, Birds, anything without a unitclass. Maybe anything with 0 strength too, so Workers could only go in once they'd promoted to have 1 str. Not sure.
     
  5. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    Could you make it so that exploring a lair doesn't make the unit incapable of using other spells? I'd like to be able to explore lairs with dimensional I adepts who could teleport away if they found trouble, or for mages to be able to depend themselves with fireballs.


    I don't see any problem with workers exploring lairs, but would like it if stronger units had better odds for better results.
     
  6. [to_xp]Gekko

    [to_xp]Gekko QCT junkie

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    agreed on both issues.

    and I'm stil not sure if severed souls, birds and the like should be able to explore lairs or not. it's probably a bit exploity but I'm not 100% about this. I'll leave it for you guys to discuss :p
     
  7. Arctic Circle

    Arctic Circle Prince

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    I agree with this. Had the same thought. 'Why the &"¤#& can't I throw a fireball at those pesky orcs'.
     
  8. Vehem

    Vehem Modmod Monkey

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    The obvious mechanic is to not set "hasCast" when exploring - but the problem then becomes that you can make multiple (unsuccessful) attempts at exploring the same lair in the same turn if it is not tied into the "cast" action for that turn. I'm not sure it warrants a new "hasActed" variable to track - though that may be something that becomes more useful later on.

    That's the mechanical reason at least - from a "realism" (using the term loosely) point of view - a result in which a horde of orcs comes barreling out of the dungeon may actually just mean that the adventurer has been forced to retreat from the expedition, running for his life and tossing spells haphazardly behind him. Under those circumstances you may forgive him being in no state to concentrate on casting once he actually reaches daylight.

    (if we can devise a mechanic to do it however, I agree it'd be nice for some actions to not cost the unit it's ability to cast spells, but be tracked separately)
     
  9. MagisterCultuum

    MagisterCultuum Great Sage

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    Maybe it would be good to make exploring take up one movement point, and to require the unit had at least 1 movement point instead of using the hasCast tag. Sure, you'd be able to explore it a couple times a turn, but at least it wouldn't be an infinite number. It makes sense for faster units to be able to explore more anyway, right? I believe Kael made it cost a movement point already anyway.
     
  10. Vehem

    Vehem Modmod Monkey

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    That's an option - not quite so tidy as the current one code-wise, but it would have the desired effect.
     
  11. Valkrionn

    Valkrionn The Hamster King

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    I believe that pillage works the same way, leaving you unable to cast... Which makes me prefer a new variable to track both lair exploration and pillaging. :)
     
  12. [to_xp]Gekko

    [to_xp]Gekko QCT junkie

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    wouldn't it work better if you make it cost, say , 6 movement points? I believe slow units will still be able to use it ( if it works like normal movement, that is ) , and nobody should ever be able to explore twice a turn.
     
  13. xienwolf

    xienwolf Deity

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    The main reason I don't like costing Movement Points for the exploration is that then you cannot run away from a bad result which you are too weak to fight against. That will come up more often than wanting to cast something I think.


    There is a flag on spells now bAbility, one could extend the function of this flag to add a second tracker to units, then you can perform 1 ability and 1 spell per turn. That means grabbing equipment would no longer mean you are unable to cast a spell as well. Or that casting a spell does not preclude the ability to grab equipment/explore a lair)
     
  14. [to_xp]Gekko

    [to_xp]Gekko QCT junkie

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    that would be awesome :)
     

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