SGOTM 01 - Xteam

[leif erikson]

Leif asked me where I lived, ...well here of course

I like your neighborhood!!

And, don't worry I've changed the name to Thebes

Why? Not a bad place, really.

I still think Pottery should be first. Whether we think Writing should be next, or Mining, we'll need to discuss some more.
Got to go for the moment. Setting up someone else's internet connection and decided to pop in to have a look!

 

[DJMGator13]

Nice start, too bad that is stone and not marble. But with 7 nearby forest chopping the Oracle shouldn't be a problem. Researching COL in time will be the key.

How powerful can a science city be with 7 FP's? If we settle the 2nd city on the plain hill we could start making cottages, but it's too early to be thinking about that.

Doing 30/15/15/10 or even 30/20/10 is fine. We can leave the second set flexible and see where we are at when we hit 15 turns. If there are pressing questions/issues pause and post, if we're just hitting the spacebar then go ahead and play 20. (Brad probably won't be around for the first round.)

 

[Redbad]

It looks like there's sea and mountains to the east and sea to the south. A warrior at EEEE and a warrior at SSSE wil complete eliminate the possibility of barbs coming from the east or from the south.

We don't know yet how things look in the west and north. My estimation would be that another 3 maybe 4 warriors will be sufficient to minimise the risks of being axed by barbs.

That would free us from wanting Animal Husbandry for barb-control. We still might want AH for pastures of for attacking another civ with chariots, but there is at this moment no forseeable need to.

 

[Redbad]

I think there's wide consensus on starting research for pottery. As pots will be researched within my turnset, I ask the team if we should research writing next.
For reasons stated in earlier posts I'm in favour of this of course.

 

[romeothemonk]

I really don't know about the writing, as we really don't want to run speacialists in our capitol too much.

Is there a spreadsheet of the advantage of the early academy vs working a cottaged floodplain?

However, I am open to trying new civ ideas, but we will be sorely lacking the production to build a quick library in Thebes, and would most probably have to whip it, which would cause us to go mining and BWing before we can use it anyway.

I am still tempted to say pottery, mining, writing, BW. That way we could at least work a mined hill to get the library out faster.

 

[DJMGator13]

We debated some similar issues at the beginning of the Gator02 SG. The push there was to get the cottaged FP up and running. Commerce is power is this game.

Doesn't going writing second, help increase our research speed for the CS slingshot? Getting the Academy with some cottaged FP's will be a huge boost. What would be nice is if the capital can work/develope some FP's and then hand them over to a 2nd (Commerce/science) city and build the Academy in the 2nd city.

I may try a few test starts tonight to see how it goes. We're in no rush so if others want to try some test games also. As I've said many times in other SG's "I'd rather play smart than fast."

 

[leif erikson]

Doesn't going writing second, help increase our research speed for the CS slingshot? Getting the Academy with some cottaged FP's will be a huge boost. What would be nice is if the capital can work/develope some FP's and then hand them over to a 2nd (Commerce/science) city and build the Academy in the 2nd city.

The problem, as Romeo was talking about, is what are you going to build the Library with? We would at least need Mining to create some hammer to use to build it. No pop rushing or chopping without Bronzeworking. I think we should research at least Mining before Writing.

 

[Bede]

Mining before Writing as leif points out "You can't make bricks without straw"

 

[WillowBrook]

Warning:

Congratulations! With 66 player posts and 1 turn played, we lead the pack by a huge margin with 66 posts per turn!

Unfortunately, we're seriously behind on visitor posts. (I think mine are the only ones )

But I'm sure I'm not the only one enjoying the strategy discussions!

 

[leif erikson]

Just tried a test game using Pottery, Writing, Mining, Bronze Working, Animal Husbandry, Myst, Meditation, Priesthood and Code of Laws. No Marble. The start was very similar, settled on a Plains Hill surrounded by FP's.

Darn if I didn't get the slingshot. It took forever to produce a Library, but it did help research once it was completed. However, I went a ways over 100 turns, about 115, so I was lucky based on other tests I had done. Also, with the Oracle, it is very hard to get a Great Scientist, got a Great Prophet instead. May have to plan on producing a Great Scientist in a second city?

I'll be interested to hear what others experienced.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

If we decide to go with the lib --> SGL plan, the earlier we can build the lib, the better.
Could you test Pots --> Mine --> Writing with the same start, leif? See how that works out? If we get the lib earlier, I think we should go for it.
With so many food resources, we'll be banging our heads in the happy barrier in no time anyway, so might as well use a pop for a scientist. And we can switch from FP cottages to mines hills as wanted, so getting a good start on working the cottages should be doable anyway.

If you run a scientist for as long as you have the oracle, your chances of getting a SGL will be 60% iirc. We'll have the SGL for a long time before we get the Oracle, so I suppose we're pretty close to 80% SGL chance, which is a nice gamble imhso.

 

[leif erikson]

At best, I can't play it again until tonight. However, the start is quite similar, so I will attach the save. There is a gold hill to the north, but to simulate our start, you can settle either on the eastern or southwestern plains hill.

I have to admit that the gold hill was mighty tempting!

 

[DJMGator13]

In my game I ran 2 scientist once I built the library which I chop rushed. I rarely use pop rushing, but that may change. Because of the FP's I was able to continue to grow, slowly. I also went Pottery, Mining, BW, Writing in that game, but I popped a few techs from huts.

If I stay in town today I'll try out leif's save but as of now we are planning on going to my Grandparents in Melbourne, if we can make it through all the wildfires.

 

[Redbad]

So what are we doing now?
I would think everyone states his opinion, we agree on one tactic or another, and play. Now it looks to me some of us are playing other games to test one thing or the other, while the rest waits.
I can't say it is really thrilling.

This gotm-game by itself will undoubtedly give enough things to discuss as we play it and probably wil have some surprises in store. Playing and researching more or less comparable situations, aren't fun. Maybe that kind of behaviour will get us a few points higher on the sgotm list. It won't get us higher on the have fun list.

Edit:
If it's about the possibility of getting a library, academy and Oracle done, then what does it matter if you succeed in doing it in a different single-player situation. Even if you tested it with this game it wouldn't be the same, as you don't have 6 collegues advicing you on every situation. That it is practical possible, is what I intended to make believeble with my GOTM03 quotes. I do not really care if I or leif or Capt succeed in doing it single player.
If on the other hand people need this kind of elaborations before they can make up their mind on a certain issue, it could become a very, very, very, very long game.

 

[Bede]

Hear, hear, Redbad.

What has been proposed is well within the bounds of the feasible with the start position we have. What will happen in this game is the only thing that really matters so play on, Macduff!

To sum Pottery/Mining/Bronze/Writing, build a library in the most likely spot. Then through the Oracle techs to Civil Service. Detour for Animal Husbandry if we feel the need for Chariots (only if the barbs are overwhelming us would be my vote). I trust this is a fair distillation of everybody's thoughts

 

[leif erikson]

This gotm-game by itself will undoubtedly give enough things to discuss as we play it and probably wil have some surprises in store. Playing and researching more or less comparable situations, aren't fun. Maybe that kind of behaviour will get us a few points higher on the sgotm list. It won't get us higher on the have fun list.

Yes, you are absolutely correct.

This team, when we have played together in Civ3 SGOTM, plays that he who holds the mouse makes the decisions while the rest of us try to help, when needed. (We do like to help) I would say that we have probably helped you enough.

It seems that we agree that you should play the first 30 turns. You have read all that we have written in our experiments, so I suggest you may take what we have written for what it is worth and play on.

SGOTM is as much about adjusting and innovating as a group, as we go ahead. So, it is up to you to play the first 30 turns as best as you know how.

Good luck Redbad!!

 

[Redbad]

Now let me be the one to make further delay, as it is midnight in the low countries. As I wan't to try to make sane decisions i'll play tomorrow morning

 

[leif erikson]

Now let me be the one to make further delay, as it is midnight in the low countries. As I wan't to try to make sane decisions i'll play tomorrow morning

What ever do you mean?

You're supposed to wait until midnight to start, and have a couple of shots of Jack Daniels, or I suppose Jagermeister (sp?) might suffice, and then you'll prolly make the best decisions ever.

BTW - I have been to your fair city, about 25 years ago, and had a nice time there.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

What ever do you mean?

You're supposed to wait until midnight to start, and have a couple of shots of Jack Daniels, or I suppose Jagermeister (sp?) might suffice, and then you'll prolly make the best decisions ever.

BTW - I have been to your fair city, about 25 years ago, and had a nice time there.

Don't drink and play. We've been through this on an earlier sgotm.
Don't know about you, but too much makes me do :suicide: in Civ.
Perhaps people react differently

Good luck, redbad

 

[leif erikson]

Friends don't let friends play drunk!

Well, I didn't advise him to to excess, only enough to awaken the senses. You know, help keep the eyes bugged out for that "One more click and then I'll go to bed".
Isn't that what you tell yourself?

Yay Civfanatics, one and all...

EDIT - BTW, we're lackeys in this game. Do I really see that team VQ has over 200 posts already!