DaviddesJ
Deity
Go ahead. If you can't win by the next vote (which won't surprise me), I can try after you.
I don't think you can manage to lose in the next 15 turns.
I don't think you can manage to lose in the next 15 turns.
SGOTM 03 - Peanut
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
- Joined
- Oct 5, 2001
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- 30,085
Progress update:
"Got it".
The world sure has changed since I played last.
Following klarius' suggestions:
Gift vicky physics, and get an immediate +1 from her.
Revolt to representation (3 turns) - immediate +1 for wisely chosen civics. We're now +12 (pleased).
Hatty is +12, vicky is +12 and gandhi is +11.
I accept Isabella's capitulation, and that changes to .... no different!
Turn 0: 1946 AD.
Now start on the actual turn - still lots of moves to make.
I bombard Vilcabamba and capture it with no losses (3 cossacks beat longbow, mace, trebuchet).
Move cossacks up to attack vitcos next turn (pike & longbow; 20% cultural defence) 3 should be enough.
Capture Tiwanaku for the loss of one cossack.
I note there are some barb cities. Are they not worth population to us to capture them?
IBT:
There is an incan revolt in vilcas.
Turn 1: 1948 AD:
Huayna Capac won't capitulate yet.
I gift Vicky electricity. Don't think we can get an extra diplo point from it, but doesn't hurt.
As per the suggestion, I declare on saladin. Was that supposed to be now, or when we've finished with the incans? I figure that they're remote enough from us now that it can't hurt (well, us at least), and that it gives more time for our allies to move-in. He does have a lot of troops though.
Attack vitcos. First cossack beats a pike, but we have a bit of a scare when a cossack is forced to withdraw when the combat odds are 96.4%. We ahve a third cossack available to mop-up though, and we take the city.
Land some units next to polynesian. Its size 6, defended by 3 axes & a spear. Will tke 2 turns to capture though.
Ditto for andahuylas - its defended by longbow & crossbow.
On main incan continent, need to regroup before I attack again.
IBT:
Saladin adopts free market.
Athens is celebrating (2nd turn of that)
Turn 2: 1950 AD:
Fail to capture andahuaylas - sacrifce a catapult; first 96% cossack wins against pike, second 96% cossack withdraws against a longbow.
Polynesian now has a longbow. Destroy it, a spear & an axeman.
Start to move to attack coryhuayrachina.
IBT:
We come out of anarchy. UN vote is held - I vote for saladin. Are number of votes calcualted when you vote, or when the results are displayed (a turn later?)
We complete steam power, start refrigeration. Louis adopts emancipation.
Turn 3: 1952 AD:
Capture coryhuayrachina with no losses! Do lose a cossack whilst mopping-up though.
Capture andahuaylas, with no loss. Huayna Capac still won't capitulate.
Capture polynesian.
Machu Pichu is heavily defended (1 grenadier, two longbows, a war elephant, a cavalry, a horse archer, 2 trebuchets and an axe. I decide to bypass for the easier Ollantaytambo (1 pike, one longbow, 1 axe, one trebuchet).
IBT
Results are in... and vicky is still abstaining.
I guess I keep-on trying to take-out Huayna Capac. Do we want to accept his capitulation (he won't capitulate just yet, BTW).
Any other suggestions?
Edit: Save attached. I haven't uploaded to the GOTM server - as I'm happy to play a few more turns (and actually have time to!
) However, if someone else wants to take it, then post a "got it here". Otherwise, I'm after advice, and I'll resume in a few hours.
"Got it".
The world sure has changed since I played last.
Following klarius' suggestions:
Gift vicky physics, and get an immediate +1 from her.
Revolt to representation (3 turns) - immediate +1 for wisely chosen civics. We're now +12 (pleased).
Hatty is +12, vicky is +12 and gandhi is +11.
I accept Isabella's capitulation, and that changes to .... no different!
Turn 0: 1946 AD.
Now start on the actual turn - still lots of moves to make.
I bombard Vilcabamba and capture it with no losses (3 cossacks beat longbow, mace, trebuchet).
Move cossacks up to attack vitcos next turn (pike & longbow; 20% cultural defence) 3 should be enough.
Capture Tiwanaku for the loss of one cossack.
I note there are some barb cities. Are they not worth population to us to capture them?
IBT:
There is an incan revolt in vilcas.
Turn 1: 1948 AD:
Huayna Capac won't capitulate yet.
I gift Vicky electricity. Don't think we can get an extra diplo point from it, but doesn't hurt.
As per the suggestion, I declare on saladin. Was that supposed to be now, or when we've finished with the incans? I figure that they're remote enough from us now that it can't hurt (well, us at least), and that it gives more time for our allies to move-in. He does have a lot of troops though.
Attack vitcos. First cossack beats a pike, but we have a bit of a scare when a cossack is forced to withdraw when the combat odds are 96.4%. We ahve a third cossack available to mop-up though, and we take the city.
Land some units next to polynesian. Its size 6, defended by 3 axes & a spear. Will tke 2 turns to capture though.
Ditto for andahuylas - its defended by longbow & crossbow.
On main incan continent, need to regroup before I attack again.
IBT:
Saladin adopts free market.
Athens is celebrating (2nd turn of that)
Turn 2: 1950 AD:
Fail to capture andahuaylas - sacrifce a catapult; first 96% cossack wins against pike, second 96% cossack withdraws against a longbow.
Polynesian now has a longbow. Destroy it, a spear & an axeman.
Start to move to attack coryhuayrachina.
IBT:
We come out of anarchy. UN vote is held - I vote for saladin. Are number of votes calcualted when you vote, or when the results are displayed (a turn later?)
We complete steam power, start refrigeration. Louis adopts emancipation.
Turn 3: 1952 AD:
Capture coryhuayrachina with no losses! Do lose a cossack whilst mopping-up though.
Capture andahuaylas, with no loss. Huayna Capac still won't capitulate.
Capture polynesian.
Machu Pichu is heavily defended (1 grenadier, two longbows, a war elephant, a cavalry, a horse archer, 2 trebuchets and an axe. I decide to bypass for the easier Ollantaytambo (1 pike, one longbow, 1 axe, one trebuchet).
IBT
Results are in... and vicky is still abstaining.
I guess I keep-on trying to take-out Huayna Capac. Do we want to accept his capitulation (he won't capitulate just yet, BTW).
Any other suggestions?
Edit: Save attached. I haven't uploaded to the GOTM server - as I'm happy to play a few more turns (and actually have time to!
) However, if someone else wants to take it, then post a "got it here". Otherwise, I'm after advice, and I'll resume in a few hours.Attachments
I cannot look into the save currently.
But, we should still try both convince Vicky and if that fails get enough votes ourself. Huayna should be further
and if he capitulates accept it. This will still not be enough, if Vicky doesn't vote for us. And we cannot do anything more about Vicky unless she gets into a war. We will get additional points for favorite civics, but that's very slooow.
So move on towards Saladin after Huayna.
Getting the own population up by growing and maybe capturing barb cities is less efficient than capturing opposition and will not do it anytime soon.
But, we should still try both convince Vicky and if that fails get enough votes ourself. Huayna should be further
and if he capitulates accept it. This will still not be enough, if Vicky doesn't vote for us. And we cannot do anything more about Vicky unless she gets into a war. We will get additional points for favorite civics, but that's very slooow.So move on towards Saladin after Huayna.
Getting the own population up by growing and maybe capturing barb cities is less efficient than capturing opposition and will not do it anytime soon.
DaviddesJ
Deity
We could give Victoria most of our gold (2000-3000) and see if that gets her to like us more. I was just reading a WOTM6 spoiler where diplo victory was achieved basically just by making large gold gifts to the holdouts until they were friendly enough. We aren't doing anything else with that cash.
While we can't win quickly just by growing our cities, we could get quite a few more votes for ourselves just by maximizing them. Some of the newly captured cities (especially Montezuma's) aren't working their farms, are running unnecessary specialists, are building settlers (which obviously prevents growth), have unimproved food resources, have tiles that could be converted to farms, etc. They also need weak military garrisons for increased happiness.
While we can't win quickly just by growing our cities, we could get quite a few more votes for ourselves just by maximizing them. Some of the newly captured cities (especially Montezuma's) aren't working their farms, are running unnecessary specialists, are building settlers (which obviously prevents growth), have unimproved food resources, have tiles that could be converted to farms, etc. They also need weak military garrisons for increased happiness.
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Crap. Huayna Capac offered capitulation. I accepted, as it would allow us to redirect our resources towards Saladin. Unfortunately, it has stuffed our relations with Vicky (primarily) and also with others...
Read on:
IBT
Results are in... and vicky is still abstaining.
Turn 4: 1520 AD;
Continue to move units towards Ollantaytambo.
Spot another incan border down near the south pole - we have two cossacks that attacked polynesian available. They are dispatched (there's a barb warrior on a hut there, too).
IBT:
Isabella asks for education, so I oblige.
Turn 5: 1523 AD:
Just move some units around.
IBT:
Vilcas (defended by only a cannon) is captured by incan cavalry.
Turn 6: 1526 AD
Move more troops around. We'll take Ollaytaytambo next turn.
We destroy a barb warrior on a hut - hostile villagers.
IBT:
Sec. Gen vote.
Turn 7: 1539AD
Take Ollaytabtambo with no losses. Move on to attack Navajo next turn.
Check Huayna capac, and he will capitulate - giving us navajo (although won't give the smaller vilcas). I take it, and prepare to attack saladin.
The unfortunate downside is that Hatty, Vicki & gandhi all get a second negative modifier for vassals. Vicki is still +12: timing was unfortunate - I think we'd just got an extra 'mutual military struggle' point with her....
IBT:
We win sec. general vote, but.... Vicky cancels Open Borders!
Turn 8: 1542AD.
I check-in with Victoria. She's now mad that we traded with her worst enemy, which is apparently Louis XIV. This is apparently because Huayna Capac is trading with him. I pay Huayna 420 gold to stop trading - not sure if that will do any good.
I'll leave it at this point.
>> THE SAVE <<
Read on:
IBT
Results are in... and vicky is still abstaining.
Turn 4: 1520 AD;
Continue to move units towards Ollantaytambo.
Spot another incan border down near the south pole - we have two cossacks that attacked polynesian available. They are dispatched (there's a barb warrior on a hut there, too).
IBT:
Isabella asks for education, so I oblige.
Turn 5: 1523 AD:
Just move some units around.
IBT:
Vilcas (defended by only a cannon) is captured by incan cavalry.
Turn 6: 1526 AD
Move more troops around. We'll take Ollaytaytambo next turn.
We destroy a barb warrior on a hut - hostile villagers.
IBT:
Sec. Gen vote.
Turn 7: 1539AD
Take Ollaytabtambo with no losses. Move on to attack Navajo next turn.
Check Huayna capac, and he will capitulate - giving us navajo (although won't give the smaller vilcas). I take it, and prepare to attack saladin.
The unfortunate downside is that Hatty, Vicki & gandhi all get a second negative modifier for vassals.
Vicki is still +12: timing was unfortunate - I think we'd just got an extra 'mutual military struggle' point with her....IBT:
We win sec. general vote, but.... Vicky cancels Open Borders!
Turn 8: 1542AD.
I check-in with Victoria. She's now mad that we traded with her worst enemy, which is apparently Louis XIV. This is apparently because Huayna Capac is trading with him. I pay Huayna 420 gold to stop trading - not sure if that will do any good.
I'll leave it at this point.
>> THE SAVE <<
DaviddesJ
Deity
I should be able to go next. What is the exact timing of when the votes occur?
- Joined
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Not exactly sure.... We just won the UN vote, so I think we can propose a resolution next inter-turn. Note that I haven't made many (any?) moves this turn. There are a couple of galleons in/near athens that can start ferrying cossacks to arabia, but its a long way to go. And you're right about growing cities. We have a lot of excess workers - would gifting them help us?
DaviddesJ - go ahead.
How close were we without Vickie?
And how close to Domination are we? If we're getting close, perhaps we should gift some captured cities back to our vassals? Might help us keep our combat troops at the front, too.
How close were we without Vickie?
And how close to Domination are we? If we're getting close, perhaps we should gift some captured cities back to our vassals? Might help us keep our combat troops at the front, too.
DaviddesJ
Deity
I'm traveling today, but, after that, I should be able to play in the next few days.
A few things:
That Vicky gives us a traded with worst enemy is because we traded with Huayna. That's our trade relations we see there not those of our vassals. Giving him money to cancel his deals makes it even worse.
The second vassal point can be cured by disbanding military. It's the power of us/Mansa and our vassals relative to the world power that counts for that. It has nothing to do with number of vassals.
It seems Vicky is a lost cause by now also. Her relations to Mansa are just to bad.
If we don't care anymore about Vicky, we could also go to war with Julius. Gandhi and Hatty are not pleased with him, so will not care.
Diplomatic votes are only every 4 turns. IIRC every 5th is for secretary general. So it's another 4 turns for the next proposition coming up.
We cannot give any cities to vassals, but we still are quite a bit away from domination land, so that shouldn't be the problem.
That Vicky gives us a traded with worst enemy is because we traded with Huayna. That's our trade relations we see there not those of our vassals. Giving him money to cancel his deals makes it even worse.
The second vassal point can be cured by disbanding military. It's the power of us/Mansa and our vassals relative to the world power that counts for that. It has nothing to do with number of vassals.
It seems Vicky is a lost cause by now also. Her relations to Mansa are just to bad.
If we don't care anymore about Vicky, we could also go to war with Julius. Gandhi and Hatty are not pleased with him, so will not care.
Diplomatic votes are only every 4 turns. IIRC every 5th is for secretary general. So it's another 4 turns for the next proposition coming up.
We cannot give any cities to vassals, but we still are quite a bit away from domination land, so that shouldn't be the problem.
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Well, I was confused by this. The info blurb you get when you contact a leader came up with something like "stop trading with Louis XIV, our worst enemy".
How's it going, DaviddesJ?
DaviddesJ
Deity
It's been hard for me to set aside enough time to get down to it. I still am planning to get to it pretty soon, but, if anyone else is eager (ok, willing) to take a shot at it, be my guest.
Sounds good! (And I feel the same way). My weekend is pretty full. So let's give DaviddesJ first shot over the weekend, with malekithe following up early next week.
DaviddesJ - please post whether you can definitely play or not.
DaviddesJ - please post whether you can definitely play or not.
DaviddesJ
Deity
I would definitely prefer if someone else can play. If I knew that no one else would step up, then I would probably find the time.
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