The problem with upgrading is that it will cost 155 gold per zerk. It may be worth it for a few well promoted units but not for the majority unless we start getting lots of gold or else run science at 0% for a while.
The problem with upgrading is that it will cost 155 gold per zerk. It may be worth it for a few well promoted units but not for the majority unless we start getting lots of gold or else run science at 0% for a while.
alright guys, I'll start playing my turns in a couple hours...I understand the idea of not building Zerks for amphibious...but what about for CR promos? Grens can't get those either...would that be worth doing?
I can't look at the same atm but it seems like we have enough swordsman already that we could promote our CR3 swordmen to berzerkers and then to Grens and have all the promotions we'd want. I don't think we need to build new ones for the promotions.
Alright, here's my turnlog...Hopefully I didn't do anything the team doesn't like...I used the Scientist on Sci Method near the end of my turnset as we had discussed doing of it was still largely unknown(which it was) when I finished Steel...so without further ado:
Turn 0(1520AD): Move extra troops out of Tiflis. I decide that we have enough troops capable of being upgraded to Grenadiers with CR promos already and will build Grens for defense and upgrade any other troops I am able. When fully upgraded, we'll have 15+ Grens with CR promos, 6+ Cannons, and hopefully a few CG Grens for defense.
I note that Washington is vassalized to Hannibal and that Washington is pleased toward Gandhi now just as Izzy is.
Brennus likes us enough to give us 80 gold as a token of his gratitude.
Izzy gives us 100 gold for peace.
Trade Izzy spices for 6 gpt
Trade Brennus clam for 3 gpt
Trade Washington sugar for 5 gpt
We need Gandhi to get access to Astro soon, he doesn't seem interested in researching it at all
Finally, I find that upgrading our Swords to Zerks, then to Grens, would cost 20 gold more each than upgrading directly to Grens...is that worth it to the team? IBT: Nothing Turn 1(1523AD): El Dorado Treb>Gren. Old Sarai Granary>Gren. I don't think it is worth building any more buildings in the mainland, since we don't have any guarantee they will survive Gandhi's invasion, while we will need as many troops as we can get.
Upgrade Caravel to Frigate next to Nidaros
Pop the hut next to Tiflis for 23 gold
Turn 5(1535AD): More Grens started around the continent.
IBT: Gandhi lands a Lbow and settler in his area of our continent...I'll let him settle this time.
Turn 6(1538AD): I run off Gandhi's 4 caravels around Yayoi by killing 3, 4th runs away.
IBT: Gandhi's Golden Age ends...I was wondering why he had such a huge increase in both production and GNP on the graphs a few turns ago.
Jaipur founded by Gandhi just inside his territory on our continent
Turn 7(1541AD): Nidaros Gren>Gren
IBT: Nothing
Turn 8(1544AD): uhhh....shoot. The galley Gandhi used to ferry over the Lbow and settler has a Gren sitting next to it.
Gergovia Defense:
1 Musket
1 Mace
1 Gallic Sword
Trade Spices to Hannibal for 3 gpt
IBT: Everyone except Mehmed II is now Mercantilism
Turn 9(1547AD): Steel>Sci Method, only Brennus knows it right now. Use GS on Sci Method, it is now 6 turns away.
Trade Steel to Washington for 50 gold, WM, Nationalism, Liberalism(btw, Communism is the tech required for Spies, which we want, whether we intend to sabotage or merely observer)
Nidaros Gren>Gren
Isca Defense:
1 Mace
1 Lbow
IBT: Gandhi upgrades his galleys to Galleons
Turn 10(1550AD): Note that Hannibal still hasn't researched Liberalism?
Bibracte Defense:
1 Musket
3 Lbows
1 Pike
1 Cat
Summary: Brennus is very lightly defended right now, and I think the only thing really keeping us from being able to take him out is raw transport capacity. I think that if we had enough, we could take every coastal city he has except Bibracte on the first or second turn of war...Easily. Thus, I've been having our northern coastal cities trying to build galleons while our inner cities and Nidaros build Grens.
Sci Method is 5 turns away now. I think we should trade it to whoever we can when we first research it, and then go full cash to upgrade our swords, axes, and zerks into Grens. At that point we should have no problem taking out Brennus(although we could probably take out Hannibal at that point...he's got Rifles now, or Grenadier chow as they are sometimes called)
I think we should start whipping units out soon, and when we are assured of victory in our exodus, then we whip the cities as small as we can(size 3-4) and then evacuate everything but our workers. I think we should leave our workers behind as Gandhi is likely to go ahead and pillage our land as he advances despite no opposition(and the lands we are going to will be fairly well developed anyway...we won't have anything for 17 workers to do anyway)
We are currently #1 in production and #3 in GNP, so Gandhi should be in perfect shape for a victory when we leave, which should begin soon(I've already got 5 galleons loaded up and ready to leave from opposite shores)
We've also already surpassed Brennus in power, and when we upgrade our units may even challenge Gandhi(who has about 35% more power than anyone else)
At our current economy level, if we were to run 0% science for 10-15 turns we'd have enough cash to upgrade just about all our units, less turns if people would change out of mercantilism(which will happen once we trade for Economics and then trade that out to everyone else)
Finally, I believe Gandhi means to attack near Haithabu, so I've accordingly sent 2 Grens and 3 Zerks(I think, maybe just 2) in that direction just so we're ready.
Upload log:
Spoiler:
Here is your Session Turn Log from 1520 AD to 1550 AD:
Turn 310, 1520 AD: You have made peace with Isabella!
Turn 310, 1520 AD: Thomas Edison (Great Engineer) has been born in Edirne (Mehmed II)!
Turn 311, 1523 AD: The villagers give you gold! You have received 23 gold!
Turn 311, 1523 AD: Mehmed II has completed Versailles!
Turn 312, 1526 AD: You have trained a Longbowman in Tiflis. Work has now begun on a Library.
Turn 312, 1526 AD: Henry Ford (Great Engineer) has been born in Washington (Washington)!
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Geezers's Frigate (8.80) vs Gandhi's Caravel (3.90)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Combat Odds: 99.5%
Turn 313, 1529 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: (Extra Combat: +20%)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (71/100HP)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (42/100HP)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (13/100HP)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (87/100HP)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (0/100HP)
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Geezers's Frigate has defeated Gandhi's Caravel!
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Iron Sheep celebrates "We Love the Prime Minister Day"!!!
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Washington's Golden Age has begun!!!
Turn 313, 1529 AD: Washington has completed The Taj Mahal!
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate (7.65) vs Gandhi's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Combat Odds: 98.4%
Turn 314, 1532 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (74/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (71/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (61/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (42/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (13/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (48/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (0/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate has defeated Gandhi's Caravel!
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate (8.00) vs Gandhi's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Combat Odds: 99.5%
Turn 314, 1532 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (87/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (71/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (42/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (13/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (0/100HP)
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Geezers's Frigate has defeated Gandhi's Caravel!
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Iron Sheep celebrates "We Love the Prime Minister Day"!!!
Turn 314, 1532 AD: The borders of Tiflis have expanded!
Turn 314, 1532 AD: Isabella adopts Mercantilism!
Turn 316, 1538 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Old Sarai!
Turn 316, 1538 AD: Iron Sheep will become unhealthy on the next turn
Turn 316, 1538 AD: Christianity has spread in Yayoi.
Turn 316, 1538 AD: Gandhi's Golden Age has ended...
Turn 317, 1541 AD: Hannibal has 3 gold per turn available for trade
Turn 317, 1541 AD: Uppsala celebrates "We Love the Prime Minister Day"!!!
Turn 317, 1541 AD: Iron Sheep has become unhealthy
Turn 317, 1541 AD: Hinduism has spread in Haithabu.
Turn 318, 1544 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Old Sarai!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Haithabu!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate (8.00) vs Gandhi's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Combat Odds: 99.5%
Turn 318, 1544 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (71/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (42/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (87/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (74/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (61/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (48/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (35/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (13/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (22/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 29 (0/100HP)
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Geezers's Frigate has defeated Gandhi's Caravel!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Your Frigate has destroyed a Caravel!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: You have discovered Steel!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: Uppsala celebrates "We Love the Prime Minister Day"!!!
Turn 318, 1544 AD: New Karakorum will grow to size 11 on the next turn
Turn 318, 1544 AD: New Karakorum will become unhealthy on the next turn
Turn 319, 1547 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Old Sarai!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Haithabu!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: You have discovered Nationalism!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: You have discovered Liberalism!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Geezers's Frigate (8.80) vs Gandhi's Caravel (3.60)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Combat Odds: 99.7%
Turn 319, 1547 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: (Plot Defense: +10%)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 30 (70/100HP)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 30 (40/100HP)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Geezers's Frigate is hit for 13 (87/100HP)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 30 (10/100HP)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Gandhi's Caravel is hit for 30 (0/100HP)
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Geezers's Frigate has defeated Gandhi's Caravel!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Your Frigate has destroyed a Caravel!
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Gandhi has 11 gold per turn available for trade
Turn 319, 1547 AD: New Karakorum has grown to size 11
Turn 319, 1547 AD: New Karakorum has become unhealthy
Turn 319, 1547 AD: Haithabu will grow to size 6 on the next turn
Turn 320, 1550 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Old Sarai!
Turn 320, 1550 AD: The enemy has been spotted near Haithabu!
Me too. I want to stay away from that Gandhi dude.
I guess I am up. I did not look at the save but will post my plan later after lookig at it.
I think the city raider aspect of a zerk is worth the cost to up grade, I forgot about Granadiers promotions track lack CR. As for going from Swords to Zerk, if it gives the amphibios promo, I think it is worth the 20 added gold.
EDIT: Got it. Looked at the save.
Very good use of a GS Thrallia, we will pass these AI in no time.
As far as the promotions, I think we should get the cats upped to cannons. Even against rifles, I used one lead suicide cannon followed by granadiers to some awesome effect recently. Very impressed. Back to the game, we need protection for those gallians en route, so 2 frigates are needed. We still do not have the needed firepower to successfully eject Brennus out of the game. But we will see.
I see this turn set to be another build up and moving escorted and promoted elite units to the Promised Land.
Just a side bar question. Does any one know if capturing the Internet is same as building it? Is it the equal of Civ3 Great Lib? B'Cause this could be handy if Gandhi is slow to tech. We can get him there and sooner perhaps. We can build the space elevator and the Internet and let him capture it...in 2 cities to speed up the process. This way us and "G" and some select Cives that we keep around, can be all knowing
If we upgrade the swords, zerks, and axes we already have built, we'll have almost 30 Grens, and if we upgrade all our cats to cannons(trebs don't upgrade to anything) we'll have 6 or 7 trebs and 5 or 6 cannons. And that's assuming we build no more troops at all.
The grens I've been building straight out I figured we would use for defense, since they can learn both gunpowder promos and city defense promos.
Do you mean score rather than power? Looks like I may have to start the invasion. Pity warring is not my strongest point......
I wonder if it's worth trading Printing Press, at a ruinous price, to Izzy so that we can then gift her SciMeth when we get it and hope she trades it to Ghandhi? As an aside we don't seem to have a lot of trading partners left after Thrallia's catch up on the techs.
nope...looks like I fall victim to the fact I didn't zoom in to the last 50 turns or so...from the full history screen, it appears we have passed him...or at least, it did to me(although I've only got one contact lens in right now!)
Regardless, we'll pass him soon...and I don't really know where his military strength is, cause none of the cities I scouted have anywhere near enough defense to hold us out...not even his capital.
I don't really know where his military strength is, cause none of the cities I scouted have anywhere near enough defense to hold us out...not even his capital.
Power rating works in mysterious ways. This thread attempts to explain it although I can't recall if it's been updated for Warlords. I need to have another look through it.
Just a side bar question. Does any one know if capturing the Internet is same as building it? Is it the equal of Civ3 Great Lib? B'Cause this could be handy if Gandhi is slow to tech. We can get him there and sooner perhaps. We can build the space elevator and the Internet and let him capture it...in 2 cities to speed up the process. This way us and "G" and some select Cives that we keep around, can be all knowing
I had a play in WorldBuilder and The Internet wasn't there after Toku captured the city. I think that's because it's a project rather than a wonder. As an aside it was amusing how long my axe held out against his forces.
indeed, projects can't be captured. That means Internet, Apollo Program, and Manhattan Project are civ-specific...unfortunately. If it was not that way, then we could build the Apollo Porgram for him too, if he decides not to bother with it.
I think we mainly need Galleons, Galleons, and gold
We've got the units, we just need to upgrade all our swords and axes to zerks, then all our zerks to Grens(then we've got all the CR/Amphib Grens we need...in fact, we might even have enough we won't need to bombard any but the toughest of Brennus' cities, giving us 1 turn takeovers(and no need to protect damaged troops, since they'll still be safe in our galleon after attacking)
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Do you mean score rather than power? Looks like I may have to start the invasion. 
Pity warring is not my strongest point......
This thread attempts to explain it although I can't recall if it's been updated for Warlords. I need to have another look through it.
