SGOTM 04 - Peanut

[a space oddity]

Started scouting west with the following result:

Then turned North finding our first bogey:
Our scout survives, no promotion.

Then Buddhism is founded, but not by Gandhi. Interesting ... the North passage is blocked:

We survive a Panther attack, the Scout gets a Woodman upgrade. Found Gandhi... why am I not surprised... ?! Gem mines ready and all...
The hut gives us 58 gold.

AH reveals Horses and that's a nice point to stop. Overview of the turf:
Red arrow is us, purple is Gandhi.

I've left the worker in a spot where the choice for Horses or Pigs can still be made. Started The Wheel, but no beakers went there yet.

Spoiler turnlog :

Turn 0, 4000 BC: GroundnutHill has been founded.

Turn 11, 3670 BC: You have discovered Mining!

Turn 12, 3640 BC: Buddhism has been founded in a distant land!

Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion (2.00) vs Peanut's Scout (2.70)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Combat Odds: 21.3%
Turn 20, 3400 BC: (Animal Combat: +20%)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: (Plot Defense: +50%)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: (Class Animal Combat: +100%)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 17 (83/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 17 (66/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 23 (77/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 17 (49/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 23 (54/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 23 (31/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 23 (8/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 17 (32/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 23 (0/100HP)
Turn 20, 3400 BC: Peanut's Scout has defeated Barbarian's Lion!

Turn 21, 3370 BC: You have discovered Agriculture!

Turn 22, 3340 BC: The villagers give you gold! You have received 58 gold!

Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther (2.00) vs Peanut's Scout (2.95)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Combat Odds: 10.6%
Turn 30, 3100 BC: (Animal Combat: +20%)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: (Plot Defense: +50%)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: (Class Animal Combat: +100%)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: (River Attack: +25%)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (76/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (36/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (20/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (52/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (4/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (28/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (4/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 30, 3100 BC: Peanut's Scout has defeated Barbarian's Panther!

Turn 33, 3010 BC: You have discovered Animal Husbandry!
Turn 33, 3010 BC: You have discovered a source of Horse near GroundnutHill!

 

[MailMan]

Nice resources around us - gold and gems for commerce and happiness, sea food, horses and sheep.

I suggest going to the wheel, build a settler when we reach size 3 and couple of chariots for barb defense.
after the wheel, go to BW and chop a tree to speed up the settler and revel the copper.

after BW I would go the mysticism to build obelisk in the second city. I see that city 2E of the fish to grab 2 gold and be on plain hill we fresh water.
another good location for that city is 1S of the previous suggestion. it could steal the capital horses to work more hills and will not require obelisk so fast.

the worker should first work the pigs, horses should come after that.

 

[Wotan]

OK, I guess I am up now and will probably try to play tomorrow evening CET. Or before heading to work tomorrow morning if it the consensus is that it is pretty straightforward. I would like some more input from those on the team with more experience of CIV.

1st settler, 2E of fish is pretty low on food while the one just S of that (plains) adds another grassland and borrow the capitals pig. So I would go for the latter. Anyone wanna talk me out of that idea?

 

[a space oddity]

1st settler, 2E of fish is pretty low on food while the one just S of that (plains) adds another grassland and borrow the capitals pig. So I would go for the latter. Anyone wanna talk me out of that idea?

OK I'll try : plains hill gives an extra hammer in the city tile, and the soutern strip the city gains in the fat cross is poor food wise, the city will never be able to use those, while it's northern counter part has commerce and might be useful with watermills.

 

[Wotan]

See, that wasn't difficult. OK, the "northern part" is probably what is not showing in your last pic. So there are good tiles in that row? I am not sure about CIV and what constitutes good protocol? Can i open the save, look at it, discuss with you guys, then open it again and play when we are in agreement? I have yet to open it, don't want to make any mistakes in save management.

 

[klarius]

Well, it did never cross my mind that anybody would consider to settle 2E of the fish.
The strength of the city in that vicinity is the gold and we need immediate food to work it. Not a city which will take forever to culture expand and hasn't a decent tile before that.
The only other position I considered is the empty desert hill, which gets again all 3 gold, the pigs and later a corn. But it's not on fresh water and the corn can be put to good use by a city on the southwestern river (which we will not settle before we at least see iron working on the horizon).
So the plains river tile sharing the pigs, is the obvious best IMO.
The capital doesn't need the pigs in the long run. It has ample food for it's tiles by the other two food resources, so not sharing the pigs would be waste anyway (we would anyway not want to work the tile most of the time, when we are cruising at the happy limit).
We want the pigs now improved first, because it adds one more production to the settler build than the horses (it's 6 food compared to 2 food 3 hammers).

Science should continue with the wheel. We need to connect our resources and cities. I'm not sure what we want then. With the horses soon to be connected BW is not that urgent. We could get pottery or writing (or even both) before.

 

[a space oddity]

Well, it did never cross my mind that anybody would consider to settle 2E of the fish.

Well, now you know... I'm just patient that way... But you're right, using the pigs it'll be useful much sooner. I'll gladly take the advise of you guys.

@Wotan: the second to last picture shows the northern tiles: 1 coastal, 2 riverside plains.

 

[Wotan]

OK, so back to the plains/river tile then. Re-corrected I guess.

And playing until Wheel is researched seems like a good break point, 11 turns according to a pic.

 

[klarius]

Well, there is still another decision to take now.
Do we feel lucky and go for the settler in 3 turns, when the warrior completes, or do we build a second warrior first.
Human barbs will appear somewhere on the map before the settler completes, so a warrior has to clear the path in front of the settler.
With some really bad luck, a barb warrior could already go for the empty capital exactly when the settler comes out.

I think the risk is really tiny and would go for it.
If you're less confident, still don't build a second warrior, but put one turn into into a warrior at high hammers, shortly before the settler completes (to avoid decay of hammers). This allows to complete the warrior within 2 turns after the settler, which is enough that no unseen barb can attack before it completes.

Wotan, I think you should play at least to when the settler comes out, which is later than when wheel completes. The next research doesn't really matter much. We will anyway research BW, pottery and writing soon and none of these is really urgent (we have enough to do for the worker with TW and also don't have time to build a granary or library in the capital currently).

 

[Wotan]

OK, will play in a couple of hours time.

Settler after Warrior it is.

Research, Wheel -> BW

And i will play until the Settler is ready but will leave him in the capital for the next player to deal with.

 

[DaviddesJ]

I'd seriously consider founding the second city on the desert hill. Fresh water is nice but not critical. Founding here leaves the fish to be worked, along with clams, by a later city to be build 2W 1S of the fish.

It's hard to decide without seeing more territory to the south.

 

[a space oddity]

Those will be visible after Wotans' round, the scout had to heal two times during mine.

 

[Wotan]

Turn log

0 – 2980BC
Hit return

1 – 2950BC
Worker move to Pigs and start building a pasture.

2 – 2920BC
Nada

3 – 2890BC
GroundnutHill Warrior -> Settler

IBT: Panther attack our Scout; Scout wounded and require 5 turns to heal.

4 – 2860BC
Nada

5 – 2830BC
Nada

6 – 2800BC
Pasture finished, Settler now in 9 turns.

7 – 2770BC
We meet Genghis.


8 – 2740BC
Hinduism founded in a distant land.
Worker starts building a pasture in the horse tile.

IBT: Warrior defeats a Panther.

9 – 2710BC
Nada

IBT: Scout survives an attack by a Lion.
Gandhi converts to Hinduism.

10 – 2680BC
Nada

11 – 2650BC
Wheel researched, starting on BW.

12 – 2620BC
Nada

13 – 2590BC
Horse pasture ready.

14 – 2560BC
Worker starts building a road in the horse tile.
My wife bumps into me when I am about to move the Warrior into the Forest S of Pigs so he ends up in G-Hill instead… Is this something that could jeopardize our marriage? Well the warrior will not be in position to bust the fog on the turn the settler arrives there so I guess we have a situation that is not that good.

15 – 2530BC
GroundnutHill Settler -> Warrior


After Action Report

Have set the next build to warrior but this was just to have something in the build queue.

BW in 12 turns, at least with the current configuration of tiles worked.

Scout healed again next turn.

Here is your Session Turn Log from 2980 BC to 2530 BC:


Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther (2.00) vs Peanut's Scout (2.90)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Combat Odds: 11.1%
Turn 37, 2890 BC: (Animal Combat: +20%)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: (Plot Defense: +50%)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: (Feature: +20%)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: (Class Animal Combat: +100%)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (76/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (52/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (28/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (4/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 37, 2890 BC: Peanut's Scout has defeated Barbarian's Panther!

Turn 41, 2770 BC: Hinduism has been founded in a distant land!

Turn 42, 2740 BC: Gandhi converts to Hinduism!
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther (2.00) vs Peanut's Warrior (2.60)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Combat Odds: 23.1%
Turn 42, 2740 BC: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: (Animal Combat: +20%)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior is hit for 17 (83/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 22 (78/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior is hit for 17 (66/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior is hit for 17 (49/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 22 (56/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 22 (34/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior is hit for 17 (32/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior is hit for 17 (15/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 22 (12/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Barbarian's Panther is hit for 22 (0/100HP)
Turn 42, 2740 BC: Peanut's Warrior has defeated Barbarian's Panther!

Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion (2.00) vs Peanut's Scout (2.90)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Combat Odds: 11.1%
Turn 43, 2710 BC: (Animal Combat: +20%)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: (Plot Defense: +50%)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: (Feature: +20%)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: (Class Animal Combat: +100%)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 24 (76/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 24 (52/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 24 (28/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Peanut's Scout is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 24 (4/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Barbarian's Lion is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 43, 2710 BC: Peanut's Scout has defeated Barbarian's Lion!

Turn 44, 2680 BC: You have discovered The Wheel!

 

[a space oddity]

Those southern lands look good!

 

[DaviddesJ]

Desert hill city looks good to me. Otherwise we aren't likely to build a city that uses that corn for quite a while (need Iron Working and multiple workers to clear jungle). I'd start with the corn/3gold 4W of capital, planning to build three cities along the southwest river, in time (clams/fish at 8W 2N, 2clams/2gems at 9W 1S, 2sugar/spices/horse at 6W 6S).

We have so many good city sites, it's an embarrassment of riches.

 

[malekithe]

Ok, got it. I agree with DaviddesJ about settling on the desert hill. Settling away from fresh water is a non-issue (we already have 3 health resources). I'm a bit confused why we don't have a warrior out scouting ahead of the settler. This will cost us a couple of turns settling the city, as I'm not willing to take a risk moving the settler into unexplored lands on his own (been burned too many times). I understand the warrior needed to heal, but he most certainly did not need to be in the capital to do so.

What are people's opinions regarding our production schedule in the capital and our future research? We'll need another worker sometime soon, and probably another settler soon after. Chariots should probably be sprinkled in there to eliminate any barb threat whatsoever. Research-wise, we need to prioritize iron working, but I'm not sure it's the most important thing after bronze. We have the potential for at least 4 quality cities before we ever need to set foot in the jungle. Still, though, I'd put it on a short list of techs we need ASAP. I'd leen toward maybe pottery, writing, then iron. That means granaries and a library or two need to be built as well.

In general, we've got a lot of opportunity here. Were we playing for our own victory, this game would likely already be won, simply from the gift of abundant land. How to convert that gift into success for Gandhi is something we'll have to figure out over time.

So what do you guys think?

 

[Wotan]

The original idea was to have the Settler move NW and we settle on the river plains. To be ahead of the Settler the warrior would need to be on the forest south of the pigs this turn. I thought I made a note about the reason he is not in my notes so the confusion you talk about Malekithe should not have been an issue had you read my turn log???

 

[klarius]

I still prefer the river plains tile over the desert hill. Less overlap with the capital, coastal, fresh water.
The corn can for sure be put to good use by another city at some time (remember this is going to be a looong game).
But we aren't guaranteed to get a good city site for the fish, if Gandhi settles somewhere across the straight.

I don't think we need to research IW ourselves. We should get some scouting boats out ASAP, meet some more people (if possible) and head for alphabet and tech trading.
So pottery-writing is fine. But then I would do either alphabet directly or maybe sailing first to build trading posts for faster sea scouting (and more food).

We definitely need libraries in both our two first cities fast. And we need at least 1 more worker soon. More cities are not that urgent. We have places for decent cities, but they will not add much science output compared to our first 2 cities.
I don't know, if we find a good way to help Gandhi, but fast research is definitely needed.

We need to know more about the world, but my general idea for helping Gandhi is, that we will let him have our cities we are a building now at some time. So we should look for some far away place where we can retreat then.
Probably it will be only very late in game when most of the space techs are already researched. He should then get cities with all useful improvements and maybe a few academies. If we can get him the internet, we can fill him in on missing techs.
The space elevator and three gorges could boost his building rate.
Every non expiring happiness wonder would be useful.

 

[malekithe]

I thought I made a note about the reason he is not in my notes so the confusion you talk about Malekithe should not have been an issue had you read my turn log???

Apologies, I merely skimmed your notes. Rereading I see the reason was beyond your control.

 

[Wotan]

Apologies, I merely skimmed your notes. Rereading I see the reason was beyond your control.

Unfortunately not beyond my control. I should not have used the drag/drop function with the mouse I guess. Had I used keyboard this would not have happened. If anyone should apologize it should be me...