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SGOTM 12 - Barley Demons

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession GOTM' started by AlanH, Sep 14, 2010.

  1. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    I am fairly doubtful that we'll finish with or without an extension, but we play on! The holidays will be pretty busy for me anyway, so I'd just as soon finish sooner.

    In fact, I think we should implement a semi-random turnset order here. After a set is posted, let's comment as we see fit. Maybe allow 24 hours or so for comments.

    If you didn't just play, and you can play, post that you're playing and take it. Don't play a whole lot of turns, and try to stop at a decision point: What to build? What to improve? What to tech next? What to do in the face of the incoming Stack of Doom?!

    I know this is non-standard, but my free time tends to come in not-so-predictable bunches, so sometimes it's easier for me to comment or play than other times. I don't mind moving the game forward frequently when I can.

    That said, if no one else wants it, I can probably sneak in another turnset tomorrow.
     
  2. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Okay, I've got a little time so I'm going to play a few turns here...
     
  3. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    First thing I want to do is to turn on BUG/BUFFY's autologger. How to do....
    Ctrl-Alt-O...Logging...Click "Start Automatically". Okay, let's go.

    T86 (Inherited Turn): Things look good. Probably Math after Agriculture (Agri for Rice at Moscow)

    T87: Check to see if Autologger is working...I think it is. I thought it would be "autolog.txt" but there's a "Catherine.txt" Seems okay.
    Chariot heading to check out SE part of peninsula. Warriors sent to cities for MP duty.

    T88: Agriculture in; Math next @ 0% for a couple turns.
    Great Spy and Stonehenge in distant lands.
    Alt-Tab to check on autologger...Looks good!

    T89: Roosevelt Golden Age begins. (Great Spy presumably. Wow.)
    Scan map...Yikes!:



    French archer forces (6 of various promotions) inbound at 8 o'clock!

    I spend some time looking around, and consider hooking up the Copper for Axes, but decide the longbows will do well...when they're finished.
    Another turn at 0% research.

    T90: Both cities complete Longbows who are sent toward the French archers. Start another in St Pete and aim to finish the granary in Moscow. Chariot retreats north since archers moved NE next to him.
    Math research to 100%, but finish chop/cottaging a river tile to accelerate St Pete's second longbow (now due in 2T).
    Silver mine completes at Novgorod.

    T91: Longbows move to meet the French. Should be able to attack with 2LBs and the chariot, with another LB to finish next turn....

    T92: Move Longbows, Chariot to the Rice where the Worker starts a road....

    T93: French archers move directly W of the Rice.
    ATTACK!
    Longbow (99%)...wins!
    Longbow (99%)...wins!
    Chariot (71%)...wins!
    The good guys go 3/3 against the Combat I French archers. Only 3 CGI archers remain....
    Worker completes the Rice Road.

    T94: French forces retreat to the south:



    I finished some obvious worker moves and moved our still-exploring western warrior, but I left the troops unmoved.

    Our advance guard is wounded: Both LBs are at 3.5/6, and the Chariot barely survived at 0.4/4. Another LB is poised ready to cover them.

    I suggest that we let the fresh LB catch up, then move the whole ensemble to an overview mountain to guard this approach.

    Techwise, I suggest Math, Masonry, Construction. And getting cats and elephants up.

    Also, I think we should give up on the city gift plan and just concentrate on improving our existing lands.

    Dotmap suggestions?



    And the spiffy (new to me) BUFFY autolog:

    Spoiler :

    Logging by BUFFY 3.19.003 (BtS 3.19)
    ------------------------------------------------
    Turn 86 (725 BC) [10-Nov-2010 14:40:06]
    100% Research: 42 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -7 per turn, 17 in the bank

    Turn 87 (700 BC) [10-Nov-2010 14:40:06]
    100% Research: 42 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -8 per turn, 10 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    Tech research finished: Agriculture
    Novgorod's borders expand

    Other Player Actions:
    Civics Change: Gandhi(India) from 'Paganism' to 'Organized Religion'

    Turn 88 (675 BC) [10-Nov-2010 14:46:23]
    Research begun: Mathematics (7 Turns)
    0% Research: 0 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    100% Gold: 27 per turn, 2 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    Novgorod grows to size 2

    Turn 89 (650 BC) [10-Nov-2010 14:50:01]
    0% Research: 0 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    100% Gold: 29 per turn, 29 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    Moscow finishes: Longbowman
    St. Petersburg finishes: Longbowman

    Turn 90 (625 BC) [10-Nov-2010 15:10:35]
    Longbowman 1 (Moscow) promoted: Combat I
    St. Petersburg begins: Longbowman (4 turns)
    A Cottage was built near St. Petersburg
    A Mine was built near Novgorod
    100% Research: 48 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -7 per turn, 58 in the bank

    Turn 91 (600 BC) [10-Nov-2010 15:16:53]
    Longbowman 2 (St. Petersburg) promoted: Combat I
    A Farm was built near Moscow
    100% Research: 50 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -7 per turn, 51 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    Moscow finishes: Granary
    St. Petersburg finishes: Longbowman

    Turn 92 (575 BC) [10-Nov-2010 15:21:31]
    Longbowman 3 (St. Petersburg) promoted: Combat I
    100% Research: 50 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -7 per turn, 44 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    St. Petersburg grows to size 7

    Turn 93 (550 BC) [10-Nov-2010 15:25:27]
    While attacking, Longbowman 1 (Moscow) decimates French Archer (Prob Victory: 99.1%)
    While attacking in the wild, Longbowman 1 (Moscow) (3.48/6) defeats French Archer (Prob Victory: 99.1%)
    While attacking, Longbowman 2 (St. Petersburg) decimates French Archer (Prob Victory: 99.1%)
    While attacking in the wild, Longbowman 2 (St. Petersburg) (3.48/6) defeats French Archer (Prob Victory: 99.1%)
    While attacking, Chariot 1 (St. Petersburg) decimates French Archer (Prob Victory: 68.1%)
    While attacking in the wild, Chariot 1 (St. Petersburg) (0.40/4) defeats French Archer (Prob Victory: 68.1%)
    100% Research: 50 per turn
    0% Espionage: 4 per turn
    0% Gold: -7 per turn, 37 in the bank

    After End Turn:
    St. Petersburg finishes: Lighthouse

    Other Player Actions:
    Attitude Change: Mao Zedong (China) towards Roosevelt (America), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased'

    Turn 94 (525 BC) [10-Nov-2010 15:32:11]
    A Camp was built near Novgorod


    The latest (525BC) save.
     
  4. ruff_hi

    ruff_hi Live 4ever! Or die trying

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    we have a little bit more time ...
     
  5. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Looks like my turnset report ninja'd ya by one minute, Ruff. :lol:

    Any thoughts about the next turnset or two?

    In particular, I'm wondering where we should put our next couple cities. And when (do we delay our tech to Construction to get them settled asap? I think we want about 3 workers at each city site to get things prepped for the settler.

    And I think we should be growing into cottages in the core cities. Not sure about infrastructure builds, though Granary first in the new ones seems good.

    Also, we should think about Great People a little bit. Do we want to try to get A Scientist or let the Prophet naturally occur?
     
  6. ruff_hi

    ruff_hi Live 4ever! Or die trying

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    That 'decimates' stuff shouldn't happen. It should only get triggered if a cat attacks and withdraws (max damage). Guess someone should look at that logger code.
     
  7. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    I think I ninja posted you again, Ruff!

    I have to say that I really like the format that the BUFFY (BUG?) autologger writes though. Very nice.

    In that particular case with 99%+ odds, it would have been nice not to be knocked down to 3.5/6.0 strength...twice. :rolleyes:

    One thing that disturbed me about this turnset was that the attacking French archers sidestepped our longbows instead of attacking them. I don't see any single-tile choke points either.

    This was one of the considerations which leads me to think we'll want cats and elephants.

    And can we build a fort SW of Novgorod for a naval invasion of Paris? Is it worth it to try to send...say...four galleys of cats/elephants for a surprise assault there? Not sure. Naval invasions, especially early, aren't something I have a lot of experience with.

    I will probably have time on Friday to run some more turns, but welcome either of you to run the next set if you can!
     
  8. ruff_hi

    ruff_hi Live 4ever! Or die trying

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    I'll like your set. I will try and look closer at the game tomorrow.
     
  9. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    I can probably run another few turns late tonight (~12 hours from this post). My plan is just to complete Mathematics research.

    Just trying to keep the game moving forward. I would be quite pleased if we could finish by the original (Dec 20th) finish date.

    I'll try to see if it makes sense to get another settler under way. I lean toward Ruff's placement of a production city 1N of the Rice and 5W1N of Moscow.

    Also, I lean toward Construction after Mathematics. It gets us Cats, Elephants, and (cheap for Creative us) Coliseums.
     
  10. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    The time never freed up last night. But seems highly probably tonight or tomorrow.

    Any suggestions? Or does anyone else want to run a few turns?
     
  11. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

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    How aggressive do we want to be in the future??, Do we want to try to Knock France down to 2 citys, Get peace so we can concentrate trying to get ourselves a decent Core size before England and France take all the choice land to the south.
    If so, Construction for Elephants and Catapults is definatly our Proity in the short term.
     
  12. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Good question about how aggressive to be.

    While France is anywhere near military parity with us, we will be vulnerable to a cross-bay invasion from France. It would be nice to resign them to minor civ status.

    One way to do this is a military buildup. In that case, I think we want Construction, Cats and Elephants. I suspect a land route would be fine.

    Another possibility--though it seems remote right now--would be to found a religion, say Confucianism (can we be first to CoL?) or Taoism (with a Scientist), and gift a city with the religion to them. While this might work, I think our window of prime opportunity to try it may have passed.

    Since we have Longbows, maybe we want to found a city (our GP city or a stone-grab city?) to draw the AI's fire?
     
  13. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

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    iirc your Last best guess about City peace gifting went out the window at 3-4 Cities, and they are already at that stage. So yea, City Cheese is Shelved for now i think.

    Nether of our neigbours have founded a religion yet, and with Stalin and Gandhi taking the yearly 2, if we get construction now we can, while building up our militry ether take a gambit on Judism or get going towards CoL.
     
  14. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

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    Spam Alert:

    I agree regarding the GP City with LB - it makes complete Scence as it can work for us 2 fold.
    1) creates a Front line that allows us to, withing reason, Safley work behind it building our civ up
    2) the sooner we get a GP Farm up and running, the quicker we will have some options regarding Bulbing Techs.
     
  15. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Regarding Religion, Judaism fell in 1280BC; Stalin went Org Rel in 950BC, and Gandhi went OR in 700BC. I think we'd be lucky to get Confucianism, but we're probably in good shape for Taoism if we get a Scientist.

    As for the cities-for-peace, I suspect that if we found one close to the French borders, they'd take it. It's only the distant (and utterly useless) ice cities that won't be appealing to them now. (Assuming the test game is reasonably accurate here.)

    Just not sure.... I guess military buildup is safest. If DeGaulle settles south of Paris (and why wouldn't he?) He'll have elephants at Construction too. :(
     
  16. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Just finished a (much) busier than expected week. AFK for a couple days now. Then maybe we can get back to some turnsets....
     
  17. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

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    Well, I had some time to play this yesterday, but I didn't. I looked over the situation and realized that if a stack of archers aren't going to attack our Longbows, then our Feudalism isn't going to do us a whole lot of good; the at-war AI will simply pillage us if we try the AI tactic of huddling in cities. Also, Slavery is probably a better civic than Serfdom even on this map.

    I wonder if any of the other teams managed to pull off a Civil Service slingshot on this map.

    I think I'm finished with this attempt, and given the paucity of posts, I'd say I'm the last one to come to this forgone conclusion.

    So, I think I can safely say: The Barley Demons will not be completing SGOTM12.

    I did enjoy the time I spent thinking about this game, and I thank everyone who participated (so long ago, for the most part!) Maybe next time we'll go further....
     
  18. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    It is a shame you did not complete this. The serfdom approach was different albeit serfdom is often said to be the worst game civic. Interesting on a map like this if it saves on workers.

    I would of liked to of seen you build GLH. That start gives you 2 cities straight off the bat and the GLH allows your gold city to grow onto the 2 gold. Your slower start could of given great yields if you managed Oracle for CS.

    I am sure you will all be back for next game. :)
     
  19. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Are you guys not coming back this game?? :(
     
  20. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

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    I cannot speak for the others, but i know alot of us ATM are in the middle of afew games already and would be hard pushed to find the time to SGOTM 13 that it both deserves and needs. On the plus side, they seem to be rolling along quite quickly at the moment so maybe SGOTM 14 as and when it arrives.

    Adlain.
     

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