1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

SGOTM 12 - Barley Demons

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession GOTM' started by AlanH, Sep 14, 2010.

  1. pocketbeetle

    pocketbeetle Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    80
    Hey Comp, just stick me in the lurker category for now.
    I still hate the hof mod, so let's call me an emergency turnplayer and critical lurker. :)

    Will try and run through the testsave soon, agree with Ruff's tin foil hat theory of Stalin having a few nukes.
     
  2. Aamelia

    Aamelia Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    Put me as a last-ditch turn-player... i'm barely managing monarch, and will do mistakes if called on to play, but if there's no choice i'll take it.
     
  3. Aamelia

    Aamelia Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    It could be Fission an and extra A Era tech... i'm willing to stake that he definitely starts with Fission, if only because he's the person who nuked everyone in the first place, and thematically he'll be the one using nukes.

    About the no fallout left thing, should we get UN and ban nukes? That will stop the fallout from nukes (and stop Stalin from using his nukes, if he isn't dead).
     
  4. regoarrarr

    regoarrarr King

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2001
    Messages:
    847
    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    So do we have any consensus to move NE and end turn? That allows us to either settle NE or move N-settle on T1.

    Who is our first turn player?
     
  5. ruff_hi

    ruff_hi Live 4ever! Or die trying

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2005
    Messages:
    9,095
    Location:
    an Aussie in Boston
    Do we have a consensus? I'm happy to play the first 10 or so if you want me to.
     
  6. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    1,601
    Welcome back timmy.

    I'm fine with Ruff running the first few turns. (Keep an eye on how the AI's info bars change for regoarrarr.)

    I was hoping to play a bit at practice openings beforehand though. Give me...10 hours from now. If I don't get a chance before that, I won't get a chance in any reasonable amount of time.

    I did run a few quick turns just to see what the AI would do. It made archers everywhere first. (And started with them half-completed!), then every civ went immediately to a worker.

    Fishing comes in pretty quickly....
     
  7. regoarrarr

    regoarrarr King

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2001
    Messages:
    847
    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    I'd like someone to just play the first turn and then upload the score / demographics.

    I noodled around with the test save above and here's a problem.

    If we settle in place, we're at break even health (7 health - 2 from fresh water 2 from difficulty and 3 from forests vs 7 unhealty - 6 fallout and 1 pop).

    Settling N-NE gives 3 health (2 difficulty and 1 forest) vs. 4 unhealthy (3 fallout 1 pop).

    Settling NE gives the same 3 health but 5 unhealthy (4 fallout 1 pop).

    So settling in place gives worker in 15, but N-NE has worker in 20 and NE has worker in 30!!!

    So maybe we're not quite ready to play yet.
     
  8. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    1,601
    Aaargh! I must be getting exhausted. I just backpedaled in the browser and lost my writeup here!

    Let's see what I can do from memory.... I ran 3 test cases out about 30T.

    1) Settled in place. Good: river for +2 health, 2nd ring 3H tile. Bad: No ocean access.
    Spoiler :


    2) Settled SE. Good: don't care about -2F from unhealthiness at size 0, so get 4H production from Turn 1. Went Fishing then Sailing while Settler first. Settler went up to NNE from start. At T30, just a few turns from second workboat and worker in Novgorod.

    Spoiler :


    3) Settled NNE. Good: location. Bad: -1F from unhealthiness at size 1 until worker can remove a fallout.

    Spoiler :


    Again...aaargh. I'm too exhausted to recall anything but thinking that SE is actually the fastest start, though it leaves with a not-so-great capital (15H at size 5 working Cow, Rice, 3PH).

    More thoughts tomorrow.

    Edit: Okay, I at least saved the game after each run. And I added a screenshot from when I stopped the test run.
     
  9. pocketbeetle

    pocketbeetle Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2010
    Messages:
    80
    No rush guys, we've got literally months to play this game, and it's what? Normal speed?

    Think Comp makes a good point about moving SE.
    Anyone able to get better/different results?
     
  10. Sareln

    Sareln Warlord

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2005
    Messages:
    211
    Location:
    Davis, CA
    S-A-R-E-L-N :p Other than that, looks good.
     
  11. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2010
    Messages:
    49
    i guess i had better get Civ with that mod working properly on my system - has been alittle iffy scince i upgraded to 64 Bit OS still, nothing that aint workaround able (mostly Graphical)
     
  12. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    1,601
    Thanks for the correction Sareln.

    Yes, we need you Adlain!

    I'll try to find more time tonight to move forward a bit more in the playtests. For now, my preference is for moving SE first. Probably a capital move later.
     
  13. timmy827

    timmy827 King

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    658
    Location:
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Checking in. My 2c would be the 2N1E location; think that the slightly slower start would be made up for by having the good city be the capital but will wait to see how the test games go.
     
  14. Adlain

    Adlain Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2010
    Messages:
    49
    Turns out it was just some corrupted files from the last install. Looks like it's fixed now :).
     
  15. Jabah

    Jabah Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2001
    Messages:
    1,281
    Location:
    Paris, France
    SE seems good, with the only potentiel big problem is that we won't be able to work any possible seafood further south.

    As an addiction to the test run by Comprise SE, I would be curious to see the result of this:
    1. settle SE
    2. start settler ASAP (you stay at size1, working 3h in the previous test, so why not go extrem)
    3. after, WBx2 then warrior or worker or ?
    4. City #2 grow to size2 then go workersss for a while (and grow unto gold mine #1 and #2 when ready)

    Jabah
     
  16. regoarrarr

    regoarrarr King

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2001
    Messages:
    847
    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    Isn't that what Compromise did?
     
  17. Jabah

    Jabah Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2001
    Messages:
    1,281
    Location:
    Paris, France
    Indeed, I didn't read properly :)
    Well, almost, I would try to grow to size2 before (or just in time for) WB2, but that is almost for turn 25-35
     
  18. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    1,601
    Hey Jabah,

    Yes, that's what I did, except for the growing to size 2. I believe it's 3T to the second workboat in Moscow and 5T to the worker in Novgorod. It seems like we'd get more out of an early worker than getting to size 2 asap, but I'll try again tonight and see if I can optimize it.

    I think the biggest downside of going SE first is that we've packed our first two cities on this single peninsula. By doing so, we're making it more expensive to found cities elsewhere.

    I think the bonus to early production offsets this, especially since I expect that it will require a number of worker turns to improve other sites such that they will be profitable to work. I hope we can outplay the AI in this aspect of the game.

    Also, I'm not sure about our early tech order. I went Fishing->Sailing in my test. Sailing finished just as the second city was founded, thus connecting the seafood resource(s) and yielding 1gpt for each city to help offset the second city costs.

    Fishing has to finish with or before our initial settler so that a workboat can get to the fish for the second city (Novgorod) asap. But maybe we want Bronzeworking or Animal Husbandry earlier? But maybe it's okay to just get to the seafood and the gold mines asap, so resource revelations can wait. I'll play with this a little.

    Another thing to note about the save game is that I haven't nuked anybody, so maybe peace will be delayed in the actual game. Does anyone know if this difference in attitude (-3 at war -3 declared -2 you nuked us versus -3 at war -3 declared) will make a difference about the date the AI will be willing to settle for peace?
     
  19. Jabah

    Jabah Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2001
    Messages:
    1,281
    Location:
    Paris, France
    One risk of this opening is the no-military for 30t while we know there is (at least) 1 AI on our continent.
    Another good point for SE is that it could build a warrior much quicker than anyother position (except central, but central shouldn't be consider).
    City 2 could grow to size 2 while building also a warrior for safety.
     
  20. Compromise

    Compromise Emperor

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Messages:
    1,601
    Sorry about the delay.... Real life is the ultimate distraction. Comparison of SE and NNE coming up here....
     

Share This Page