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SGOTM 26 - Lurkers Thread

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession GOTM' started by Noble Zarkon, Aug 30, 2020.

  1. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Super Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    !!IF YOU ARE PARTICIPATING IN SGOTM 26 PLEASE LEAVE NOW!!

    Lurkers only!!



    To end Winter you must build 7 cities, each a tribute to one face of god, each city must have a Temple of your state religion and also certain other buildings. You will need to put your best minds to work to establish how to create these buildings.

    Prophet- Dun, Temple, Monastery, Cathedral, Moai Statues, Great Wonder generating Great Prophet points

    Merchant - Dun, Temple, Market, Bank, Wall Street, Great Wonder generating Great Merchant points

    Artist - Dun, Temple, Theatre, Broadcast Tower, Globe Theatre, Great Wonder generating Great Artist points

    Scientist - Dun, Temple, Library, Lab, Oxford University, Great Wonder generating Great Scientist points

    General- Dun, Temple, Barracks, Drydock, Heroic Epic, Corporation HQ

    Engineer - Dun, Temple, Forge, Industrial Park, Ironworks, Great Wonder generating Great Engineer points

    Spy - Dun, Temple, Courthouse, Intelligence Agency, West Point, Great Wonder generating Great Spy points

    You may construct other buildings in each city, as well as the requirements noted above, provided you only build exactly 6 Great Wonders and found exactly 1 Corporation.

    You do NOT need to generate the appropriate great person just build the right Wonders in each city.

    You must be running a State Religion when you win the game, but it is up to you which one you use however you must have temples of that religion in each city as well as the cathedral in the Prophet city.​

    (Cathedral is used in the generic sense it does not have to be a Christian Cathedral e.g. the Stupa is defined in-game as "the Buddhist Cathedral").
     
  2. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Super Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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  3. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Super Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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  4. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Super Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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  5. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Elite Quattromaster - Emperor (BTS) Super Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    So what do you think so far? Anything of note? Please consider putting revealing information (e.g. predicted end dates) in spoilers just in case!
     
  6. Fippy

    Fippy Mycro Junkie Queen

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    :wavey:
    First i want to :worship: :thumbsup: at NZ for making this happen again, i think we saw how interesting sgotm can still be even with fewer teams.
    And ofc AlanH & everybody who worked on the map or admininstration.

    Will work on a summary of our game for this thread when i have time, trying to include as many details as i can think of.
     
  7. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Thanks to AlanH and NZ for such a great game.

    Good idea on Summary. I am interested in comparing raw science with HS saves.

    Also test my theory on trading for techs. It looks like we traded for several 2-3k techs with AI.Interesting to see how this impacted the end result with HS. Lots ot compare once they finish.
     
  8. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Yep.:.thanks to Alan and Noble for making this happen.
     
  9. Fine_Distinction

    Fine_Distinction Prince

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    Yeah, the summary would be great! Especially a fairly detailed one :) I was lurking your thread pretty consistently - and I think I figured most of the lingo (kermit, moo :p) - but there is not that many "big picture" posts, it seems mostly your working, day-to-day thread (nothing wrong with that), so the summary will be great for the posterity :D and lurkers like me.

    And I also hope it is not the last sGOTM! BTW, the BOTM seems to increase in popularity now.
     
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  10. Fippy

    Fippy Mycro Junkie Queen

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  11. Qactus

    Qactus Romani ite domum

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    I'm very much looking forward to reading the summary. Your rather convoluted way of posting didn't make it especially easy to see what was going on when only checking in once every couple of weeks. But I was definitely rooting for you and I was impressed by the way you got the most expensive tech out of the way asap. Kudos to you! :goodjob:
     
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  12. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Techs on this list is the techs the other team did not have.

    1400BC
    PR +97BPT -50 gold 22 pop Writing. 7 cities. Capital size 7! Trade routes 33C
    HS +67BPT -40 gold. 18 pop Med/PH. 6 cities. Cap size 4. Trade routes 12C.

    1800BC
    PR +54BPT -35 6 cities. Masonry. 18 pop. 12C trade routes. Tripple seafood SB city not settled.
    HS +54 -36 TW/Pottery. 6 cities. 17 pop 12C trade routes. 7th settler on sheep island? Double clams not settled.

    1AD
    PR 346 BPT stronomy, theo, philosophy(Bulbed), music, lit, aesth, compass, optics and machinery. 6 AI met. GLH mixed with mids and rep really pays off here in a huge way.
    78C from trade routes.
    Current highest GP score 465. (4 GP)

    HS 245 bpt. Edu/CS. HS completing Machinery soon. 2 AI met.
    30C from trade routes.
    Current highest GP score 131 (1 GP)

    680AD Both teams could take med from Liberalism. Both teams had a GM and GS. HS ahead on GP. 1200/1600.
    PR 585BPT
    HS 376BPT
    HS Corp PR Astronomy. Both teams mostly completed Lib.
    Looks like HS has bulbed quite a few techs to do this. PR holding back for Electricity.

    1010AD
    PR 684BPT
    HS 433 BPT

    HS pop 49 PR pop 86

    HS had - Constitution/Lib/Med/Economics/Corp
    PR had - Astronomy/physics/elec. Refrigeration 1055. lib -1683


    More facts
    PR
    Alphabet 875BC
    Philosophy 775BC
    Superconductors 1070AD.

    PR free techs - Corp, Mil Science, Constitution, MT, Div Right, Banking, Guilds, Feud, IW, Aesth, Lit. (Working on this list.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
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  13. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    Yep..unfortunately what is confusing for the lurkerhood, is very convenient and functional for the team. :cool: Basically, what amounts to 4 separate active posts by 4 team members equates to like 40 to 60 posts in one session. Very hard to sift through for the team. It's basically like having a "chat" with those 4 posts without having a chat room, and in which our thought processes are "current", but Latin to anyone deciphering it later..ha
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2020
  14. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Not followed this at all since I've been gone for ages, but dropped by a few threads recently, and saw the development. Been reading the first 8 pages of the PR thread today, and it's a little tricky to follow, haha. Very impressive early testing and micro though, Fippy is indeed the Queen. Impressive to win that quickly given the terrible land and the 7-city restriction (but nice to not have to build any settlers I suppose). Think the realisation has sunk in among the bakers now, especially if they see team member posts in here (last post).

    Would greatly appreciate some type of analysis of games, by all teams really, once they finish. Awesome for the lurkers :)
     
  15. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    When I get a chance I will work on more numbers. A map that had no fish resources was not ideal for sushi. Albeit the ai will likely settle more cities with sea food. Too late maybe? HS met the ai very late here. Even at 1ad their strategy took them away from compass. We had met all ai by then.


    I wonder what date might be possible here. If we had traded for steel that is another 3-4 turns. They had predicted turn 205 with sushi.

    HS in caste and they can't whip their final builds like we did. No gp for final golden age.
     
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  16. Fine_Distinction

    Fine_Distinction Prince

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    x-post with @Gumbolt
    Yeah, the lurkerhood (?) will definitely appreciate the analysis of different strategies.

    From my casual lurking, I noticed two things that the Phoenixians did better: Fippy's realization that they can settle 3nd city very early on (T5?) and setting it in a better position than Homies (2Clams vs. Canals). I guess Homies went with "food is king" heuristics and chose 3xseafood over 2seafood while PR appreciated decent production of 2Clams and its moderate maintenance. Given that it took Homies relatively long time to research BW - and that settlers were not needed in that game and not even that many workers - the Canal city was probably not that useful? I mean, adding some research, but also increasing maintenance. I wondered if that is the main reason for PR teching much faster than HS? It probably (mostly) explains their already substantially higher score on ~T31? 2Clams, with its nice prod, allowed also for a scouting WB earlier, I think PR meat some AIs ~35t vs. almost t70 for HS? Having GLH, PR was naturally more motivated to meet AIs, but maybe that also helped with teching/score? and definitely knowing map earlier was helpful for planning.

    What HS, or at least WT seems to think is a mistake costing them them game is going all-in for an early (and non-mandatory) Sushi. It makes sense, sushi is expensive both tech-wise and maint-wise, and they sacrificed a lot to beeline it. And also the did not want to deal with unpredictability (and various annoyances) of AP, which PR bravely took on - and mastered the underlying mechanics! But it sure created a nerve-wracking finish :popcorn:

    At this point, poor Homies mostly realized that they are ~10t behind, but must play on to preserve integrity of the game. Looks like there is nothing they can do at this point to increase their research 50% (the only way to finish ca. t210), so looks like we can congratulate Phoenixians not only on a great game, but on :trophy: :) :clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2020
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  17. Qactus

    Qactus Romani ite domum

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    Did I understand correctly that you achieved a religious victory, but it was counted as a UN victory because you obsoleted the AP on the turn of the vote by bulbing Mass Media?
    If so, it makes me wonder if that could have implications for HoF play similar to the discovery of espionage/spread culture victory, i.e. a new way of achieving a victory condition that is always faster than doing it traditionally :think:
     
  18. Fine_Distinction

    Fine_Distinction Prince

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    Was a joke, don't feel bad, I also fell for it
     
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  19. Fine_Distinction

    Fine_Distinction Prince

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    Another thing that I am very curious about - does anybody understand the complex machinations Homies did to make certain AI eg be 4th in score and other AIs liking them less because of it? Apparently being above or below in score affects AI war bribe-ability? :confused:

    may have to wait a month until Homies finish their game.
     
  20. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Don't know what that is about or if it applies here (the thread is only 300 pages, come on! :lol: ), however: If both the human and the relevant AI is in the lower half of the scoreboard, you get +1 for kinda sucking->Developing civilizations should cooperate or some such language.
     
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