SGOTM 9 - jeffelammar
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
No, I did not have too much fun... I don't enjoy modern warfare too much, espacially if I'm not allowed to take opponents towns (even if the flip 
).
That's why I for my part am not too ambitious to go for the space dumbo. Although with probably losing to teams Klarius and Wacken I would appreciate a unique trophy for that effort we took.
Does anyone like to calculate how many turns we needed from getting last space tech to Gandhi finishing Apollo? Way too many I figure...
Sorry I do sound depressive but I am a little disappointed with our endgame. I suffered a space loss once in a Gotm (where Persia sat on that island inside my donut, I got the ambulance in that one) and I do not know why Gandhi is so earth bound. Or am I too impatient? Maybe.
In that gotm I was clearly superior in military and in replays I tried to invade X-Man but still failed (okay, my early civ3 days, now I would kill him in three turns
).
).That's why I for my part am not too ambitious to go for the space dumbo. Although with probably losing to teams Klarius and Wacken I would appreciate a unique trophy for that effort we took.
Does anyone like to calculate how many turns we needed from getting last space tech to Gandhi finishing Apollo? Way too many I figure...
Sorry I do sound depressive but I am a little disappointed with our endgame. I suffered a space loss once in a Gotm (where Persia sat on that island inside my donut, I got the ambulance in that one) and I do not know why Gandhi is so earth bound. Or am I too impatient? Maybe.
In that gotm I was clearly superior in military and in replays I tried to invade X-Man but still failed (okay, my early civ3 days, now I would kill him in three turns
).I've got the save. I'll probably be able to play tomorrow.
Good deal with getting Apollo built, Paul.
I'm not really fond of modern warfare, either, except when I'm the only one with modern units. I'll slog along, though. I'll go for the rest of the oil, to see if this helps encourage Ghandi to build space ship parts.
Good deal with getting Apollo built, Paul.
I'm not really fond of modern warfare, either, except when I'm the only one with modern units. I'll slog along, though. I'll go for the rest of the oil, to see if this helps encourage Ghandi to build space ship parts.
Here is the save.
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm9/Jeffelammar_SG009_AD1900_01.SAV
Turn 0: Look for oil, pillage oil by Stockholm. Decide we need a base on the small island to the east.
Turns 1-10: I bomb, they bomb. They land a few invasion forces, all of which I decimate with bombers before they attack, whereupon the survivors decide not to attack, allowing me to bomb the rest of them.
Turn 5: I build a city on the eastern island, and the troops on it suicide against my defenders.
Turn 6: Raze New Hammerfest. India learns advanced flight.
Turn 7: Celts and India make peace, and Celts declare on us.
Turn 8: Take Reykjavik from Celts.
Turn 10: We can bomb the northern oil colony from Spain!
I refuse 3 flips.
We have MA armies on mountains near two of Indias oil resources. We can bomb another from the small island, and I finally realized that we can reach the northern oil field from Spain.
I lost some ships, discovering that I'm lousy at naval warfare, but mostly the warfare was uneventful.
Nobody's building spaceship parts yet.
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm9/Jeffelammar_SG009_AD1900_01.SAV
Turn 0: Look for oil, pillage oil by Stockholm. Decide we need a base on the small island to the east.
Turns 1-10: I bomb, they bomb. They land a few invasion forces, all of which I decimate with bombers before they attack, whereupon the survivors decide not to attack, allowing me to bomb the rest of them.
Turn 5: I build a city on the eastern island, and the troops on it suicide against my defenders.
Turn 6: Raze New Hammerfest. India learns advanced flight.
Turn 7: Celts and India make peace, and Celts declare on us.
Turn 8: Take Reykjavik from Celts.
Turn 10: We can bomb the northern oil colony from Spain!
I refuse 3 flips.
We have MA armies on mountains near two of Indias oil resources. We can bomb another from the small island, and I finally realized that we can reach the northern oil field from Spain.
I lost some ships, discovering that I'm lousy at naval warfare, but mostly the warfare was uneventful.
Nobody's building spaceship parts yet.
denyd
Emperor
I got it and should be able to play tonight.
Do I have any specific goals that to try to accomplish?
There shouldn't be much left on our todo list.
Do I have any specific goals that to try to accomplish?
There shouldn't be much left on our todo list.
denyd
Emperor
I just got back from 12 hours at Disneyland, so playing will have to be delayed until tomorrow night.
Do you think nuking some minor cities might convince him to go for space?
How about saying goodbye to Brennus?
Do you think nuking some minor cities might convince him to go for space?
How about saying goodbye to Brennus?
I feel the main problem might be Gandhi's small distance to domination limit. In my space loss to X-man he was well below 30% of land mass (I actually had 67% of land mass but only ~55% of population because he had some metropolices). I guess that encouraged him to find another way. Imo Ai has a strict order of victory types to "aim" for: first domination or conquest, than space. Diplo and culture only happen by chance.
So I say: Put domination far out of reach for Gandhi without hurting (and threatening
) his core. This target conflict might be a problem and could have been solved much easier with Gandhi on the spanish continent 
So I say: Put domination far out of reach for Gandhi without hurting (and threatening
) his core. This target conflict might be a problem and could have been solved much easier with Gandhi on the spanish continent
denyd
Emperor
Progress report:
4 Turns complete and at a decision point
I'm building Manhattan Project and once this turn completes a switch (to SS Engine) will waste shields. So do we want nukes in the game?
I've cutoff Gandhi's oil and destroyed most of his Air Forvce and I'm working on his Navy.
I razed a couple of cities in Spain that he didn't need.
I'm thinking about re-claiming our old tundra locations to add a luxury and lock up an oil site. That might cause him to think about a space win.
Any thoughts about nuking one of his island holdings?
How about taking out Brennus or at least nuking his capital?
I'll finish up tomorrow after the team has a chance to comment.
4 Turns complete and at a decision point
I'm building Manhattan Project and once this turn completes a switch (to SS Engine) will waste shields. So do we want nukes in the game?
I've cutoff Gandhi's oil and destroyed most of his Air Forvce and I'm working on his Navy.
I razed a couple of cities in Spain that he didn't need.
I'm thinking about re-claiming our old tundra locations to add a luxury and lock up an oil site. That might cause him to think about a space win.
Any thoughts about nuking one of his island holdings?
How about taking out Brennus or at least nuking his capital?
I'll finish up tomorrow after the team has a chance to comment.
Good job about the oil!
I'm not in favor of nuking. But if you like it - go ahead.
However I won't like the counter strike.
Brennus - I don't care too much for him. He's no thread either. Do what you like.
We have to be sure that Gandhi has intact trade routes from Spain. So watch fighters and ships. Check it by inspecting cities on our old continent and their resources.
Here's a point to discuss for those who want the space dumbo badly:
If Gandhi keeps not building space parts, we might conclude that we want him to be on a smaller island on his own and nowhere else in the world so he gets bored there because domination is out of reach (like X-Man did in the Gotm that impressed me so much). How does the team think about expelling Gandhi to Spain (and by that cancel all our nice preparations that don't work anyway)?
I'm not in favor of nuking. But if you like it - go ahead.
However I won't like the counter strike.
Brennus - I don't care too much for him. He's no thread either. Do what you like.
We have to be sure that Gandhi has intact trade routes from Spain. So watch fighters and ships. Check it by inspecting cities on our old continent and their resources.
Here's a point to discuss for those who want the space dumbo badly:
If Gandhi keeps not building space parts, we might conclude that we want him to be on a smaller island on his own and nowhere else in the world so he gets bored there because domination is out of reach (like X-Man did in the Gotm that impressed me so much). How does the team think about expelling Gandhi to Spain (and by that cancel all our nice preparations that don't work anyway)?
jeffelammar
Space for rent
I don't think we should build Manhattan. If Ghandi starts building it, we should use Entremont to beat him to it, (Hopefully forcing a switch to a nice space ship part)
I think that at this point we should occupy all un-claimed territory.
I agree that we should try cutting Ghandi down to a smaller size. We need to leave him spain and we should let him keep Stavanger. (We don't want him to have to rebuild apollo)
If we leave Aarhus for last on our homeland, his palace should jump to his Spanish holdings.
Edit: I'm going to be out of town for the next 5 days, so will need a skip or switch.
Havok.
I think that at this point we should occupy all un-claimed territory.
I agree that we should try cutting Ghandi down to a smaller size. We need to leave him spain and we should let him keep Stavanger. (We don't want him to have to rebuild apollo)
If we leave Aarhus for last on our homeland, his palace should jump to his Spanish holdings.
Edit: I'm going to be out of town for the next 5 days, so will need a skip or switch.
Havok.
I'd rather put off nukes as long as possible, so I'd rather not build the Manhattan Project. Since Ghandi doesn't seem to be in any hurry to build it either, I'd rather enjoy not having to mess with nukes, especially since he can't build planes or most ships without oil.
Brennus isn't a threat, whether we eliminate him or not. I don't have a preference either way.
We do need to watch Ghandi's trade routes. Moving him to Spain would give him fewer options but all the resources he needs. It would also involve a big campaign on the original continent. If people are itching for war, go for it. He isn't being productive where he is anyway, and we did develop the Spanish cities reasonably well.
Brennus isn't a threat, whether we eliminate him or not. I don't have a preference either way.
We do need to watch Ghandi's trade routes. Moving him to Spain would give him fewer options but all the resources he needs. It would also involve a big campaign on the original continent. If people are itching for war, go for it. He isn't being productive where he is anyway, and we did develop the Spanish cities reasonably well.
I don't know about moving Ghandi to Spain. It seems like it would set him waaay back in production and income. Sure, he's not doing what we want yet, but we could still trim him down quite a bit without relocating him. I guess if it were solely up to me, I'd take him down to ~20-30% of land area first (plus take a huge power lead) and see if he builds any parts before evicting him.
And I'd say let's leave nukes off the table until we have no choice.
And I'd say let's leave nukes off the table until we have no choice.
jeffelammar
Space for rent
Good points Jove. I agree on both.
Right. Cut him short is the best choice for now.
The move-to-spain-option was just an idea if we cut him short and he does not show the right reaction. If we can recapture the north of our former continent and build some kind of death zone (pillage & maybe forest). between him and us, it might be enough to make him change his targets.
Without oil he will hopefully build more defensive units so he does not feel threatened too much to build space parts. Quite a balance act there...
The move-to-spain-option was just an idea if we cut him short and he does not show the right reaction. If we can recapture the north of our former continent and build some kind of death zone (pillage & maybe forest). between him and us, it might be enough to make him change his targets.
Without oil he will hopefully build more defensive units so he does not feel threatened too much to build space parts. Quite a balance act there...
denyd
Emperor
http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm9/Jeffelammar_SG009_AD1920_01.SAV
Turn Log 7
Turn 0 1900 AD We raze New Hanningsvag and clean up a little pollution I plan on nuking a an Indian city just for fun
IBT: Helsinki rebuffs a 2 marine invasion Entremont starts the Manhattan Project
Turn 1 1902 AD New Aarhus and a chunk of Indian the air-force is razed Indian is also short 4 destroyers for a couple of bombers
IBT: Our mighty Battleship sinks 3 Aegis Cruisers India lands a 4 MA invasion force by Helsinki
Turn 2 1904 AD That invasion force and the 3 DDE & 1 Transport that carried it in are gone Only 1 tile left and India oil pipeline will be cut
IBT: Lose a DDE - Decline the Ta-tu flip
Turn 3 1906 AD Indian oil cutoff Switch Entremont to SS Engines A couple of questions:
Why so many mobile SAM units?
Why are we defending coastal cities with units with a less than 10 defense when we can build Mech Infantry?
Why are we using Marines for defense?
Why were undefended workers left on a coastal tile?
Why did we build Regular units?
IBT: Just a couple of bombardments
Turn 4 1908 AD Punjab is captured A couple of Indian MI are destroyed
IBT: MA defending Punjab gets a MGL who dies when Punjab falls Barcelona flips to us and I keep it
Turn 5 1910 AD Task force heads for the home country Kill a couple of exposed MIs Somehow I cut off his Aluminum, so I pull out of Barcelona
IBT: Barcelona falls Entremont completes SS Engines
Turn 6 1912 AD Land the first settler to return home Note that India has Aluminum re-connected (also Uranium & Rubber) but no oil
IBT: Lose a Destroyer and Entremont is Stealth Bombed
Turn 7 1914 AD Nome is founded
IBT: Richardborough builds SS Docking Bay
Turn 8 1916 AD 2nd Task Force leaves for homeland Kill an offending Marine
IBT: Not much
Turn 9 1918 AD 2nd Task Force has arrived
IBT: not much
Turn 10 1920 AD Anchorage is founded and we now have spices
Not much new to report India is now busy building TOW & AEGIS units We have a huge bankroll and are the most powerful nation on the planet.
I have a settler in Anchorage waiting for an MA Army to arrive to defend it.
Our Air Force is spread between Nome & Helsinki. Weve got a bunch of workers on pollution clean up.
Turn Log 7
Turn 0 1900 AD We raze New Hanningsvag and clean up a little pollution I plan on nuking a an Indian city just for fun
IBT: Helsinki rebuffs a 2 marine invasion Entremont starts the Manhattan Project
Turn 1 1902 AD New Aarhus and a chunk of Indian the air-force is razed Indian is also short 4 destroyers for a couple of bombers
IBT: Our mighty Battleship sinks 3 Aegis Cruisers India lands a 4 MA invasion force by Helsinki
Turn 2 1904 AD That invasion force and the 3 DDE & 1 Transport that carried it in are gone Only 1 tile left and India oil pipeline will be cut
IBT: Lose a DDE - Decline the Ta-tu flip
Turn 3 1906 AD Indian oil cutoff Switch Entremont to SS Engines A couple of questions:
Why so many mobile SAM units?
Why are we defending coastal cities with units with a less than 10 defense when we can build Mech Infantry?
Why are we using Marines for defense?
Why were undefended workers left on a coastal tile?
Why did we build Regular units?
IBT: Just a couple of bombardments
Turn 4 1908 AD Punjab is captured A couple of Indian MI are destroyed
IBT: MA defending Punjab gets a MGL who dies when Punjab falls Barcelona flips to us and I keep it
Turn 5 1910 AD Task force heads for the home country Kill a couple of exposed MIs Somehow I cut off his Aluminum, so I pull out of Barcelona
IBT: Barcelona falls Entremont completes SS Engines
Turn 6 1912 AD Land the first settler to return home Note that India has Aluminum re-connected (also Uranium & Rubber) but no oil
IBT: Lose a Destroyer and Entremont is Stealth Bombed
Turn 7 1914 AD Nome is founded
IBT: Richardborough builds SS Docking Bay
Turn 8 1916 AD 2nd Task Force leaves for homeland Kill an offending Marine
IBT: Not much
Turn 9 1918 AD 2nd Task Force has arrived
IBT: not much
Turn 10 1920 AD Anchorage is founded and we now have spices
Not much new to report India is now busy building TOW & AEGIS units We have a huge bankroll and are the most powerful nation on the planet.
I have a settler in Anchorage waiting for an MA Army to arrive to defend it.
Our Air Force is spread between Nome & Helsinki. Weve got a bunch of workers on pollution clean up.
Sounds good. Is there any evidence that Ghandi has considered space travel yet?
I don't know why we have so many mobile SAMS, but they did shoot down some bombers for us during my turns. Since they were there, I'd thought of sending some to guard our MA armies on oil patrol, but since India was ignoring the armies I never did anything with them.
It was stupid, but I didn't even think of an amphibious invasion during my turns, and I did nothing to protect coastal cities. Ghandi didn't seem interested in invading them, though, so we didn't lose anything by my shortsightedness.
I don't know why we have so many mobile SAMS, but they did shoot down some bombers for us during my turns. Since they were there, I'd thought of sending some to guard our MA armies on oil patrol, but since India was ignoring the armies I never did anything with them.
It was stupid, but I didn't even think of an amphibious invasion during my turns, and I did nothing to protect coastal cities. Ghandi didn't seem interested in invading them, though, so we didn't lose anything by my shortsightedness.
denyd
Emperor
I was filling in the northern home island and if we take the one northern Indian city, we should be able to fill in along the western coast.
There is a small contingent of land units heading for our Tundra holdings, but our air corps should be able to decimate them easily.
I did forget to check how Brennus was doing cash wise (though we are at war with him). It might be time to buy peace with him (we've only got 22K in gold).
(I've got internet access this for the next week so I'll be checking in more frequently)
There is a small contingent of land units heading for our Tundra holdings, but our air corps should be able to decimate them easily.
I did forget to check how Brennus was doing cash wise (though we are at war with him). It might be time to buy peace with him (we've only got 22K in gold).
(I've got internet access this for the next week so I'll be checking in more frequently)
