Shocked, and suddently hating the patch

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Creepy Old Man, Dec 19, 2010.

  1. lschnarch

    lschnarch Emperor

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    Seems you have considerably changed your mind about the pre-patch game.
    Prior to the patch, you've been one of the most eager defenders, no?

    Not only doesn't this meet my experiences in post-patch games, where the AI still happily sends lonely ranged units into my spears and horsemen, but having a siege weapons as city defense is plainly wrong when the patch notes are correct.

    ... which constitutes quite some weak design.
    I have to check each of the 11 opponents to see if and if yes, what kind of good deals are available?

    This kind of tedious work is exactly what the computer should do for me: telling me when a new trade is available. And furthermore, it should point out the better of the available deals.
     
  2. MarkC1

    MarkC1 Warlord

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    Oh christ.. you got half the complainers demanding more complexity , more units, more everything and the other half wanting to stare at the screen and watch the computer play the game :lol:

    It's called 'Diplomacy Overview' and you can find it by clicking the Diplomacy button
     
  3. Buccaneer

    Buccaneer Deity

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    No, but I wasn't a hater either so I guess that made me a defender by default. I gave pre-patch a 5/10 (you can look that up) but I thought it had really good potential. I had hoped the patches would add significantly to the difficulties (instead of adding more things to an easy game). That's why I like this direction very much.
     
  4. Creepy Old Man

    Creepy Old Man Warlord

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    I did not take "lots of cities" from my enemy. This deal increased my number of cities by about 5% and my citizen count by about 10%. Furthermore, I don't mind there being a little disruption in order to assimilate the new (and possibly resentful) people. What bothers me is that, even if I had 1,000,000 gold, there is nothing I can do to incorporate these new people into my empire.
     
  5. charon2112

    charon2112 King

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    This is currently my biggest beef with Civ V. This huge happiness bonus further encourages AI to spam cities (which I hate).
     
  6. Surgeon

    Surgeon Warlord

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    Bring back city revolts!
     
  7. joyous_gard

    joyous_gard Prince

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    Yeah, diplomacy overview is one of those things that they missed on streamlining day. I don't want to check diplomacy overview every single turn in a 500 turn game.

    Diplomacy overview is a two click then scroll process. Have you tried scrolling in Civ V? It sucks ass. So now every turn, for 500 turns, I am going to click, click, scroll up and down to look and see if anybody has an extra silver to trade away? All that movement is just asking for wrist problems.

    I am playing a game on a computer. Computers are good at processing that kind of crap and giving a summary of it. That summary should have been done on the main page since smiles are a critical factor of the game.
     
  8. krc

    krc King

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    That's a different issue than the one I responded to. I still think it's reasonable that freshly conquered populations would be likely to revolt. (As for whether or not it was "lots of cities", it was clearly enough to push the global happiness balance well into the negative zone from the probably slight positive balance you had been maintaining.)

    The problem lies in the game mechanics, where the chance at revolt factors through global happiness and (as you point out) there is nothing you can do to fix it and you just have to wait it out.

    I'd much prefer a system where puppeted cities always have a chance to provoke revolts (locally) without having them spread all over your empire.
     
  9. Dralix

    Dralix Killer of threads

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    You could annex, buy courthouse, then happiness buildings.
     
  10. Rohili

    Rohili King

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    And why is that a problem? Is there any rule which states that players MUST be able to incorporate as many people as they want into their empire, at any time they want? And why should gold be able to buy happiness?

    Maybe you should have thought twice (or, rather, checked your diplo screen more carefully) before accepting those cities.

    Also it is not impossible to have a large empire. Maybe you just need to wait until you get more luxuries, policies or happiness buildings. See this thread for example - I had 48 cities, 11 of them in revolt, and 65 happiness: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=403861
     
  11. MadRat

    MadRat Cheese Raider

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    you CANNOT buy a courthouse.. which is half the stupid problem and courthouses dont do anything for puppet states which are perma -5 hits.

    Rat
     
  12. Buccaneer

    Buccaneer Deity

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    Why can't you buy a Courthouse?
     
  13. MadRat

    MadRat Cheese Raider

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    No idea but it is the one thing you cant rush buy - it never shows up on purchase list. Thus conquering a city with net pop of say 12 means 12 turns of revolt and maybe up to 20-30 turns for courthouse to build = up to 40 turns worth of unhappiness all at a rosey -15 per city.

    Rat
     
  14. Dralix

    Dralix Killer of threads

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    Post patch, courthouses are cheaper, and can be purchased.
     
  15. Buccaneer

    Buccaneer Deity

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    I wasn't going to tell him. :) No sense ruining a rant with facts.
     
  16. skallben

    skallben Diplomat

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    You funny evil man. Holding back information on a fellow Fanatic.:trouble::cowboy::deal::popcorn:
     
  17. Babri

    Babri Emperor

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    Starve them to death like Stalin. :mischief:
     
  18. Mac2411

    Mac2411 Chieftain

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    I'm not sure the AI cheats at all levels when it comes to happiness. I just played a prince level (standard map-continents-five AI players-12 city states-ancient era start) game in which I had higher happiness levels several times throughout the game. In fact, the AI had negative happiness a couple of times while I had happiness in the 10-20 range. Also, in response to a discussion in this thread concerning the difficulty of taking capitals, I've not found it to be any more difficult than taking any other large AI city. The capital tends to be large and that makes it more difficult, but I don't notice the AI defending it any more or less than any other city.

    One thing I don't like about this happiness mechanic is that it really reduces the game to one strategy if one wants a good chance of success in a reasonable time: raze all conquered cities except capitals (which you can't raze) or those with Wonders. My games often end with most of the world completely burned to the ground and my little civilization standing on one continent that sometimes is itself not entirely colonized. It's just not a fun ending compared to other iterations of civilization in my opinion. I once played a pangea map (pre-patch) that ended with my civilization occupying a single river valley on the map (about four or five cities all located along a single long river) and the rest of the super-continent in ashes by the Renaissance era. I just don't get the feeling of building a great civilization under those kinds of circumstances. Just my opinion-others' opinions may vary of course.
     
  19. ddd123

    ddd123 Prince

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    well then you need it
    and what would be the problem? you being at +3 is just bad in general

    its like saying "i have 3 archers my opponent has 3 tanks, stupid game doesnt give me a chance to beat him!11!!!!! "

    the fact that you can *live with" 3 happyness doesnt mean its good to be there
     
  20. eric_

    eric_ Emperor

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    Exactly. You got burned. The AI has been doing this from the get go, it's just a more powerful gambit now than it was pre-patch due to new unhappiness calculations.

    Have you tried re-gifting them to their original owner? That's what I always do if I fail to notice the cities tucked in at the bottom of a long list of concessions, or if the AI won't go for peace without offloading some cities onto me.

    edit: and, yeah, the 450g courthouses, post-patch, are quite nice.
     

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