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Should the US Invade Greenland (Denmark) & Panama

I've seen estimates that the oil, gas, and mineral deposits within Greenland measure in the trillions so if we give every Greenlandic person $1 million to support the deal, that would be $57 billion, and that would apparently be a bargain.
Weeel, that's the kind of misdirection and obfuscation one would expect from a society in crisis, yet unwilling to seriously adress its actual problems – geopolitical highway robbery it is then.
 
I think you are all forgetting about the ice in Greenland, reason there are so few people there is likely because no one wants to go

Most of it is well above the Artic Circle..

People living in Greece and California should likely not lead the colonisation of Greenland , go to the beach 😊
 
Remember that we're talking about the United States, which likes to pretend that it is the bastion of the free world, and totally dissimilar to those evil regimes in Russia and China. If the US starts hosting rigged elections/referenda, stealing sovereign countries' infrastructure or illegally settling land that is not theirs, how are they even remotely dissimilar to said regimes?
 
The US can do lots of things, but it's not the 19th Century and people are not going to react the same way as they might have done 150 years ago.
Or that is exactly how they will respond, and we are back to how international politics worked in the 19th c. (Putin and Trump have common ground here).

You own what you can hold by force – or in actual practical terms, by being ready and willing to defend what is yours sufficiently to deter others from getting ambitious on your behalf.

It might have been a mistake by Denmark to scrap its subs, and disband the world's second oldest marines regiment back in the year 2000.
 
US has always been like all other major powers. And it's not just the US. That we may like to think otherwise, is the problem, not an argument against the problem.
Denmark seems to be a very nice society - not that I can know, only visited their capital once. Yet it isn't a major power, nor even geopolitically important. Greenland can be taken without even violence, due to its claim to all of the island resting only on meaningful powers nodding. It's not even as bad as what happened to many other countries - including Ukraine, but also Libya, Syria, Iraq etc.
 
Remember that we're talking about the United States, which likes to pretend that it is the bastion of the free world, and totally dissimilar to those evil regimes in Russia and China. If the US starts hosting rigged elections/referenda, stealing sovereign countries' infrastructure or illegally settling land that is not theirs, how are they even remotely dissimilar to said regimes?
I don't see how it would be a rigged election. If I'm a poor Greenlandic fisherman, and Denmark doesn't give a horsehockey about me, and the US will give me $1 million for my vote then why the hell not?

The real crisis is what we're going to name it. If we're keeping it a color then instead of Greenland we can go with RedWhiteandBlueland, but that doesn't really roll off the tongue. Maybe Americaland, or Mar-a-Igloo.
 
That's a very big 'if', isn't it? And whilst there are undoubtedly many people who will vote to make themselves poorer off through stupidity or ideological reasons, I'm sure that many Greenlanders can observe how people are treated in Puerto Rico and how, say, US healthcare and labour laws compare to those in the EU.
 
Remember that we're talking about the United States, which likes to pretend that it is the bastion of the free world, and totally dissimilar to those evil regimes in Russia and China. If the US starts hosting rigged elections/referenda, stealing sovereign countries' infrastructure or illegally settling land that is not theirs, how are they even remotely dissimilar to said regimes?
The difference it Trump, and what me might be doing do US politics, the Republicans in particular.

In Europe we have been able to bank the possibility of actually shaming the US into refraining from certain things (for a long tome in the clear knowledge of how the US would crap all over them in other parts of the world when expedient), given the values the US supposedly upholds.

But Trump has no shame, and he does not share these values. Elon Musk has suddenly been appointed to a perfectly unelected, unmandated role, and he certainly doesn't... Trump power, and looks poised to concentrate more to himself. Right now the line of defense is in the US courts – everyone finding out how much fight-back there is in the US system.
 
US can even claim that it has to take over Greenland so as to better protect against evil Russia. Surely that is something many people can get behind.
Trump is clownish, yet if he actually manages to enlarge the US by territory of that size and future strategic worth, you better get used to him being regarded as a historically important president.
Although imo this would have happened Trump or no Trump. Just a little bit later on.

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I don't see how it would be a rigged election. If I'm a poor Greenlandic fisherman, and Denmark doesn't give a horsehockey about me, and the US will give me $1 million for my vote then why the hell not..

Would a poor fisherman with a million dollars not immediately move to California, buy a beachhouse and party all night long ?
 
US has always been like all other major powers. And it's not just the US. That we may like to think otherwise, is the problem, not an argument against the problem.
Denmark seems to be a very nice society - not that I can know, only visited their capital once. Yet it isn't a major power, nor even geopolitically important. Greenland can be taken without even violence, due to its claim to all of the island resting only on meaningful powers nodding. It's not even as bad as what happened to many other countries - including Ukraine, but also Libya, Syria, Iraq etc.
Europe, outside the Soviet control, was not turned into an Anglo-American protectorate post-1945. Obviously you are going to claim it absolutely was. But it wasn't, so it just goes to show how much you understand of anything.
 
I see no need for military use or dealing with Denmark at all. Greenland may unilaterally declare independence, then can enter into a protectorate with the United States, where we can very heavily subsidize them for a period of time as a reward. Legitimately everyone will win, other than Danish pride.
Would a poor fisherman with a million dollars not immediately move to California, buy a beachhouse and party all night long ?
Sure, I don't care what they do with the money, as long as at some point we got their vote.
 
Would a poor fisherman with a million dollars not immediately move to California, buy a beachhouse and party all night long ?
They could club together an buy a decent chunk of Alaska and carry on there otoh. But that's a very roundabout way of being a Greenlander – and only works in the kind of US power-fantasies Trump is peddling to Americans.

It's the same toxic US assumption that everyone and everything is for sale – likely because they are themselves – or they need to prove us wrong on that.
 
Europe, outside the Soviet control, was not turned into an Anglo-American protectorate post-1945. Obviously you are going to claim it absolutely was. But it wasn't, so it just goes to show how much you understand of anything.
But I am not the one being met with something against their model. USA-not-Russia, how can USA-Russia? :P
Anyway, in some ways the mouse can also go for the carotid, but it's then an allegory and the mouse remains a mouse in reality.

I 'like' your way of arguing though. Pulling something out of your mind and then thinking that is attached to the person you are talking to, to the degree you infer things from a fantasy where the other person thought of that and not you. Reminds me of a story by Dostoevsky, where someone was accused of supporting the tobacco monopoly - instead of, say, just being dismissive for other reasons.
 
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The majority of Greenlanders support independence. Their leader has said he will push for full independence. At a population of 57,000, the Greenlandic people are unfortunately incapable of either adequately defending their nation or properly mining their mineral deposits - they need a larger nation. That's going to either be China or the US, and I would vastly prefer that it be the US.
 
The majority of Greenlanders support independence. Their leader has said he will push for full independence. At a population of 57,000, the Greenlandic people are unfortunately incapable of either adequately defending their nation or properly mining their mineral deposits - they need a larger nation. That's going to either be China or the US, and I would vastly prefer that it be the US.
That's what the Danes are also saying. The way this supposedly works is that the defense of Greenland is ALREADY the responsibility of the US – it has signed treaties to that effect, which is why the US have huge bases there already, and can easily have more if they like. The Danes otoh are tasked with the surveillance of the sea and air around it – and it has been concluded out that they have not upheld their end of the agreement over this. But Greenland will only be undefended by the US, and amenable to China, if the US actively withdraws.

They Greenlanders are not going to get to have their own land from Trump. That's not what this is about. But the gaslighting and US BS is such a heady mix clearly Americans have no idea how anything actually world here. It's about Donald Trump going down in US history as one of a handfull of presidents who permanently added new territory to the US. He's very much like Putin like that – an old man nearing the end who is more interested in a still fictional future history and a place in it – and screw the Greenlanders, never mind the Danes.
 
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Right, which is why we should generously pay them for their land.
Why don't the Greenlanders club together and pay you to change your mind on this? Everyone and everything is for sale, right?
 
if the US had the territory then we'd be able to raise the standard of living for the Greenlandic people as well
The US should probably look at fixing its own issues first, eh? Even if you blame all the problems on the Democrats, doesn't mean they don't need fixing.
 
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