Sidar

[Neomega]

Some suggestions for my favorite civ

*Into the mist should only make recon units and arcane units invisible.
-this seems more "realistic", and it stops the strange ability of being able to pillage while invisible.

*recon units should start with blur
-I dunno, seems right for a race of ghostly humans.

So basically, Sidar would have hard to hit, see and kill recon units. It also would make it so that if an enemy casts into the mist, you don't really have to super bulk up every city, waiting for the big sneak attack of invisible axemen, since recon units usually have a penalty for attacking cities.

Change trait from defensive to ......
-archers, walls, palisades... Sidar?
None of them seem to fit well, except perhaps philosphical, but that would just make the Sidar uber.

*A unique building
The Sidar Library. Same as Library, except +2 food. This is from the study of immortality, and the effects of knowledge driving their desire to live longer. Maybe alchemy lab, or mage guild instead, if balance needs.

*More ninjas
-self explanatory.

 

[WarKirby]

Into the mist wouldn't be nearly as good if it only affected reconunits. I disagree with that idea.

Also, in Fall Farther, they have a UB Hunting Lodge replacement, called House of the Grey, which gives extra health and happiness with shadow and spirit mana, respectively. ie, the ones you start with.

 

[Fafnir13]

*Into the mist should only make recon units and arcane units invisible.

Eh...the ability is kind of weak as is without limiting it. Granted, I've never played against an AI that uses it, so I'm not sure how it would work dealing with invisible pillagers and the like.
On the few occasions that I've played as the Sidar, I found the best time for me to use the spell was early game after building a second scout. Gives unparalleled intel on the home continent, plus almost guarantees a few extra goody huts. That boost in the early game seems better then one or two big sneak attacks in the late game.
Still, I would rather see the spell get some good offensive use. Why not let it give all your units an ability like the sidar ghost where they can go invisible at will? There are units that can see invisibility out there, so it's not like the Sidar having an invisible army is game breaking, especially if it's from a world spell. The Sidar also have the incentive to Wane their more powerful units, meaning they will want to eventually phase out a good number of those units.
As a random flavor bonus, let the Sidar starting scout be invisible. It nicely thematic, gets lost if the unit explores any lairs or graveyards, and keeps at bay the temptation to use the spell early in the game.

*recon units should start with blur

I'd be happy if the Divided Soul ability was present in Rangers and Beastmasters. Could also give recon units shadow mana so that they can cast those spells. Seems appropriate.

Change trait from defensive to ......

What is he again? *checks* Industrious and Defender. Huh, seem rather strange choices. Living dreary, immortal lives would not seem to inspire industriousness. Perhaps it reflects on the expertees that comes from a lifetime of learning. Defensive actually sounds right as far as how immortals would handle a war. Just sit back, relax, and let the short lived ones assail your strong places. They'll forget what the war was about in a couple decades and give up. The withdraw it gives also seems fitting for Sidar units.
But, if we're talking about change, I could see a Raiders/Organized trait change being nifty. They should know how to run an empire by now (organized) and their units being able to slip in and out of enemy territory easily. Unfortunately, that would make Sandalphon a carbon copy of Decius. Pity.

*A unique building

Library? Hmmm...a special library does sound right for the Sidar. Food seems a tad odd. Sure, paper is edible, but it's not really nutritious.
Perhaps a better choice would be culture or experience. Help them along towards their wanes whilst ensuring newbie troops are able to step up to the challenge. I always have trouble keeping a good fighting force up and operational in the few Sidar games I've played.

*More ninjas

Yo! Swordsmen and Champions would look great as ninjas. Why let recon have all the fun?

 

[Jules.lt]

Actually, making Sidar Libraries give +2xp for units built in the city sounds about right, considering how lower barb xp just nerfed Sidars.

I like Sandalphon's traits and the Worldspell as they are. Pillaging should remove "hidden", but that's a separate problem.

What I might like is Stealth allowing you to hide after attacking/pillaging. Maybe not if you just lost your hidden promotion, but if you were visible at the beginning of the turn. That way people have a chance to catch those ghosts, but they can still vanish after their mischief. I'm not sure how it works exactly right now, so you might want to make that clearer in the civilopedia.

 

[Verily]

Couldn't Sandalphon be just Philosophical? No second trait. It fits him perfectly from a lore perspective, and as a sole trait it would probably prevent him from being overpowered. It's not like the Sidar are already a top-tier civilization, just mid-tier, so a slight power boost isn't a big deal. And Defensive/Industrious is just weird.

+2 EXP from Libraries seems like an interesting addition, too.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I think Into the Mists should give Hidden and Stealth, so they get Hidden again. A one time Hidden seems really weak.

I think Hidden/Invisible should allow units to move though rival territory.


I think that Divided Soul should be a Promotion available to Sidar Recon units instead of a unit.


I'm not really sure the Sidar need a UB. The building that seems like it would be most unique for them would be the Elder Council. Of course, a library with a copy of the books or Laroth could be important too.

I actually wonder if maybe waning should only be allowed in a city with the proper UB.



Arcane seems like a pretty good trait for a Sidar leader. Although we don't know if he is the same guy, Sandalphon is among the Children of Kylorin in the Age of Ice scenario. (I usually prefer to play the Sidar as Dain the Caswallawn (Arcane/Philosophical), in unrestricted leaders games.)

 

[Lone Wolf]

The name "Sandalphon" reminds me of sandals (footwear, I mean).

 

[Rystic]

The name "Sandalphon" reminds me of sandals (footwear, I mean).

It used to be Morgoth, but they changed it for some reason.

 

[Lone Wolf]

"Morgoth" sounds even more horrible. It reminds me of Mordor from Tolkien, which had little connections to undying scientist ghosts, and Goths, which have even less connnections to the aforementoined ghosts. Between Morgoth and Sandalphon, I'd choose the latter...

Whoops, someone by the name of Morgoth actually was a character in Silmarillion! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgoth) I see why they changed the name, the guy doesn' seem to have any resemblance to the Sidar leader.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

You don't see the resemblance between the Black Enemy and the leader of the Grey?


Sandalphon is another name taken from Jewish Folklore. This giant of an archangel is sometimes though to have been Elijah before coming to heaven.

 

[Lone Wolf]

You don't see the resemblance between the Black Enemy and the leader of the Grey?

I haven't read Silmarillion, but that Morgoth charater seems rather evil. The Sidar leader doesn't seem evil to me.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I was being sarcastic. I guess I should have used a smilie to show that.

Although, what the scenarios have revealed about the Sidar makes them seem at least a little evil.

 

[zup]

Morgoth is pretty much the evil in Silmarillion.

 

[Honor]

Couldn't Sandalphon be just Philosophical? No second trait. It fits him perfectly from a lore perspective, and as a sole trait it would probably prevent him from being overpowered.

Yeah. Only Philosophical, or Philosophical plus a brand new Sidar-only trait with some unique pros and cons.

 

[Keeper_GFA]

Morgoth is pretty much the evil in Silmarillion.

Pretty much? Morgoth is *THE* big evil in Tolkien.

 

[Cliftor]

Morgoth is scary. A little pee comes out whenever I think of him.

http://img-fan.theonering.net/rolozo/images/sotomayor/morgoth_and_fingolfin.jpg