siege promotions

King of Town

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I was curious as to what promotions people usually give their siege units? I used to give only collataral damage promo's, but now, and especially with trebs, I go city raider. I've never testerd them to see which ones are the most useful. I suppose it could depend upon what your foes have in their cities to defend with too.
 

Cytral

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city raider for the ones 1 want to keep

collateral for the ones I suicide
 

jimbob27

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Generally I find city raider better even for the ones I'm know will die.

City raider for city attacks, collateral damage for field battles, is the way I usually go. I've experimented with various promotions, and these are the ones I've found constistantly best.
 

Cytral

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cause your bound to loose a few.


I tried the first strike thing (drill?) for field work, didn't seem to work that well.
 

Loopy

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The primary usage of my my siege engines is to bombard down city defenses. This means that accuracy is a key promotion, so it has to be city raider or barrage as the first promotion. If CR gives me > 50% chance of withdrawl, then that's what I use. If there's already a high chance or they're pure suicide forces, it's barrage. Like the in game hints suggest, I'll usually save the promotion until I know which will be more useful.
 

duende29

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City Raider mostly for Trebs because they're already pretty good at bombarding. Cats... Ummm, usually mixed up between accuracy if I got enough exp in them or just city raider again cuz it's cheap and I usually spend the accumulated Spy points on city revolts.
 

Tridus

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If you're going to use them against a city, City Raider is the best one. It greatly increases their chances of survival. I really favor it because if a siege weapon successfully attacks and retreats, it gets XP as though it won the combat. So if you use them a lot they can get pretty powerful.

If its a throwaway unit, Barrage will do more damage on the way down. Accuracy is nice if you're in a hurry to bring down the defense bonus on the city as quickly as possible, but I don't generally find that a big deal. With City Raider more of them survive from earlier attacks, and 5 of them will still bring down the defenses faster then 2 with Accuracy.
 

Woodreaux

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I use catapults for everything except attacking cities. Any catapult attacking with less than 60% withdrawal chance gets Barrage, else I give them Combat promotions to increase their survival rate. Trebuchets are the same, except substitute CityRaider for Combat. Above all, like Loopy says the game hints say, save your promos for an opportune situation.
 

1889

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I prefer collateral damage promotions. City raider helps your siege units hurt the one city defender they are fighting, but collateral damage affects sometimes as many as 6 units, meaning fewer siege units need to be risked. Any way as I see it siege weapons are usually too weak to make a city raider promotion useful. They are supposed to withdraw rather than win.
 

Soneji

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How on earth can people save seige weaponary?

I would like to think that I am an accomplished warlord. Its the only way I am guaranteed a good shot at victory.

When I attack with a military advantage, say riflemen and trebs over mace, they are used to bombard (rare for me to have frigates at this stage) and for collateral damage. At the end of what is normally a good few years of war, its normally lack of seige weapons or garison units that slow me or make me consider for cease fire before anything else.

I manage to keep most of my melee / sword units with CR for upgrade, however I don't think I could take as much teritory without sacrificing my seige to keep my stacks alive and just as importantly - healthy.
 

Draknith

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i used to only use collateral damage and bombard, but after reading some opinion polls I tried out CR. I've found that my city raider trebs/cat/cannon/etc work excellently to knock out troop numbers. However, in my games now I use a combination of strengths. Usually 2 city raiders and 1 bombard/collateral. I tend to have more trebs surviving now too.
 

Soneji

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I don't feel that those promotions are suited now that the unit was nerfed, and rightly so, it can no longer kill nor capture before the end of a turn if units are tight.

I always want to promote them barrage and those that do ok eventially are up to Barrage III, with production adding fresh II & I seige. I waste almost as many seige as I have readily available, and I rarely lose troops. Unless I am at the end of a landgrab and strugling, then I may take hard odds.
 

King of Town

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With trebs especially I go city raider, they get some really good survival odds, and a treb that survues is one that can fight agina, gets XP to make it stronger, contributes to GG points, and like you said Soneji won't make you have to end your war early do to a lack of siege. With enough siege weapons the collataral damage is going to be done no matter what, having them suruve is better than sacrificing them when you don't have. Never tried combat or first strike promo's. I don't know how a 10% strength bonus will make you survive more than a 20% city raiding bonus though.
 

Draknith

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Hey, just to let you guys know. Last night I was playing my current game (warmonger's dream), and I received the bonus where, "your rifling technology has been adopted to our connon making." It gave me combat 1 to all my cannons. So as soon as I was done with the current war, I upgraded all my city rader III trebs and they got the combat 1 promo. Guess what, the next war shall be comming soon... haha
 

occam

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First strike promotions are more effective for siege than for normal units. The model for combat is the units take rounds going pewpewpew at each other. First strikes give you extra pewpewpew turns with no return fire; city raider or combat promotions make each pewpewpew stronger. Siege combats are naturally reduced in rounds (in BtS) because the siege unit can't get a kill - a weakened opponent artificially truncates the combat for siege ... the average number of times the unit's strength is used must be likewise reduced. Similarly, the weighted increase in turns that first strike gives you must be higher because the average number of exchanges has decreased for siege.

In other words, first strike provably gives more bang for the buck to siege than first strike gives to other units. If you like it for other units, you might try it with siege.

On a practical level, I usually mix city raider and first strike (with no collateral or just plain combat) on the others.... if I am leading in tech, more first strike promotions - otherwise, a little more on the city raider. Trebuchets are good candidates because their innate +100% vs. cities further reduces the weighted benefit of city raider.

I have rarely regretted a hybrid first strike promotion set on any good offensive unit. It keeps them healthy longer, it negates others' first strikes, sometimes it will even pull a horse unit (with no defensive bonus) out of the stack.

===========

Do first strikes do collateral?

- O
 
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