SirJethro's DyP II - "The Emperor's New Mod"

SirJethro

Paterfamilias
Joined
Jun 13, 2002
Messages
1,628
Location
Treadin' trodden trails...
Okay...given that our newb foray into DyP resulted into a spanking of the AI before we got anywhere close to railroads, even, we are "kicking it up a notch" to Emperor.

Here are the details for Round II:

MOD/Rules: DyP v1.10 beta build #4 (expected to be released today I believe)
Difficult: Emperor
Civ: still unselected (see below)
Map: Normal, 8 civs
Everything else (barbs inc.): Random

Current players and order (we may pick up one or two more):
Quokka (lead off)
cromagnon
Sultan Bhargash (if he has the guts)
SirJethro

Chosing our civ: In the last game we played Militaristic and Religious, so for this game I want to avoid those traits and hit the four we haven't played yet. So what I would like everyone who's playing to do is rank the four remaining traits (Industrious, Scientific, Commercial, and Expansionistic) in the order that they would desire to play them. I'll accumulate the votes and pick the Civ that matches most closely. The latest version of DyP has 8 new Civs, so I will be chosing our Civ from the new ones, and also setting the opponent Civs to include the new ones as well (although I play to pull China in as a grudgematch from the last game).

I play to post the starting savegame tomorrow morning, so Quokka let us know if you can start then.

Re: my opinion on the starting civ traits, here is my ranking: (1) industrious; (2) scientific; (3) commercial; (4) expansionist.
 
just a note of clarificaton: We could only add 7 new civs.

They are:
Ethiopia Middle East Industrious Religious
Inca >Militaristic & Industrious
Mali > Commercial & Scientific
Polynesia > Commercial & Expansionist
Siam > Industrious & Scientific
Sioux > American > Militaristic & Expansionist
Tibet > Industrious & Religious

It should also be noted that we changed the Vikings from Expansionist to Commercial. Other than that the civs are "as is" out of the box.
 
Here are the new Civs:
Ethiopia Middle East Industrious Religious Javelineer (1.2.1 w/ 3 bombard @ Bronze Working)
Inca American Militaristic Industrious Inti Warrior (1.1.2....no req. tech)
Mali Middle East Commercial Scientific Mali Heavy Horseman (5.3.2 @ Stirrup)
Polynesia Asian Commercial Expansionist Outrigger (0.1.4 Caravel replacement @ Sailing)
Siam Asian Industrious Scientific Siamese Swordsman (4.1.1 @ Iron Working)
Sioux American Militaristic Expansionist Horse Archer (4.2.3 + 4 bombard @ Stirrup)
Tibet Asian Industrious Religious Gurkha (3.3.1 @ Feudalism)
 
Kalel...do you think the build 4 will be out before tomorrow?
 
I am hoping so. There were a few "minor" issues that needed to be fixed from build 3, the could have been fixed earlier but since Isak and RobO are in Denmark and I am in California sometimes we miss each other's emails and answers to questions from the Danish contingency have to wait 8 hours while I am sleeping and vice versa.

My understanding is that Isak has my "required adjustments" email and is implenting the changes now. His most recent estimate for the next release was "within the hour".

So hopefully we will see the next release soon.
 
Excellent. If it is that close, even if it isn't available by tomorrow morning first thing, I'll probably hold off on starting the new SG so we can play off the latest beta.
 
I'm absolutely positive that build 04 will be out tonight (my timezone). All I need to do is adjust a few settings in the BIX and then test that all units can be build, so the only thing that could stop me from releasing, is if the local thunderstorms decide to zap my adsl modem.. (knock wood) :)
 
My preferences for traits are: 1) Industrial, 2) Scientific, 3) Expansionist, 4) Commercial.

Of the new Civs, Siam or Mali look nice.
 
I can play as soon as the game is ready, which will be in the morning for me.

Starting traits ranks for Emperor
1)Industrious 2)Commercial 3)Scientific 4)Expansionist

If DyP plays anything like Civ3 on Emperor then the extra money from commercial might be more beneficial than cheap Libraries etc. How many of those did we build last game vs markets, bazaars etc?

Of the new Civs I also like Siam or Mali the best. Depends when we want our GA. I like Mali's Heavy Horsemen better than the Ghurka, Iron Working comes very early when our towns are still only pulling very few shields.

Kal-el, what are the Being 'Civ' techs all about and what exactly do Wisemen do? The Civilopedia is completely blank about them.
 
Given that everybody is agreed on Industrious as their top pick so far, that really only leaves Siam as an option (since the other Industrious civs are paired with Militaristic or Religious). Kinda agree about Commercial being a good option, but there isn't a Industrious/Commercial Civ, unless we want to go with one of the PTW Civs and just compete against the DyP civs. Let me know your thoughts.
 
Quokka, as of beta 03, the "Being" techs are simply a tool to implement the wisemen and taxmen (and some other things.) The wisemen are a 10-shield 50-% science increaser (a super-cheap no-culture library in essence) available to scientific civs and the taxmen are the same but increase taxes for commercial civs. I do not know if any changes are made to them for beta 04, however, as I'm not really in that discussion.
 
the "Being" techs are used to give certain improvements to specifc civs. As an example the Wiseman and the Tax Collector.

These two "improvements" take the place of the other trait's TSU's (Trait Specific Units, i.e. Champion for Militaristic, Serf for Industrious, and Ranger for Expansionist. It should be noted that the Religous trait does not really get a TSU, they get the Shaman but that unit has become the equivalent of the Clan. This is because with the extra governments the Religious Trait has become much more powerful).

The Wiseman is a cheep improvement that only Scientific Civs can build which gives +50% science in the city where built. This is to help compensate for the fact tat with all the added techs getting one free at the beginning of each era loses much of its appeal.

The Tax Collector is for the commercial civs what the Wiseman is for the Scientific Civs. An exclusive improvment that is cheep to build and gives +50% tax in the city where built.

The 'being' techs are also used for the Slave Trade workaround.

edit: Pdescobar beat me to the response.
 
Re: the serf....when it is upgraded during the Industrial era does it retain it's "free" status?
 
I'd rather a new Civ than an old one.
We may also be able to able to keep up in tech if we build lots of Wisemen early as Mali or Siam would be the only other Scientific Civ.

Edit: After reading Kal-el's description of the Taxmen(+50% tax for 10 shields) and Wisemen(+50% Science for 10 shields) I think Mali would be better than Siam.

I'll eat whatever is on my plate though, it'll be good to wake up to a surprise breakfast.
 
On the worker issue, if you upgrade the serf to laborer you pay for upkeep and of course you can only build laborers, engineers later in the game. However, when i have played Industrious in test games, I left my serfs alone and only upgraded my captured slave workers as I was valuing the free upkeep above the increased movement of the later worker-types particularly since the laborer arrives only shortly before railroads are possible.
 
How do the different traits play out in DyP compared to regular Civ3? I just haven't played enough to make my own decisions, our last game was my first with the mod. I can see how the Religious trait has become more powerful, as we swapped governments about 6 times and thats without discovering them all.
The other thing I was wondering about is with the faster workers. Worker jobs are given a 'Base turns to complete'. Do the more move workers take less turns to do the job or can they just move around faster?
If you didn't upgrade the serfs or the captured slaves then your whole workforce would be free, and are the upgraded slaves also free?

You are making the choices too damn hard:D
 
the workers just move faster. But of course Industrious workers work faster than regular workers in regular civ3 and tht stays the same in DyP. Likewise slaves work slower than regular workers in regular and in DyP as well.

You eventually can not build Serfs anymore, but as Pd pointed out that's not for a long time. (Maybe too long for balance reasons.)

I don't know how upgrading captured workers affects thier maintenance costs.
 
If the Laborer arrives only just before Railroads, why would you build them? After RR's are around, movement is pretty much instantaneous to anywhere. The only place this would help is on the frontier or completely unimproved tiles, but you could always use upgraded slaves for that and keep your Serfs cost free.
If the Laborer came alot earlier then there advantage would be more beneficial as the lower road movement significantly lengthens move times, but if you have put up with slow movers until RRs why not wait a few turns more until movement is essentially free?
 
Top Bottom