1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Skirmisher Units

Discussion in 'General Balance' started by Stalker0, Nov 8, 2019.

  1. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2010
    Messages:
    17,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Little Rock

    Weren’t you just complaining in the other thread about how we’re tweaking units too much? ;)
     
    CrazyG likes this.
  2. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2017
    Messages:
    4,780
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alberta, Canada
    Yes I was. My proposed unit tweaks have been on the mods repository virtually unchanged for 2 months (I only had to tweak CS/RCS values and remove the skirmisher doctrine bonuses when that came out). I continue to to use that for my own games.

    I don’t like the skirmisher doctrine, and giving skirmishers logistics and an XP penalty is not much better from a complexity standpoint. I did this because people asked me to.
     
    JamesNinelives likes this.
  3. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2005
    Messages:
    5,874
    Awesome, I will give it a shot!
     
    JamesNinelives likes this.
  4. azum4roll

    azum4roll Prince

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2018
    Messages:
    489
    Gender:
    Male
    Love it. Can they also get 1xp from pillaging? Just to provide an alternative way to gain xp and fit the theme of skirmishing.

    The whole 2 shots per turn + -30% RCS when attacking + -50% combat xp thing isn't really more complicated than the existing +CS/RCS in open and -CS/RCS in rough promotion and the Covering Fire promotions. We can further simplify it into just one promotion if needed and remove Logistics from the promotion tree. In that case change the attack malus to -50% and adjust their RCS accordingly so they aren't one-shotted by the archer line.
     
  5. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2017
    Messages:
    4,780
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Alberta, Canada
    Ooooooh CrazyG is gonna be so maaaaad at youuuuu :mischief:
    Skirmishers share a promotion tree with archer units, so giving logistics for free was less work than figuring out how to conditionally disable it. You also wanted the -30% RCS intact, so it's logistics.
    If we were to go that route and prioritize condensing the promotions I would want to go all the way

    Mounted units
    - can move after attack
    - penalty vs cities
    - no terrain defensive bonuses

    Skirmishers
    - can move after attack
    - penalty vs cities
    - no terrain defensive bonuses
    - Penalty vs naval
    - bonus/malus in rough terrain --or-- can attack twice/-30RCS/-50%XP

    Combined with the Embarkation promotion, skirmishers have so many base promotions that a level 3 unit has already run off the page with earned promotions
     
  6. civplayer33

    civplayer33 King

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2017
    Messages:
    965
    I'll be releasing a new version of PFEUI, maybe even today, but certainly sometime this week, which groups more of the promos together and, more importantly, makes sure the order is useful and consistent, which is not really the case with v 2 or vanilla VP (it also fixes some bugs). This can even be useful for those who don't want the little icons above the units as you can simply disable them in the settings file, so you'll only have the changes to promotion grouping, promotion ordering and tool tip simplification; for some units the promo row is still too large to be fully displayed when they are highly promoted, but the promos you don't see will usually be rather unimportant and the mod also enables scrolling of the promotion row so you can actually view all promos and check their tool tips no matter how long the line is.
     
    Rhys DeAnno and vyyt like this.
  7. azum4roll

    azum4roll Prince

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2018
    Messages:
    489
    Gender:
    Male
    Hiding common easy to remember promotions like "Can move after attacking" and "No melee attack" would be nice. Maybe keep naval inaccuracy and variants since I can never remember what percentage they are.
     
    Kim Dong Un, Heinz_Guderian and vyyt like this.

Share This Page