Snap UK General Election

[Yeekim]

I at least provided examples. What are your examples?

I have no problems with your examples, I'm saying you are looking at them from the wrong end and arriving at wrong conclusions.
Yes, the Internet was developed independently of EU, but the EU helps Member States to deal with the way it has changed the world.

The countries thought to be in favour were permitted a referendum

"Permitted"? By whom? I mean, the EU has its flaws, but it is nothing but a treaty between sovereign Member States. Why misrepresent it as some oppressive outside entity?
Whether or not a referendum is required to approve a treaty depends on a constitution of a country and how their constitutional court interprets it, not by someone's "permission".
And when it is not required, it depends on country's elected politicians if they wish to hold an advisory vote.
As for Ireland, it was simply not "told to vote again" but rather it renegotiated the treaty (in particular re: on the Irish commissioner, competency over tax rates, abortion, neutrality, and workers’ rights) and then approved the changed text.

There was no referendum in the UK on the EU prior to joining because the EU elite and local politicians knew full well that the UK public would vote against it.

So now the UK public has had its say and in a couple years we'll have enough hindsight to say how wise their choice was.

 

[Kyriakos]

Resorting to insults is a sign you are losing the debate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretin




I at least provided examples. What are your examples?



There is a distinction between countries and their politicians.

The EU project enthusiasts sold the idea to a few politicians. The rest were told that there was no alternative.
The countries thought to be in favour were permitted a referendum, but when some (Ireland or France) voted
against it, they were told to vote again or were ignored. There was no referendum in the UK on the EU prior
to joining because the EU elite and local politicians knew full well that the UK public would vote against it.

Sorry, i just don't like Boris at all. And it is not much of a claim to say he is a cretin (the 'actual' bit here just stresses it, i don't mean he is of <50 iq or something like that, but let's face it, he is no genius)...

 

[really]

Ireland has referendums on transfers of sovereignty because an unrepresentative parliament voted us into the UK.

 

[metatron]

[...]

[...]

Not to take sides or anything.... but may i insert into the record, that whenever i see The Boris i can't help but hear the A-Team jingle in my head.
Like, whatever that's worth...

 

[really]

Something I just realised - I have a British accounting qualification - I wonder if it will still be recognised across the EU after Brexit.

It is one of the non tariff barriers to services that might pop up.

 

[Verbose]

"Permitted"? By whom? I mean, the EU has its flaws, but it is nothing but a treaty between sovereign Member States. Why misrepresent it as some oppressive outside entity?

This exchange is as good an indication as any why the UK needs to leave the EU.

 

[Silurian]

Silurian. I suggest you listen to the video clip at that link rather than simply take the misleading summary text line at its face value.
The quotations of the article I read in the dead tree format Times refer to taking control of the £350 M not spending it all on the NHS.

And the article that was quoted in the Times and elswhere was written by Johnson and published in the Telegraph. I did not hear any reports that he was unhappy with the way the Telegraph promoted their exclusive.

From Telegraph (Their Bold)

Exclusive: Boris Johnson - Yes, we WILL take back £350m from EU for NHS

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/09/15/exclusive-boris-johnson-yes-will-take-back-350m-eu-nhs/

The brexit bus which Boris Johnson stood in front of many times said at the top of the bus"We send the EU £350 million a week lets fund our NHS instead vote leave" at the bottom of the bus in smaller print "let's take back control".

https://inews.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/GettyImages-531881742-e1466772525242.jpg

If the government does not increase NHS funding by £350 (million) a week many people will regard it as a broken promise.

Edit added million

Which is likely a reason why most of us don't buy into the European Union dream.

There was a less than 2% majority to leave.

 

[Kyriakos]

If the government does not increase NHS funding by £350 a week many people will regard it as a broken promise.

Surely 350 pounds/week is doable

 

[Silurian]

I don't know with the way things are going

 

[Traitorfish]

There was a less than 2% majority to leave.

He's of course excluding the Scots, Welsh, Irish, Asians, blacks, gays, city-dwellers, academics, Labour-voters, under-40s, and vegetarians. Y'know, people who aren't really British.

With that small but necessary correction, the margin for "Leave" shoots to, oh, 4 or 5% at least.

 

[EnglishEdward]

Ireland has referendums on transfers of sovereignty because an unrepresentative parliament voted us into the UK.

Yes, and the majority of us on the eastern island have an almost deja vu sensation re our unrepresentative parliament voting us into the EU.

Something I just realised - I have a British accounting qualification - I wonder if it will still be recognised across the EU after Brexit.

It is one of the non tariff barriers to services that might pop up.

I have no idea how silly people will be. I suppose that it is possible that the qualification or the qualifying body may be deleted from some EU
database that employers use; if they are in a huff. So you might have to check it and if that is so add a note in the online form's other information field.

He's of course excluding the Scots, Welsh, Irish, Asians, blacks, gays, city-dwellers, academics, Labour-voters, under-40s, and vegetarians. Y'know, people who aren't really British.

Not sure whether you are writing about Lord Ashcroft's polling, Boris Johnson or me.

With that small but necessary correction, the margin for "Leave" shoots to, oh, 4 or 5% at least.

If the UK referendum on the EU had been held before the UK joined the EU, the government would not have been able
to run its project fear campaign like it did, the proponents of joining the EU would have had to argue their case on its merit,
rather than smearing Leavers as bigots or racists, the not join margin would have been much greater than 4 or 5% at least.

 

[Arakhor]

Ah Edward, whatever would we do without you speaking up for the poor, repressed silent majority?

 

[Traitorfish]

If the UK referendum on the EU had been held before the UK joined the EU, the government would not have been able
to run its project fear campaign like it did, the proponents of joining the EU would have had to argue their case on its merit,
rather than smearing Leavers as bigots or racists, the not join margin would have been much greater than 4 or 5% at least.

Now that's an interesting choice of words for a man with the Butcher's Apron in his avatar.

 

[Yeekim]

What Project Reality looks like:
http://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-cliff-edge-no-deal-departure/

 

[Silurian]

If the UK referendum on the EU had been held before the UK joined the EU, the government would not have been able
to run its project fear campaign like it did, the proponents of joining the EU would have had to argue their case on its merit,
rather than smearing Leavers as bigots or racists, the not join margin would have been much greater than 4 or 5% at least.

The Dumnonia people never held a referendum before Devon was annexed by Wessex but the UK did hold one in 1975 and 67% voted remain in the EEC.

 

[Manfred Belheim]

He's of course excluding the Scots, Welsh, Irish, Asians, blacks, gays, city-dwellers, academics, Labour-voters, under-40s, and vegetarians. Y'know, people who aren't really British.

With that small but necessary correction, the margin for "Leave" shoots to, oh, 4 or 5% at least.

Should I be reading this as saying none of these groups voted to leave? Labour voters didn't vote to leave?! City-dwellers didn't vote to leave?! Have you looked at the voting maps?

 

[trev1972]

I voted remain, i worry that even though it makes economic sense for the EU to do a trade deal they will want to make an example of us to discourage similar votes in the future. They dont want to be out of a job.

However even though i voted remain, and think the arguments for leaving were ridiculous - we have had a vote and it should of course be honoured.

I blame the useless 'remain campaign'

 

[EnglishEdward]

What Project Reality looks like:
http://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-cliff-edge-no-deal-departure/

Went there.

AIR TRAVEL

What happens immediately?

• All flights between the U.K. and EU27 stop. Seriously. Barring a transition deal, the unthinkable comes true.
• More than 135 million passengers annually fly between a U.K. airport and an EU27 country. That’s about 370,000 passengers per day.

So are the EC27 really going to maroon their nationals in the UK to enjoy our delightful traditional British food indefinitely?

• The U.K is no longer part of the EU-U.S. open skies agreement, meaning that flights to American destinations are also grounded.

So is President Trump (or Michael Pence) going to order the US air force to shoot down incoming planes carrying returning US citizens?
If so Gander airport will be very busy again.

• Leisure and business travelers are forced to take the ferry or Channel Tunnel services between Britain and France, leading to skyrocketing demand and delays.

Or people staycation and use the Internet.

• The transport of transplant organs by scheduled flights between the U.K. and the EU27 is impossible.

The rest of the world isn't going to support Brussels for declaring a medical embargo because their outrageous divorce bill was turned down.

 

[Arakhor]

It would be nice if you posted in good faith more often, Edward. Your last post is about as hyperbolic as the Express and can be treated in the same fashion.

 

[Yeekim]

So are the EC27 really going to....

This is what happens if no deal is reached as existing legal/regulatory framework breaks down. There is definitely reason for everyone to try and avoid that, possibly cobbling together some ad hoc arrangement. But keep in mind number and complexity of these issues and ever-dwindling amount of time to deal with them.