So I suck at FFH...

[A Moon]

...Aaand I was wondering if anyone could help me fix that.

I've started playing again after a moderately long break, and it turns out not playing doesn't make you any better. I still have little idea of where to place cities, which techs to research, build-orders and how to use diplomacy effectively. Hello More Navel AI stacks of doom, goodbye me.

I'm going to post a few screenshots of my next game, and say what I would do, and why, so I can find out where I'm going wrong.

I'm playing as the Sidar because their unitart is cool and they don't get enough love, on a pangaea map. All Unique Features is the only option enabled. Normal speed, noble difficulty (Yes,yes I play noble, I'm not fit to lick the boots of most of the people here, I know.)

I guess with my buffed specialists I should be aiming for an aristograrian economy?
I'm also planning on getting the CoE so that I can use nightwatch->assassins to farm my "friends" for shade xp.

Here's the start

Spoiler :

Wine, ivory and incense, some floodplains, and forests.

Thoughts as follows:
I all that forest means I want mining soon, which gives me crafting for the wine along the way. I think I'd move NW-W to get both floodplains and the wine, build a worker and research crafting?

Should I consider building aristo farms on the plains? And how soon do I want a specialist-enabling building?

I really don't know. All advice, along with explanations for me to absorb, is appreciated.

 

[akatosh]

Sidar--Generally if you can get 2-3 wanes early, you are in a good spot to win. Settle all commerce-generating specialists in your capital and all other cities are just used to produce troops, gold or research.

The best military line for Sidar is horses, specifically horse archers. With defender and flanking promotions they can reach 85% withdrawal, which means each HA has a good chance of making it to level 6 and becoming a shade.

The second best military line for Sidar is priests, specifically Order's confessors. With Altar levels and other boosters they can start with 22xp. Confessors also have bless (base strength 6) and most importantly Spirit Guide, so even if the confessor dies its accumulated XP goes to some other unit. Priests also receive passive XP which certainly helps.

For civics, use agrarianism/aristocracy until you have a few waned units in your capital to power your research. Then you can switch back to God King and use conquest. Eventually you should adopt Theocracy.

Using assassins/shadows can work, but it's late-game and very micro intensive.

Regarding build orders--9 times out of 10 I go worker first and tech agriculture-->calendar. The exception to that is wine starts. I'd settle your city in a way where you can get the floodplains, some hills, the wine, and any other calendar resources if possible in the capital's fat cross.

 

[A Moon]

Settled on turn two, south of the wine. My capital has three flood-plains, wine, the incense, and also some marble.

Spoiler :

Built a worker, who made a winery and some farms, now en route to make a plantation, and a warrior, who's gone off exploring after the scout was eaten by a griffin.He warrior attacked a wolf, then defended against another, which took him to 5 xp, then survived a giant spider attack(!), so now he's at 7 xp. 19 xp left to our first shade perhaps? Assuming he survives the two skeletons he's just met. One can only hope.

To north is the Ring of Carcer, along with the traditional expanse of ice and tundra. Bleh. North-east is a goblin farmfort that may of use for xp-gathering, some corn and a large fresh-water lake. West is some greenland and the pyre.

Gold to the south, and in the very south-east corner is the creeping blue border of the Elohim. I suspect something will have to be done about them.

The Amurites died on turn 21 somehow, and the Calabim cast River of blood at the same. Luckily we were at 1 pop anyway due to the worker build.

The current known world, along with possible future city sites, is as follows:

Spoiler :

From top to bottom
Green has corn, fresh water, and 5 hills.
Grey would have fresh water if it were 1E, but then it would only have one hill shared with Celo.
Probably can't wait too long for Pink, in case the Elohim get any ideas. Gold, ivory, cows, and if we go 1S, fish and water access, at the cost of two hills.
(The gold and fish don't have any map-markers, for some reason.)

I probably need to scout the area near the Elohim with the next warrior, in case there's anything there that I deserve more than them.

We've just invented the calendar. Not sure what to research next. I don't think marble is a particularly great resource, so masonry can wait.

Mining for pink's gold, and grey's forests? Mysticism for God King? Or should I go straight to Code of Laws to start Aristograrianing stuff?

 

[akatosh]

On Noble? Go for river cottages and code of laws and use it to power your expansion and research up to Stirrups. Your goal is to have 3-5 cities with decent production to churn out apprenticeship/conquest horse archers. Then declare on your nearest neighbor and wane away to your heart's content.

You don't need to found any religion (the manas aren't that useful), just adopt whatever gets you some extra early-game happiness.

 

[A Moon]

Are the city positions good? Which order should I settle them in? How soon do I want my first settler? How many warriors will I need to avoid getting eaten by the Elohim? I'll want Animal Husbandry soon to find horses, but how soon? And how many aristofarms do I want versus cottages? And do I want mining before education due to most of the river tiles being covered by forest?

 

[trexeric]

(Yes,yes I play noble, I'm not fit to lick the boots of most of the people here, I know.)

I play on Chieftain - I'm not fit to imagine the boots of people here.

 

[Qgqqqqq]

Aristocracy/agrariansim is the key.
Rush for them ASAP, and use them + boosted specialists to tech to whatever.
Shade settling isn't that strong a mechanic really.

 

[akatosh]

You guys should join us in the next SG. Experienced players (myself included) might make a snappy comment here or there but don't let it offend you, you will learn a lot and we'll all have fun playing.

----

As Sidar, if you get a good waning infrastructure going, things like land, population, and territory don't really matter anymore. Whether waning your best troops is actually worth it or not is debatable, but I have won MNAI Deity games using waning as my primary source of commerce.

That being said, as Q points out aristofarms are still super-strong for Sidar independent of decisions to wane. Until you get a decent number of horse archers with apprenticeship and conquest you should follow a standard aristofarm economy. I think cottages are a little bit better for Sidar than most 'standard' civs because eventually, you want to switch out of both aristocracy (into Theocracy) and agrarianism (into conquest.) Cottages will be unaffected by civic changes.

Regarding city sites, the most important thing is working good tiles. Overlap is OK especially in the early game, as you have nowhere close to enough happiness to work all of your fat cross.

In your case, I would settle my second city 1W of the corn. This way it can work Celo's eastern floodplain right away to start growing ASAP, and will also have the corn within its first ring and can get a river grassland farm with Celo's 3rd border pop. It will also be on a plains hill for extra production and defense. You can build an elder council there and run a sage for some commerce output and GP.

I like the gold/cow/elephant/floodplain site to the southwest, but it seems a little too far away for your second city. I would not settle it as my second city unless you get an early disciple for culture spread from religion (OO, FoL) or a culture bomb. Spending 20 turns spending a monument is not an attractive proposition in the early game. I would also not settle on top of the cow, that's a very strong tile to give up. I'd settle on the river plains 1W of the cow for freshwater and the river connection to the capital (can delay roads if workers needed elsewhere.)

In terms of when to settle, my general build order even on high difficulties is worker first while teching calendar, grow to happy cap on warriors, then build settler. New city usually builds warriors while the capital will start a second worker or build a few more warriors before a second settler.

The only early buildings I get are (usually) an elder council, or a pagan temple if I want to bulb a religion.

 

[Kiech]

The next SG needs to have something to do with lunatics... hurry with your turn Akatosh!

 

[doktarr]

If the next one involves Lunatics, I'm in!

 

[Qgqqqqq]

Hmm...lunatics you say.
Interesting.

Would altering the mechanic to make every unit crazed work?
There'd need to be some provision to stop city defence from...running away, but...maybe archers are the exception?
You might get me to build some after all!

Anyway do you think that would be fun, or just annoying?

 

[Qgqqqqq]

Agree with everything akatosh said, but remember commerce is king, so get the incense up fast!
Calender also gives agrar, which you want instantly.
Go for silks early too...

 

[doktarr]

Hmm...lunatics you say.
Interesting.

Would altering the mechanic to make every unit crazed work?
There'd need to be some provision to stop city defence from...running away, but...maybe archers are the exception?
You might get me to build some after all!

Anyway do you think that would be fun, or just annoying?

Yeesh, that's too crazy even for me. What's been nice about playing the Lunatics in my Mercurian game has been that I can manage the Lunatics using boats, and then use angels for defense and to provide some stability during wars.

If you want some serious randomness in the game, how about Perpentach? Get slavery and slave trade, build a bunch of asylums, and upgrade to Lunatics with all the spare slaves after you've got all your cages. With the insane trait and all those enraged units, there's plenty going on outside of your control.

 

[Kiech]

Yeesh, that's too crazy even for me. What's been nice about playing the Lunatics in my Mercurian game has been that I can manage the Lunatics using boats, and then use angels for defense and to provide some stability during wars.

If you want some serious randomness in the game, how about Perpentach? Get slavery and slave trade, build a bunch of asylums, and upgrade to Lunatics with all the spare slaves after you've got all your cages. With the insane trait and all those enraged units, there's plenty going on outside of your control.

I am on the same page, Doktarr. Perpy game, but some variant where we must rush mind stapling and build a big lunatic army. Since asylums can make any newly built troop crazy, that's just a bonus that should make Q happy as well!

 

[A Moon]

Set the tech-path for Education->Code of Laws, and sent the worker to build the plantation. The level 2 warrior survived one skeleton attack, and the other one left him alone in favour of walking to our city to die. Mahala's Doviello were wiped out on turn 45.

Build another warrior, who went of south to explore by the Elohim border, found nothing interesting, then curved West to find a tribal village by the pyre, which popped out three orcs to kill him. Vetus was founded on the plains hill, west of the corn.

The high level warrior (need to think of a name for that one) partnered with a 2xp one from Vetus and they went to explore the East part of the continent, gaining an extra comrade from a village there. Turned out to be a corner. The Elohim settled a city that has blocked them from returning home (and is also stealing 3 tiles from Vetus. Grr, Creative leaders), so they went south. In a small desert, they encountered a giant scorpion. While the 2 new-recruits cowered, [name] looked at it, yelled (And I'm assured that this is an ancient Sidar war-cry) "F**k the police!", ripped it apart with his bare hands, and made its stinger into a hat. Now he's at 18 xp.

Further south, we met the Svartalfar (and some more horses between the Elohim/Elf borders). Faeryl is annoyed at us, but Ethne is her worst enemy. Perhaps we could convince the elves to join us in an anti-hippie crusade in the future?

Spoiler :

OO and Runes were found on turns 95 and 97, while my third settler went to nab the gold. I ended up putting it 1 South of the cows, so that the gold was workable without a border pop. Acquired hunting, and build a hawk which told me a few things about the Elohim lands:

Spoiler :

They have some horses by the lake

They've amassed a lot of troops (mostly archers, but with a few axeman as well) in Inishboffin. I'm slightly happier because they're archers (i.e. not good attackers) but still makes me nervous.

Spoiler :

The third source of horse is far to the north, surrounded by ice and tundra. Not sure how soon we want to hook that up.

We got the "giant spider infested a mine" event. I chose to leave it there. It won't hurt anyone in my borders, and I can always capture it later for some extra silk.

Build a Divided Soul to ferry the hawk west. So far they've found some fairly diverse flatland with a river running through it, and the barrow that's been spawning skeletons at us.

And I completed the 4th settler and popped a great sage in Vetus on the last turn I played.
Current possible settling areas:

Spoiler :

Thoughts on the next city: Maybe move 2n of grey, for fur and reagents, and spam cottages and farms. I think I'm getting enough production from the other cities, so #4 should be commerce focused. Or perhaps I should dump a backwater (backice?) hole in the north, and try and grab those horses. The land to the west looks fertile, but I doubt the exploratory hunter will go far before he one or more civs I'll be competing with for it. No-matter how the western front looks, I'll have to do something about the Elohim sooner or later.

I have warfare, and if [name] can get 8 more xp, I can build the Form of the Titan. Or I could research Poisons, and wait 24 turns for Rathus to get to level 6.

Techwise, I'll be going for horseback riding and stirrups as soon as I have horses. Perhaps cartography to bring the warriors home through Elohim lands, and also using open borders to get better relations with the neighbours.

 

[Qgqqqqq]

Firstly, cottages are a bad idea while a city is small, wait instead for when you want tocap the growth.
Id go for either the floodplains or the silk

 

[A Moon]

The flood-plains to the south-west? As for the silk, wouldn't any city I put there be more-or-less surrounded by tundra?

 

[Qgqqqqq]

Yeah it would, but it can share tiles from previous cities (BTW you need waaaaaaaaay more workers), so that it will be ok short term.
Crap long-term, but Civ is won in the short term, and the happy is needed.

 

[A Moon]

Settled down by the floodplains, while Vetus border-popped to give us the silk. The Divided Soul explored further west, captured a giant spider (who ended up dying trying to harrass the Elohim) and met the Luchuirp. A bit of barbarian farming got him to level 6, and now we have our first shade. Celo has an academy, so should I settle him as a great scientist there?

Also, the Elohim declared on the Svartalfar and captured one of their cities. Glad it's not me I guess.

 

[Qgqqqqq]

No, settling is a horrible waste (outside of occ, or lair popping early on) - bulb or save for a GA.

Edit: oops misread you - thought you said you generated a GS
Yeah go for either scientist in your academy city, or GM in your capital (FTR the two shouldn't be the same as you want to stack multipliers).