So why is Confucianism a relgion?

[Xellos-_^]

Confucianism is a philosphy on how to live your life. So how did the developer turn it into a religion in civ4?

 

[Turquoiside]

First, it is a religion. Second, the Civilopedia explains why.

 

[Xellos-_^]

First, it is a religion. Second, the Civilopedia explains why.

when was it ever consider a religion? and by who? i am chinese and i have never seen or heard of anyone worship confucianism. it is school of thought founded by one of the great philosphers of ancient times. it is no different that the school of philoshpy founded by socartes.

 

[Cashew]

First, it is a religion. Second, the Civilopedia explains why.

Lol.

Anywho, Xellos, as you'll find as you play this game, a correlation with reality is often sacrificed for sake of game play.

 

[Xellos-_^]

just seems strange that they stick confucianism as a religion when there is so many real life religions to choose form.

They should replace it with Wicca

 

[dworkin]

I think it's because it's "a philosphy on how to live your life" that's been around for centuries and practiced by a sizable chunk of humanity continuosly. It's effect has been pretty much the same as a religion as far as Civ game mechanics care (keeps the pop happy).

 

[devilhunterred]

To be honest Confucianism is more of a religion than Taoism.

Philosophy and religion are closely intertwined anyways.

Do you consider Shintoism to be a religion? If you do then Confucianism is also a religion, since Shintoism is basically the Japanese interpretation of Confucianism and Taoism and mixing them together.

 

[Xellos-_^]

To be honest Confucianism is more of a religion than Taoism.

Philosophy and religion are closely intertwined anyways.

Do you consider Shintoism to be a religion? If you do then Confucianism is also a religion, since Shintoism is basically the Japanese interpretation of Confucianism and Taoism and mixing them together.

confucianism has no talks of the afterlife, no gods, no saints, nothing other then living good.

confucianism also came out of taoism so it is no suprise thier is a lot similarities. As for Shinotism that is the japanese ver of taoism with confucianism mix in. whether Shintoism is a consider a religion has nothing to do with Confucianism.

 

[devilhunterred]

confucianism has no talks of the afterlife, no gods, no saints, nothing other then living good.

confucianism also came out of taoism so it is no suprise thier is a lot similarities.

I forgot the exact dates, but I'm 99.99% sure that Confucianism came much earlier than Taoism.

And no, Taoism and Confucianism don't share too many similarities.

I'm no expert on religion, but I do know that Confucianism favors the Divine Rights of Kings (or Emperors in China's case), provided that the Emperor is benovolent and just to his peoples. Confucian also placed principles on invidividuals playing his role in the society according to his social classes, thus maintaining social harmony.

Taoism is all about Yin and Yang, living a simple and natural way of life thus maintaining a balance and harmony to the nature and universe.

 

[Xellos-_^]

I forgot the exact dates, but I'm 99.99% sure that Confucianism came much earlier than Taoism.

And no, Taoism and Confucianism don't share too many similarities.

I'm no expert on religion, but I do know that Confucianism favors the Divine Rights of Kings (or Emperors in China's case), provided that the Emperor is benovolent and just to his peoples. Confucian also placed principles on invidividuals playing his role in the society according to his social classes, thus maintaining social harmony.

Taoism is all about Yin and Yang, living a simple and natural way of life thus maintaining a balance and harmony to the nature and universe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Taoism

taosim came first.

confucianism was founded near the end of the Zhou dynasty. The early form of Taosim was around a lot earlier and was the principle religion in China until buddhism was introduce.

 

[devilhunterred]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Taoism

taosim came first.

confucianism was founded near the end of the Zhou dynasty. The early form of Taosim was around a lot earlier and was the principle religion in China until buddhism was introduce.

Check your wiki source again, i just did.

Taoism originated in 400 BC

Confucian lived between 551–479 BC.

So you tell me, which religion came first.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

confucianism has no talks of the afterlife, no gods, no saints, nothing other then living good.

Religion:

2. A specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion

It seems you believe it's a religion after all. It definitely fits this particular definition of religion.

It's also pretty prevalent in the world numerically and has had at least a decent impact on history. It definitely qualifies in Civ IV terms.

 

[Xellos-_^]

Check your wiki source again, i just did.

Taoism originated in 400 BC

Confucian lived between 551–479 BC.

So you tell me, which religion came first.

Taoism's origins may be traced to prehistoric Chinese religions in China; to the composition of the Tao Te Ching (3rd or 4th century BCE); or to the activity of Zhang Daoling (2nd century AD). Alternatively, one could argue that Taoism as a religious identity only arose later, by way of contrast with the newly-arrived religion of Buddhism, or with the fourth-century codification of the Shangqing and Lingbao texts.[1]

Confucianism (Chinese: 儒家; pinyin: Rúji&#257 is a Chinese ethical and philosophical system developed from the teachings of the Chinese philosopher Confucius (Kǒng Fūzǐ, or K'ung-fu-tzu, lit. "Master Kung", 551–479 BCE).

you might want read it over.

still it doesn't matter which came first as confucianism is not a religion.

there are no confucianist priest, missionaries, temples or churches. What confucianism has are scholars. how does that make it a religion?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

you might want read it over.

still it doesn't matter which came first as confucianism is not a religion.

there are no confucianist priest, missionaries, temples or churches. What confucianism has are scholars. how does that make it a religion?

Because it is "A specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons" . This (and i'm sure, others too) definition of religion does not seem to require priests/missionaries/temples etc. It requires agreed upon beliefs by a group of people. Confucianism qualifies under this definition no matter how you look at it. And as I said before, it's impact on history and follower count are enough too...

 

[Xellos-_^]

Religion:

2. A specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion

It seems you believe it's a religion after all. It definitely fits this particular definition of religion.

It's also pretty prevalent in the world numerically and has had at least a decent impact on history. It definitely qualifies in Civ IV terms.

in that case so is algebra.

Because it is "A specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons" . This (and i'm sure, others too) definition of religion does not seem to require priests/missionaries/temples etc. It requires agreed upon beliefs by a group of people. Confucianism qualifies under this definition no matter how you look at it. And as I said before, it's impact on history and follower count are enough too...

the online webster's dictionary has a different defination for religion.

Main Entry:
re·li·gion Listen to the pronunciation of religion
Pronunciation:
\ri-ˈli-jən\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English religioun, from Anglo-French religiun, Latin religion-, religio supernatural constraint, sanction, religious practice, perhaps from religare to restrain, tie back — more at rely
Date:
13th century

1 a: the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1): the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2): commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance2: a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices3archaic : scrupulous conformity : conscientiousness4: a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

 

[devilhunterred]

you might want read it over.

Kid, you are just contradicting yourself:

Taoism's origins may be traced to prehistoric Chinese religions in China; to the composition of the Tao Te Ching (3rd or 4th century BCE).

3 or 4 BC, give or take, it's still younger than Confucianism.

there are no confucianist temples

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_of_Confucius

 

[Xellos-_^]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_of_Confucius

you got me with this one.

i will go built a shrine to algebra on my off days

 

[devilhunterred]

you got me with this one.

i will go built a shrine to algebra on my off days

Eastern and Western definition of religion are different, thus there isn't a single "correct" description of defining what religion exactly is.

Algebra can also be a religion if a group of followers believe in the concept, idea, follow with the principles and worship mathematicians.

 

[UWHabs]

you got me with this one.

i will go built a shrine to algebra on my off days

I know some people who I wouldn't be surprised to have a shrine to algebra in their rooms...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

in that case so is algebra.



the online webster's dictionary has a different defination for religion.

Ok. Let's use webster then.

Religion:

4: a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/religion

Just because you want to have a narrow scope of the definition doesn't mean it isn't being applied properly in Civ. You proved it again. We now have multiple resources (including one you found) that Confucianism is a religion by at least one (widely accepted) definition of the term. I don't know how to make it any clearer...it's not a matter of opinion. It's RIGHT THERE. The use of Confucianism in Civ IV is quite appropriate based on this definition. Maybe you wanted another one in too but there's nothing wrong with this one.