Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Jusos2108, Jan 18, 2012.
What about Herat? Doesn't it flip also to the Seljuks?
I think we can safely evacuate our military from Herat in order to avoid the unit flips.
I'll play tomorrow. IIRC Herat (Eastern Khorasan) doesn't flip anymore.
Turn 0 I think we have enough Javelinmen, so I cancel couple of them from production.
Turn 1 We lay siege on Kerman. I leave the GM in Mazar-e Sharif, no point risking it by exploring India.
Turn 2 Not much happens, Javelinmen finished all around. Herat starts Sunni mosque, Mazar market.
Turn 3 Khavakend finishes Fairground, next Slave Market. Two barbarian Seljuk Horse Archers spawn. Ghaznavids troops arrive next to Kerman.
Turn 4 Ghaznavids try to take Kerman, but their Great General dies. Three more SHAs spawn, we kill four and lose 1 HA.
Turn 5 Ghaznavids get reinforcements and take Kerman, just before we could have taken it. We research Guilds, next Crop Rotation. I trade for Agricultural Science, 90 gold from Abbasids for Guilds. The last SHA is killed.
Turn 6 Two more Seljuk Horse Archers spawn, but they are instantly killed. Mine collapses near Mazar.
Turn 7 Seljuks have spawned. Khavakend finishes Slave Market, next Guildhall.
Turn 8 Seljuk flip Marv and Herat, but we deny it. Strangely we meet Seljuks simultaneously and there is only choice: "Let there be peace in our time!", so we sign peace treaty with them. Our troops are evacuated from Marv and Herat, some Javs flip though.
Turn 9 Nothing happens.
Turn 10 Herat finishes Sunni Mosque, next GH. We kill a Turkoman HA next to Marv. I change our Honey deal with Abbasids to Gems and 6gpt.
Notes and suggestions:
Declare soon war on Buyids to get the Seljuks to OB and possibly to get the Ghaznavids to trade techs with us and then Declare on the Ghaznavids and conquer our missing provinces for the UHV. Remember that we will lose Sogdiana to the Khwarezmia.
Builds boats in Gwadar and take the army to Mecca. Take the GM there too, it is probably the best first GP to be settled there.
Research to Heavy Horse Archers.
Establish contact with other civs, where is our scouting HA??
I brought the HA in the Levant back to Marv.
Turn 0: 1043 AD
114g + 13gpt @ 50% science. Crop Rotation in 8 turns.
Turn 1: 1045 AD
Declare War on Buyids. Open Borders with Seljuks. There is a wandering Buyid Daylami Tribesman north of Khavakend. We are not afraid.
Turn 2: 1046 AD
Horse Archer finished in Samarkand, keep those production lines rolling. Not much to report here folks.
Turn 3: 1048 AD
Guild Hall finished in Khavakend, start on a Spy. Kutlug Timur is completed in Gwadar, start Guild Hall next. Dates improved NE of Gwadar.
Turn 4: 1049 AD
Trade Wheat to Ghaznavids for 2gpt. Raise science to 60%.
Turn 5: 1051 AD
Our forces have finally stopped joining the enemy! Marv finishes Guild Hall, starts Fairground. Khavakend finishes Spy, starts Pottery Workshop. Watermill improvement completed near Gwadar. Request 60g from Ghaznavids for 10 turns of peace.
Turn 6: 1052 AD
Market finished in Mazar, Guild Hall next. Guild Hall finished in Farghana, Madrassah next. Marv is still starving due to Seljuk culture effects. Begin to shuffle some of our troops to the south, in preparation for upcoming war with Ghaznavids.
Turn 7: 1054 AD
We are not very powerful in the overall scheme of things:
Crop Rotation is done, start Castle Building next. Workers begin a road from Gwadar to the west. Road repairs also in Western Khorasan between Marv and Herat. Trade Crop Rotation to Abbasids for Selective Breeding and 150g.
Samarkand finishes a Horse Archer, starts on a Lancer. Manipulate Marv specialists to favour Great Scholar or Great Saint (can't get these from techs). Finish with 386g + 4gpt @ 60% science.
Turn 8: 1055 AD
Pottery Workshop finished in Khavakend, start on Sufi Shrine. Hemp improved near Samarkand.
Turn 9: 1057 AD
Guild Hall finished in Gwadar, start Dhow production line. Seljuks are now Pleased so I request 2gpt from them.
Turn 10: 1058 AD
Fairgroud finished in Marv, start another Spy. An exploratory Horse Archer crosses Western Khorasan and reaches the Seljuk capital. Can we please keep at least one unit in the West for contacts with other civs?
Turn 11: 1060 AD
Great Scholar is born in Marv. Sufi Shrine finished in Khavakend, start University. Guild Hall finished in Herat, start Fairground. Madrassah finished in Farghana, start Fairground. Buyids will sue for peace, but they don't have anything to offer us.
Turn 12: 1061 AD
Finish 1st Dhow in Gwadar, start another. Great Scholar and Great Merchant are heading south for the port of Gwadar. Some troops are also heading towards Kerman. We can declare on Ghaznavids in a couple more turns.
Turn 1 1063: Samarkand Lancer -> Lancer. The lancer, as well as the horse archer stack in Samarkand are sent south. One horse archer left in Marv, the rest are sent towards Ghazvanids.
Turn 2 1064: Marv Spy-> Marksman. Gwadar Dhow -> War galley
Turn 3 1066: Farghana fairground -> market.
Turn 4 1067: Herat Fairground -> Market. We meet Yemen. No trade can be done. Mazar-e Sharif Guild hall -> fairground. Gwadar builds on the fleet. We kill a barbarian horse archer outside Marv. We now declare war on the Ghaznavids again. Gwadar is cut off from our trade network, and is starving badly.
Therefore, Farah is attacked by our horse archer stack. We lose two horse archers, but take the city, restoring Gwadar to prosperity.
Finally, our small stack reaches Kerman.
Turn 5 1069: We refuse to give engineering to Armenia, research castle building, asymmetric warfare next (14 turns). Abbasid offers to give algebra and 140 gold for castle building. I'm really torn on what to do, but refuse for now to prevent them from grabbing asymmetric warfare. Perhaps we should trade in a few turns? Khavkend -> stable. Buyid collapses. Two ghaznavid horse archers south of Farah (one mercenary) are destroyed as well as a lancer and horse archer east of Herat (no losses, one attack at 50%).
We get a great general in Khavkend. Unsure of where to settle, so it just moves south at the moment. Kerman is taken (no losses).
Turn 6 1070: We meet the Makurians who want astrolabe for free (no deal!).
Turn 7 1072: Marv Marksman -> library. Khavkend has got Karimi, so starts building a funduq.
Turn 8 1073: Mazar-e Sharif fairground -> library. Samarkand build our probably last unit from there. The relic is evacuated and sent south.
Turn 9 1075: Barbarian killed outside Farah.
Turn 10 1077: Kwharezmia spawns and declares war. Khavkend Karimi -> horse archer.
Turn 11 1078: Samarkand javelin -> research. We meet Malwa.
Turn 12 1079: Samarkand flips, we agree. Farghana market -> library. We kill a Ghaznavid horse archer in the mountains of Gandhar. Zaranj is taken for two horse archers.
1) Where to send great general and relic?
2) Should we fight against the Kwarezmids, or sue for peace as soon as we can?
3) I assumed we take Ghazna and Qandahar as our two missing provinces.
4) When to send the fleet to mecca.
I would trade Castle Building with the Abbasids for the money and the tech.
EDIT: Ghaznavids will give us Mosaic Art if we sue for peace. Suggest we might take Qandahar and then broker 10 turns of peace to get the tech. The push for their capital can pause and then resume. They might even collapse without having to wait the 10 turns.
I haven't been able to look at the save yet, but I hope we are prepared for the Khwarezmian cavalry that is likely to pour on us at any moment?
Another question, are we going to let the Khwarezmians keep Sogdiana? I would say that yes, because, then they would act as a buffer against the Mongols and we can take it afterwards anyways. Well Bukhara at least.
EDIT: Any reason to keep Farah? I would've razed it.
Turn 1 1081 AD
Our Lancer in Afghanistan gets destroyed by a rebel archer. Khavakend HA-> Marksman, HA pillages road to Samarkand to slow down any Khwarezmian approach. Start Walls in Marv. Trade Castle Building to Abbasids for Algebra & 150g. Quandahar is protected by two archers, we'll need siege.
Turn 2 1082 AD
Lonely Ghaznavid General killed. Gwadar continues to build invasion fleet (Dhow->swordsman).
Turn 3 1084 AD
Mazar Library -> Trebuchet, Herat Market -> Library, Khavakend Marksman -> Ghulam Lancer. A bit of pillaging in Ghaznavid Lands. 2 Khwarezmian Lancer & 2 HAs at the gates of Merv. Javelinman with CG2 is upgraded to Marksman, walls will finish before they can attack.
Turn 4 1085 AD
1 Khw. Lancer dies, 1 HA retreats, pillages the Barley and is killed by our HA. Still some units around who might pillage, a worker squad is sent north. Seljuks&Makuria invite us in a war with Armenia, no thx.
Turn 5 1087 AD
Khw. units camp between the camels near Marv. Farghana starts Sunni Mosquem, Khavakend gets a farm to prevent starvation. Sieging Quandahar (with 1 catapult ).
Turn 6 1088 AD
Seljuks cancel their "tribute" of 2gpt. Assymetric Warfare is learnt, and we get a free great spy, who is sent to Gwadar. Khavakend Ghulam Lancer -> Ghulam Lancer. Quandahar is captured after suiciding the catapult, we loot 122g, the city has Mosque+Pottery Workshop, so no cultural problems here. And now, Ghaznavids won't give us Mosaic Art for peace any more.... aaaalright.
Turn 7 1090 AD
HA and Ghulam Lancer approach Samarkand, it is only defended by 1 archer; maybe we can grab it next turn.
Turn 8 1091 AD
Samarkand is captured, lost 1 HA. We make peace with Khwarezmia. For now. Mazar starts Mosque, Gwadar starts Trebuchet.
Turn 9 1093 AD
Peace with Ghaznavids, and they give us Quetta -> we control 8 provinces now! Trade Crop Rotation to Makuria for Mosaic Art & 60g.
Turn 10 1094 AD
Our Golden Age starts. Sell fur to Seljuks for 3 gpt. We're at 599g -25gpt @60% science, 6 turns to Levy Armies. Khavakend starts Castle, Herat a missionary for Quetta.
- Invasion fleet for Mekka can start in 1 turn when the Great Spy arrived
- finish off Ghaznavids
- We'll need Great priests at some point, 1 for Mekka and probably 1 for the Hindu Shrine. So we should either tech Religious Architecture for Cathedrals where we can hire 2 more, or switch to Religious law (while in GA)?
Lurker's comment: I'm a little concerned about your eventual stability. Why keep cities like Farah and Qandahar?
I think Farah was a mistake on my part, I simply didn't plan/think ahead. Perhaps we should try to explicitly decide upon conquests more in advance.
Turn 0: 1094 AD: Nothing
Turn 1: 1096 AD: Maza finishes Mosque; begins Karami Funduq. Marv finishes castle; begins Sufi Shrine. Farghana finishes Pottery Wheel; begins University. Gwadar finishes Trebuchet; begins harbor.
It looks like our fleet and army are ready for their expedition to Mecca so I have our ships begin their journey. Our Great Spy naps in Gwadar. Workers head to Southern Afghanistan in order to build farms.
Turn 2: 1097 AD: Khavakend finishes castle; begins tannery. Herat finishes missionary; begins university. I contact Sindh, Ajmer & Antioch. Sign Open Borders with Rum.
Turn 3: 1099 AD: Gwadar finishes harbor; begins Sunni Mosque. Ghanzavids Collapse. I reroute some troops so we can capture Ghanza.
Turn 4: 1100 AD: Mazar finishes Funduq; begins University. Marv finishes Sufi Shrine; begins University. Khavakend finishes tannery; beings archery range. Kerman finishes guildhall; begins blacksmith. Our mssionary shares the Truth in Herat.
Turn 5: 1102 AD: Gwadar finishes Sunni Mosque; begins library.
Turn 6: 1103 AD: Learn Levy Armies; begin research on Calvary Tactics. Khavakend finishes Archery Range; I put two Marksmen in the Queue in order to garrison S. Afghanistan.
Turn 7: 1105 AD: Farghana finishes University; begins Walls.
Turn 8: 1106 AD: Farghana finishes walls; begins Castle. Gwadar finishes library; begins University.
Turn 9: 1108 AD: Antioch wants us to join their crusade.
Turn 10: 1109 AD: Byzantines want tribute. Military is has reached Ghanza and has almost reached Mecca. The next player will have a bit of fun.
We could currently give away Farah and Zaranj to the Khwarezmids (who we should immediately open borders with by the way). It will improve our economy straight up and we lose no important resources to do so.
I would give away Farah and maybe Samarqand, since there is no point keeping it. What happened to our buffer Sogdiana? Zaranj is actually a decent spot.
If we give away Qandahar and Farah, will we still fulfill the historical victory, or should we wait until that is triggered?
Qandahar has two resources of Opium and can work an iron mine. I wouldn't give it away.
Was just about to suggest we switch to empire and maybe religious law in our golden age. Why do we run Monarchy anyway, unhappiness is virtually non-existant. Empire would solve some economic problems, though we're doing pretty good tech-wise.
Edit: About Samarkand, I think we should keep it. Sogdiana is still one of our core provinces, so its bad for our stability when the Khwarezmians own it. And the Mongols shouldn't scare us at all, since we have enough time now to train Heavy Horse Archers.
Won't the Timurids auto-flip Samarqand, since it is their capital?
The Timurids will flip all cities in their core in the same turn they appear. So when we deny it, they will have a whole bunch of units, but no cities. But I think they start with a settler, so they probably build their capital somewhere else.
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