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Spain - Most Useless "Unique" Everything?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Rhye's and Fall of Civilization' started by Cossack Captain, Mar 29, 2008.

  1. Cossack Captain

    Cossack Captain Chieftain

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    I believe that Spain must have the most useless unique "bonuses" as a civilization.

    Its unique building, Citadel, is completely useless. Bar none It doesn't have any effect vs gunpowder units and at this time, gunpowder is right around the corner! The whole concept of castles was poorly implemented and probably should have been done earlier in the game or given different bonuses.

    Unique Unit - Conquistador is also pretty weak and only nominally improved over the Cuirasser.

    Unique Power - Naval units have 2 extra moves...OK I get the point of it, but compared with the UP of other civs it's again, pretty weak.

    All in all, it is kind of sad that a civilization with as interesting a history has Spain has such boring/useless unique powers.
     
  2. Good Sauce

    Good Sauce (TM)

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    With Citadels you can CR 3 trebs really easily. Beline for engineering and you should be able to eat cities alive. Conquistadors can be useful if you beline for astronomy they come early, and are very useful against medieval units.
     
  3. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    Citadels and Conquistadors are very good unique features. There are civs with far worse ones. +2 movements I agree is a pretty weak bonus considering that in RFC naval movement is already very boosted.
     
  4. Whitefire

    Whitefire Emperor

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    IIRC, we gave Conquistadors a buff by making them unlocked with Astronomy. This means you can have Conquistador units with Spain if you wait until Astronomy to trigger the Conquistadors event. Regardless of that, it makes Conquistadors available much earlier, making them far more useful.
     
  5. mushyman

    mushyman Warlord

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    Actually, they turn up with the Conquerors event with just Gunpowder, you don't even need Astronomy. I was very pleasantly surprised! :)
     
  6. Úmarth

    Úmarth Megalomaniac

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    Yeah I always find Spain really boring to play, since their homeland sucks too.
     
  7. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    I love playing as spain! Oh well, each to their own I guess...
     
  8. Edungeon

    Edungeon Flying~

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    A city in Lisboa and other in Zaragoza makes for pretty good civ! Awesome cities! all coastal... the problem is that this is too much "pacifist" for me :(
     
  9. Heathcliff

    Heathcliff Warlord

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    I dont agree that spain +2 movements to ships are useless. That speeds up the colonization of america significantly. And is better than most other colonoial powers unique. Like Netherlands, England or France.

    But I agree that castles are pretty useless. I never build them, never in RFC nor i normal BTS. I think they should come at masonry or at code of laws and require masonry.
     
  10. The Q-Meister

    The Q-Meister King

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    Netherlands useless UP?!? Without their UP they probably wouldn't even be in the game as they are completely surrounded by rival civs.

    The French UP is pretty cool I think, can sign Open Borders with almost every non Euro nation can come in handy when fighting against another civ or getting to a good spot for a city that you wouldn't be able to go through otherwise.

    Both of these UPs can be helpful for the entire duration of the game whereas the Spanish one is only good for that specific time in history, I think the Spanish UP is one of the weakest in the game. England's UP is pretty weak too.
     
  11. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    Personally I think the Dutch could have gotten that power given to their UU and got another one.
     
  12. Good Sauce

    Good Sauce (TM)

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    Agreed. I could be wrong here, doesn't the east indiaman have the ability in vanilla civ? It's been awhile since i've played it.
     
  13. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    I don't. In fact, this way you can settle in Africa with your initial galley, otherwise it would be impossible due to France and Spain not likely to open their borders.
     
  14. CIM

    CIM Chieftain

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    Aren't Conquistadors the ONLY cavalry unit that can receive defensive bonuses?

    Meaning you don't need to quickly reinforce captured cities with musketeers, longbowmen or riflemen.

    At least that's how I use them.
     
  15. aryann

    aryann Warlord

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    I think the British UP should be faster building of galeons and other ships in the historic times of British naval dominance to represent their naval superiority.

    Perhaps Spain could get a movement bonus or two more (??)
     
  16. AnotherPacifist

    AnotherPacifist Deity

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    Also conquistadors are the only European military unit that can go into jungle. Very useful for conquering/maintaining South America and traversing Central America once roads are built.
     
  17. CIM

    CIM Chieftain

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    Also, it seems like your beef is with Castles, not the extra siege weapon experience that Spain gets from its castles
     
  18. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    I dont like them being able to settler Africa at the start of the middle ages, it isnt really that accurate is it? Also just gift them 10 gold each and you get your open borders.

    Persian Immortals can too IIRC
     
  19. Muz

    Muz Chieftain

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    Now that's a post I certainly didn't expect. Spain has the most powerful Uniques in the game, even more so in RFC. I tried it out as a war civ just for fun, but it turns out to be one of the most powerful warring civs in the game!

    Power - I like the +2 movement, it let me conquer America in one less turn and ship plenty of troops to and fro. Not the most useless I'd say, depends entirely on how you play. It makes a huge difference if you're attacking Japan or Inca.

    Building - I love using castles in RFC because of the bonus trade route. And with the huge bonus to siege weapons and Gunpowder, I really had no trouble conquering Europe with cannons. Economics unlocks free trade (and bans castles) but if you get to Economics too early, all the other civs in the world will still be holding tight to Merchantilism. So the citadels really gave me a huge military boost for 30 turns or so.

    Unit - OK, that one really surprised me. IMHO, the Conquistador is one of the best UU's in the game, even more so in RFC because they're one of the few units that can go in jungles! Amphibious attacks are hard even with gunpowder.. but once you can toss some of them in Khmer and Mayan territory, you'll easily win with half as many troops! That and you can get them much earlier than Cavalry. If anything, it's almost unbalanced.
     
  20. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    I like to sit 5 Conquistidors in paris with a scout or worker or something sat in Amsterdam, as soon as their troops leave to get some colonies I rush in with them and take their capital the turn I declare war. That city is pretty usefull for spain ;)
     

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