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Starting Location

Discussion in 'Team CivFanatics' started by Aivoturso, Jun 22, 2012.

  1. Aivoturso

    Aivoturso King

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2010
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    Just checked the team account and... We got mail!

    Here's our stating Location:

     

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  2. Aivoturso

    Aivoturso King

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    Some initial thoughts:
    - Seems like a good place to settle in place, unless the warriro uncovers something even nicer behind the hills.
    - Cottage Economy, here we come.
    - Should have been a bit less exited and cropped the image bit nicer :)

    And now I am getting paranoid, but does anyone know, is there any way for some outsider to navigate to the pic through my account since I added the pic as attachment?
     
  3. Bowsling

    Bowsling Deity

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    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Would it be beneficial at all to settle on the corn? Would we gain the food bonus in the city centre?
     
  4. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Our start is very chop-poor... If we settle in place we lose a chop and then we only have 1 chop left, and we lose the ability to work the 3 hammer forested hill. We do get to work the floodplain which will give us a boost in Commerce, but we could still work the floodplain by moving 1W and settling on the plain.

    Even a 1:commerce: boost does help though at this early stage... hmmm.

    Im thinking move to the hill where the Warrior is or move to the hill 2 S 1W. The former has lots of chops but they are in forested hills which neutralizes our Fast Worker. However, it also gets all 4 food sources in one BFC:yeah: The plains hill to the south gives us at least 4 chops, and they are lowland chops which will be good for the Fast Worker's bonus move. It also gets the corn.

    Speaking of corn, another option, is if we tech fishing, it would let us work the 3 :commerce: lake tile. That would be like having a Hamlet in 6 turns. Fishing is on the way to pottery, and we dont need Agriculture for the Corn unless we are actually going to work the corn. I would rather work the lake for the :commerce:.

    Anyway, looking at what we have I am thinking techs Medi/Poly(or not:dunno:)-->Fishing--> BW--> Hunting--> Archery--> Wheel --> Pottery --> Husbandry

    Of course these are just preliminary thoughts:) Looking forward to it.
     
  5. YossarianLives

    YossarianLives Deity

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    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Awesome! I am very excited about how close we are to getting this game started.

    My initial thoughts.

    If we sip, we will have a strong financial capital with all those flood plains (but only 1 chop and 1 pre-calendar food resource). If we move to the plains hill that our warrior is on, we will have a very strong production capital (and a lot more food & chops). I'm reluctant to move to the hill 2S, 1W because there is too much in the fog there, and we have no way to uncover it before our settler arrives. I would move the warrior 1SE to see what's in the fog, and unless we see something really ugly, my vote would be to settle on that hill.

    This would give us a 3-food capital, but we would lose the 6-food irrigated corn. I actually think the 6-food corn is one of the strongest tiles we can see because it lets us grow and whip that much faster, so I think we should prioritize Agri/BW. I doubt more than one team will go for an immediate religion, so I think we can hold off on that until we get a couple worker techs. The lake tile doesn't appeal to me so much, especially since there's not another single tile in sight that would benefit from fishing tech. imo, getting workers/settlers out faster in the first 50 turns is the most important thing. I think our tech will be better off if we get an earlier settler to go back to the fp area, and earlier workers to cottage all those fp's.
     
  6. socralynnek

    socralynnek Civ & Hattrick addict

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    Location:
    Northern Germany
    The position where the warrior is looks nice. There we have food, production and some grasslands for cottages. Good allround position, especially if we decide to go for a wonder early in the game.
    Deer and cow tiles also have hammers if we work them, so I think this is pretty strong for unit production as well.

    So the warrior should go 1 SE. Looks like in the fog we'll find grasslands, but I don't know whether it is possible to see now already whether there is a ressource there.
     
  7. Aivoturso

    Aivoturso King

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    Here is a savefile to run some simulations with (plain BTS, no mods). To limit any tests to the area we know for certain, I added a buffer zone with few squares of ice. I did not add the border areas that are visible, since we do not know what resources may be hidden there. There is one AI boxed in so bad, that it should not interfere much with anything. Settings should be as in the real deal.
     

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  8. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    3 am morning...so will look a bit deeper at the start tomorrow...err today, but later after I sleep

    we can settle on banana for 12T worker

    we lose PH for forested GH
    we lose 2xflood plain for deer

    on bananas has wet corn, deer, 2x flood plain, 1x GH, riverside PH and riverside grass as good tiles... that's like 7 tiles? we don't have happy cap and it can be some time, but as I saw these games i expect to have some happy resources (gold etc)

    agriculture seems strongest opening

    and please no settling on 6F tile (aka the corn)...

    not sure the tempo it will be played, but normally in SG games the team makes scout move first and then the settling discussion continues (like we discuss 2 weeks the position before moving scouting unit :-D, then move the scouting unit and everything we discussed is wrong ;-))

    but i guess that's different here and turn player has to have variants prepared for settling after scout move
     
  9. slaze

    slaze Deity

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    Location:
    california
    Been playing with the settle in place start... low health, no forest health and -1 FP, need to road corn to make pop 5 without unhealth. getting to pop 5 on t27 with settler built t34.

    but I agree, we should make use of the warrior before any final decisions are made

    and ag

    But at least for now I'm sorta leaning with the settle in place. The plains hill hammer and the flood plains, and it looks like it has what it needs to be an ancient age max pop settler pump

    The warrior spot is enticing however as a better production site; if something showed up in the fog i could be swayed
     
  10. bistrita

    bistrita Warlord

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    Clearly not a very good start for india(I could say a bad one),no forests to chop if we dont move,so i dont see any reason to rush for Bw before potery.
    I run some simulation and we can get a worker and setler by turn 30 and finish potery by turn 31.
     
  11. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    just clicked couple of turns to see how it looks with settling on bananas

    couple of observations ;-)

    deer 3F1H is very strong tile even if unimproved and can be worked to quicken worker to T11, I got hunting 1 turn later then expected and wasting 1 worker turn standing on deer (I didn't payed attention to MM and worked deer probably too soon, working flood plain with 1C would be probably better)

    city grows to size 2 quicker (obviously)

    we get 1st settler T28



    going agri->hunting has 2 advantages (aside from improving the deer)

    1) we get double discount on AH
    2) we get closer to Archery

    3) we don't get it in expense of anything since hunting is needed for the deer.
     
  12. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Played to turn 100. Here is the sandbox to get discussion started
     

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  13. bistrita

    bistrita Warlord

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    Going Hunting sounds like a good solution, but we have to take in considration that comerce its weak, and after building the pasture workers will have nothing to do for a long time(will take another 9 turns for whell and 10 for potery) .
     
  14. Aivoturso

    Aivoturso King

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    Thinking on very long run, settling on bananas will also result in having the capital working eigth river tiles not being able to build a levee.
     
  15. bistrita

    bistrita Warlord

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    Setling on bananas is good, we loose indeed a later livi and some floodplains cottages, but we gain in the beginning,and doing so by turn 32 we can have second city setled ,2 FW and near a completde cottage(next turn).
     

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  16. socralynnek

    socralynnek Civ & Hattrick addict

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    Settling where warrior is, gives 7 chops. Not that bad in that respect.

    OTOH, it loses 1 turn for movement and we won't have a high food city tile (but plus one hammer, right?)
     
  17. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    We can still build a levee if we settle banana because of the lake.
     
  18. bistrita

    bistrita Warlord

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    Only if we were dutch.But i couldnt care lees about 7-10 production later.We need a good start, and i think banana gave us afast start,and i realy think the best option its go :farming,whell, potery,hunting, and depending on how many animal resource we can go BW or AH.
     
  19. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    we have not dikes

    @bistrita

    yes teching hunting will delay a bit pottery, but there are 2 unforested hills and the worker didn't finish the camp yet, so plenty of time to get wheel and then we will have to run couple roads towards city spot 2 since we leave river for instaconnections

    I think you realized that in your test.

    @socralynnek

    settling on the PH where warrior stands is indeed very interesting, but we will be very far from flood plains and river, meaning we will want to move the palace eventually which is big hammer deficit

    the banana spot can imo function as bureau cap, it has 6 riverside tiles (yeah i know 3 of them are plains ones, but covered by 2 flood plains and +1 city tile) and 3 more grassland nonriverside tiles, bringing that spot very closely to 10 commerce tiles, which is good.

    food is good with wet corn and deer.
     
  20. bistrita

    bistrita Warlord

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    I think i prefer getting comerce faster to dont delay too much working cotages, by turn 38 we can have 3 cotages, working 2 and 2 more turns to work the 3. will get deer improved very fast.

    Sometimes its beter to get faster comerce so you can reserch faster and unlock techs you need.Working those 3 cotges our comerce will doubled and we can get BW and animal husbadry way faster.At least that the way i see things.There exist between players the wrong conception that food always first,well sometimes its beter to get a litle more comerce so you can unlock things which you need faster and in long run that will be a clear win.

    This way on turn 40 we will have 2 cties, 2 workers, 3 cotages worked,1 turn to finish the camp for deer and 19 beakers/turn

    Setler will take 9 turn to finish and 10 turns from second we can prepare the roads and setle fast.
     

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