Stealing/killing civilians from civs your at war with

zeta

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Jan 26, 2015
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King's Landing
Hey,

Gonna go straight to the point and ask same questions Gazebo wanted: "Ask why, offer opinion, find consensus. Not mudslinging."

Note that I'm playing with the full version before current one (was it something like 1/28?)

Why: Why can't we steal or kill some civilians even if we're at war (like diplomats, cargo ships, etc.)?

Offer opinion: It seems quite reasonable if a diplomat from the country your at war with travels inside your borders, you can just kill it, or even better, decide whether to kill or capture for yourself. At least in my last game this wasn't possible. Cargo ships were untouchable as well.

Find concensus: If this is still a thing, my ideas are:

1. Either give an option to kill or capture a civilian from the civ your at war with (since in peace time this won't be very balanced, as you can use this as your advantage)

2. Give BOTH options (you can decide whether to kill or capture that civilian [like when you can decide whether to return a unit to CS or take it to yourself])

3. Restrict civilians from passing enemy borders

4. Add a feature to either an honour tree or authority tree where you can capture/kill civilians after tree branch taken.

Might be more options but my mind can't find them atm. I find it awfully disturbing when an enemy cargo or diplomat are passing through my borders and I can't do anything about that.
 

notque

Artificially Intelligent
Joined
Nov 13, 2005
Messages
1,672
My thinking goes, I'm fine with the respectful ignoring of civilization units on both sides. When one side stops those rules, the other side should be able to respond in kind without penalty.
 

IcyAngel

Prince
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
544
I don't understand... you CAN choose to capture or kill a civilian while at war.

Move order a military unit on a civilian = captured.
Attack order/right click a military unit on a civilian = killed.
 

zeta

Mod Addict
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Messages
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Location
King's Landing
I don't understand... you CAN choose to capture or kill a civilian while at war.

Move order a military unit on a civilian = captured.
Attack order/right click a military unit on a civilian = killed.

At least for me neither of those worked on cargo ships or diplomats. But again, I'm playing on the second latest full version, so things might have changed. Not sure if there's more civilians not affected by this.
 

IcyAngel

Prince
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
544
At least for me neither of those worked for me on cargo ships or diplomats. But again, I'm playing on the second latest full version, so things might have changed. Not sure if there's more civilians not affected by this.

Ah! my bad, you're definitely right on cargo ships and caravans.
They could be made capturable if the gold were to be removed.

I always thought diplomatic units could be captured... guess it doesn't happen often enough for me to remember!
 

zeta

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Ah! my bad, you're definitely right on cargo ships and caravans.
They could be made capturable if the gold were to be removed.

I always thought diplomatic units could be captured... guess it doesn't happen often enough for me to remember!

Don't know about Great Diplomats, but basic Diplomat units can't be captured. At least in my game that wasn't possible. You can just walk your diplomats freely in enemy territory, enemy AI won't strive to stop you, because frankly, they can't.
 

Elhoim

Iron Tower Studio Dev
Joined
Nov 3, 2004
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San Isidro, Argentina.
Can't you pillage the cargo ship routes? I'm pretty sure it was possible at some point. No capture, of course, but killing.
 

Gamewizard

Emperor
Joined
Jan 24, 2011
Messages
1,234
Can't you pillage the cargo ship routes? I'm pretty sure it was possible at some point. No capture, of course, but killing.

When your unit is on an enemy trade unit's tile, a "plunder trade route" button will appear among the unit's action buttons.
 

zeta

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Jan 26, 2015
Messages
406
Location
King's Landing
Diplomats and all great people can't be captured. Trade Routes are pillaged and destroyed.

G

Okay, I definitely didn't pay much attention to pillaging trade routes. Didn't remember there was a button to pillage them. But, it still feels weird when all those civs tell you not to touch "their" CSs, but they can't prevent that even if at war with you. Same the opposite way.
 

IcyAngel

Prince
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
544
Diplomats and all great people can't be captured. Trade Routes are pillaged and destroyed.

G

Why cannot diplomats -regular ones, not the GD- be captured, dear Gazebo?
Balance decision, or an artifact from vanilla?
 

Gazebo

Lord of the Community Patch
Supporter
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Sep 26, 2010
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18,368
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Little Rock
Why cannot diplomats -regular ones, not the GD- be captured, dear Gazebo?
Balance decision, or an artifact from vanilla?

Balance. Forcing workers to work for you is one thing, making diplomats...diplomat for you is another. Also, the fact that they use strategic resources makes it a potential source of abuse.

G
 
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