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Stem cell researc to go forward in the US, Bush promises to veto..

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by McManus, Jul 19, 2006.

  1. McManus

    McManus Thinkers friend

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    http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/07/18/congress.stemcells.ap/index.html

    First time for Bush to veto legislation passed by his republican majority?
     
  2. Erik Mesoy

    Erik Mesoy Core Tester / Intern

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    First veto? Ahem, signing statements?
     
  3. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    If the bill had gotten four more votes, it would not have been vetoable, I believe.

    What I fricken HATE about this issue is that there are a host of people who equate stem cell research with abortion, and thus discourage/impede it. Only a small portion of the research involves killing an embryo, and could easily be worked around. In fact, I know of almost no projects that involve killing an embryo - most of the embryo deaths I see are entirely accidental.

    But, people refuse to be educated on the matter, and still want to stop it. Meanwhile, this year alone, an estimated 290,000 Canadians over 65 have Alzheimer's disease. And we're not given enough tools to work on it (Canada's laws are even more draconian). That's enough people to fill a decent-sized town, and they're all slowly losing their ability to operate.
     
  4. Pontiuth Pilate

    Pontiuth Pilate Republican Jesus!

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    Ironic: wait to veto your first bill until you have the lowest approval rating in your entire presidency.

    4 more votes needed. We'll find them, and Bush can pound sand.

    The GOP has been opposing science for ages now. Science either wins, or other nations get the science. Too bad for America if it's the second outcome, is all I have to say.
     
  5. downtown

    downtown Crafternoon Delight

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    I called a politician for the first time today about an issue. Bush's political points arent making my little sister's diabetes go away. However, Stem Cell Research could
     
  6. silver 2039

    silver 2039 Deity

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    Scientfic progress cannot be stopped...this research could benefit many people.
     
  7. bathsheba666

    bathsheba666 Fast 'n Bulbous

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    The one person in the western world most in need of nerve cell regeneration, and he vetoes it :lol:
     
  8. Che Guava

    Che Guava The Juicy Revolutionary

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    :lol: Funny.....


    I really don't see why people get so bent out of shape over this issue. Makes me think of an era in medicine when physicians weren't allowed to perform autopsies because it was considered mistreatment of the dead. If we're going to figure out more about ourselves and how we live, we're going to have to make measured sacrifices. I think the potential benefits here far outweigh the costs..
     
  9. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    Would I be incorrect in assuming that Bush is opposing this on religious grounds?
     
  10. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    Maybe. Or else on pure ignorance of the matter.
     
  11. Eran of Arcadia

    Eran of Arcadia Stormin' Mormon Retired Moderator

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    I appreciate the moral/ethical issue here. But at the same time, he really needs to understand that this isn't nearly as destructive as human life as he claims. A few embryos will be destroyed; I accept that this is a bad thing. But the benefits in terms of life saved vastly outweigh the costs. Besides, although I think abortion is wrong, I don't equate this with abortion.
     
  12. classical_hero

    classical_hero In whom I trust

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    We seem to be forgetting a supply of stem cells that have no ethical problems and are right now curing people of disease. They are Adult stem cells and they are working far better than embryonic stem cells.
     
  13. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    Classical Hero: you seem to be against ESC research. Could you tell us specifically what it is that bothers you about this research, or is it a knee-jerk assumption that abortion and ESC are intricately tied?

    There's a common assumption that they're similar, when embryo death is a minor position in the entire topic.
     
  14. classical_hero

    classical_hero In whom I trust

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    I am more pro ASC, because we have not even fully learnt the power of these stem cells. Why bother going into a risky area without first going into an area that so far has provided great fulfillment compared to just great promise that ESC has? Have alook at all the diseases that ASC can cure. Right now there are 72 comfirmed scientific studies on various diseases. http://www.stemcellresearch.org/facts/treatments.htm
     
  15. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    The latest Gallup poll has him at 40% approval, which isnt the lowest its ever been. So maybe its not as ironic as you think.:lol:

    Plus, why does science need government backing to win? Cant it win on its own?
     
  16. Mr. Do

    Mr. Do Emperor

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    I hear all these compaints about "activist judges" from right-wingers, so I await with baited breath for the same condemnation about this "activist president"...
     
  17. IglooDude

    IglooDude Enforcing Rule 34 Retired Moderator Supporter

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    Science doesn't need "government backing" to win, but this is about government banning, not backing.
     
  18. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    To be fair: Bush is expected to veto funding for stem cell research, he's not expected to pass legislation attempting to ban it. Though, with nearly $3 trillion in pork, you wonder why this one doesn't make it through.

    What risky area? Do you know enough about the topic to think of it as 'risky'?
     
  19. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Actually the story starts out as "WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Senate voted Tuesday after two days of emotional debate to expand federal funding of embryonic stem cell research, sending the measure to President Bush for a promised veto, the first of his presidency."

    What part of "expanding federal funding" is not backing? And if its being expanded...doesn't that mean its not banned to begin with?

    Lets be honest please.
     
  20. Pontiuth Pilate

    Pontiuth Pilate Republican Jesus!

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    Aha, are we talking about science or the application of scientific technology here?

    Robert Goddard discovered the principles of space flight in his backyard but it took the United States several decades and the outlay of billions of dollars to put a man on the moon. Forty years later private enterprise has yet to equal that feat. Another example - Edward Jenner discovered the smallpox vaccine in 1796 but it was an international program of cooperating governments that actually eradicated smallpox in 1980.

    In biotechnology there is even a hurdle before the application of a technology, namely that to discover anything in the first place you need to bring to the table a lot of complicated machinery (not to mention manhours) which is not easy to finance out of pocket.

    Long story short, it is not realistic to neglect science (or deliberately oppose science, as Bush is doing) and expect to remain the #1 scientific nation in the world.
     

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