Strange boni for UUs

Honkoid

Honk of the hill
Joined
Sep 3, 2001
Messages
187
Location
Germany
I encountered some strange combat calculations with UUs that made me wonder wether they are a bug or unmentioned intentional boni.

In a game with England I saw, that Grenadiers get no bonus against Redcoats, although they replace Riflemen and in a game against Spain I was shocked, when I found that Isabellas Conquistadors received the defensive terrain bonus :eek:

Do these strange things occur only on my computer? Are there other such flaws concerning UUs? I can't imagine they were intended. :rolleyes:
 
I think Grenadiers get the bonus only when attacking, and getting defensive bonuses is actually an ability of the Conquistador. Might be wrong, though... :blush:
 
Honkoid said:
I encountered some strange combat calculations with UUs that made me wonder wether they are a bug or unmentioned intentional boni.

In a game with England I saw, that Grenadiers get no bonus against Redcoats, although they replace Riflemen and in a game against Spain I was shocked, when I found that Isabellas Conquistadors received the defensive terrain bonus :eek:

Do these strange things occur only on my computer? Are there other such flaws concerning UUs? I can't imagine they were intended. :rolleyes:

Grenadiers get a bonus vs RIFLEMEN, Riflemen are a specific unit so Redcoats are unaffected.
 
Surely it should be UNITCLASS_RIFLEMEN that are affected?

Redcoat:
<Class>UNITCLASS_RIFLEMAN</Class>
<Type>UNIT_ENGLISH_REDCOAT</Type>

Grenadier bonus:
<UnitClassAttackMod>
<UnitClassType>UNITCLASS_RIFLEMAN</UnitClassType>
<iUnitClassMod>50</iUnitClassMod>
</UnitClassAttackMod>
 
:) :) :) :) reds coats rule:) :) :) :D :cool:
 
well, the conquistador defensive bonus is intentional. in the manual, it'll say if a unit doesn't recieve defensive bonuses, and it doesn't say this about conquistadors. i always try to kill england either well before of after the window for redcoats, it's just easier that way.
 
Redcoats and Cossaks are both nasty enough that they're still tough to fight using infantry, which is a full tech level later, while most UUs are pretty easy to deal with when you have a tech level up (Praetorians vs macemen/crossbows, Conquistadores vs grenadiers/riflemen, etc).

Grenadiers not getting a bonus against redcoats seems to be a bug, did you actually test whether it does or not, and remember that it's only when attacking? Conquistadores getting terrain bonuses is intentional, part of what they're supposed to do is be next to impossible for barbs on a terra map to dislodge.
 
Honkoid said:
Hooray for good Grammar!:goodjob:

EDIT: i am done with the less-than-serious posts.for now...

ANOTHER_EDIT: correction; hooray for unusual grammar!
 
Pantastic said:
Grenadiers not getting a bonus against redcoats seems to be a bug, did you actually test whether it does or not, and remember that it's only when attacking? Conquistadores getting terrain bonuses is intentional, part of what they're supposed to do is be next to impossible for barbs on a terra map to dislodge.
The missing grenadier bonus occured to me while attacking with redcoats. I just loaded the game a minute before to confirm this. But anyway, this bonus should be independent from being attacker or defender.

And those conquistadores are intended to get terrain bonus? I underestimated them. They should make awesome pillagers!

Dionysius said:
Hooray for good Grammar!

EDIT: i am done with the less-than-serious posts.for now...
Thanks, fell free to make as many such pleasant posts as you want :D ;)
 
Honkoid said:
The missing grenadier bonus occured to me while attacking with redcoats. I just loaded the game a minute before to confirm this. But anyway, this bonus should be independent from being attacker or defender.

You can have whatever opinion on what bonuses should be, but that doesn't affect what the designers intended them to be. Take a look at the units page here, or at the listing in the manual or in-game help. Grenadiers get "+50% attack vs. Rifleman", not "+50% vs. riflemen". It's very clearly intended to be an attack-only bonus.
 
Grenadiers get "+50% attack vs. Rifleman", not "+50% vs. riflemen". It's very clearly intended to be an attack-only bonus.
y'know, i thought my grenadiers got their riflemen bonus vs reds, but assumed i was wrong cause it's not a war i'm usually fighting.
so to answer your 2 original questions, no, it's not only on your computer; and these are not flaws, they are unique abilities (a common feature of unique units)
 
What's a boni? Wasn't he an aboriginal detective in a 1970s Aussie TV series (actually from Bolton - in England).
Or are Boni the singers who duet for U2.

Just thought I'd clarify before English Teacher (or, in this case, Latin Teacher) come along and put you on detention (make you stay in and play 35 hours of Civ4) - the word you want is "bonuses".
 
Sir Janus said:
What's a boni? Wasn't he an aboriginal detective in a 1970s Aussie TV series (actually from Bolton - in England).
Or are Boni the singers who duet for U2.

Just thought I'd clarify before English Teacher (or, in this case, Latin Teacher) come along and put you on detention (make you stay in and play 35 hours of Civ4) - the word you want is "bonuses".

well, bonus is latin, meaning "good", and as a latin word ending in
"us" it ought be "boni", like "cactus" and "cacti". i think boni
has faded out of common use and is usually thought archaic.

concerning the australian programme, i dunno, and Bono
is the lead singer of U2.

Bring back Latin! its a great language!
who wants to learn german for heavens sake.
 
well, bonus is latin, meaning "good", and as a latin word ending in
"us" it ought be "boni", like "cactus" and "cacti". i think boni
has faded out of common use and is usually thought archaic
.
actually, in this case, bonus is english, meaning "something given or paid in addition to what is usual or expected.", so the plural is bonuses.
 
Cassell`s Latin Dictionary said:
Bonus [-um -i]=good in itself , good
Oxford English Dictionary said:
Bonus= 1.a sum of money added to a persons wages for good
performance 2.an unexpected benifit Origin:Latin;good


i was referring to its direct latin origin.
naterator said:
so the plural is bonuses.
sure, bonuses could be used alongside boni.
how do you explain cacti, if all "us" ending words are "uses"?
in addition, why are we arguing about "boni" and not the thread
topic?
 
how do you explain cacti, if all "us" ending words are "uses"?
english is an inconsistant language, a bastard child of many languages. i wish it was boni, it's alot more fun. i love my cacti and octopi, but cactuses and octopuses are also considered correct, not so with boni, but i couldn't tell you why. to be honest, i had to look it up before my first post (#6, not #15).

edited typo
 
I suppose thats that settled. ...what is this thread about? i got
off-track with the dictionary fight.[rhetorical question].
 
Pantastic said:
You can have whatever opinion on what bonuses should be, but that doesn't affect what the designers intended them to be. Take a look at the units page here, or at the listing in the manual or in-game help. Grenadiers get "+50% attack vs. Rifleman", not "+50% vs. riflemen". It's very clearly intended to be an attack-only bonus.
Whoops, I'll shut up and get a nice cup of RTFM ASAP :blush:
 
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