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Strategic Positions through Eras

Discussion in 'Team Kazakhstan' started by Provolution, Dec 3, 2008.

  1. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Strategic Positions through Eras

    This is simply a post to spark some discussion how the various teams may position themselves by the era, and how we could fit in.

    Mayans : Expansive Financial
    Dutch: Creative Financial
    Portuguese: Expansive Imperialistic
    Persians : Expansive and Creative
    English: Philosophical and Financial

    Pre Ancient

    Mayan Holkan UU (Spearman, anti archer specialty and no bronze)
    Persian Immortal UU (Chariot)


    This era, our main concern would be the early Holkan rush, before we got up our defenses. Most likely, the Mayans will try an early war with someone. Right after that, we will most likely see an early Immortal rush as well. We need to observe bronze and horse locations very early to stand a chance here. We need to get out scouts right now, to define which real options we have, I would say scout would be imperative right now (also for the huts).

    Ancient

    Mayan Ballcourt (Colosseum)

    This era would see more force parity achieved. However, the Mayans would benefit greatly from Ballcourt.

    Medieval

    Portuguese Carrack UU (Caravel)
    Portuguese Feitora (Customs House)


    This era will see a relative Portuguese predominance, they will get the circumsizing bonus, first overseas colonies and be the main player in the early landgrab outside our mains lands.


    Age of Discovery

    East Indiaman UU (Galleon)
    English Redcoat UU (Musketmen)
    Dutch Dikes UB (Levee)
    English Stockmarket (Bank)
    Persian Apothecary (Grocer)


    This phase will see a Anglo-Dutch showdown, along with the stronger player of either the Persian or the Mayan, unless they managed to kill off either the English or Dutch before this.


    Lategame (Modern)


    No lategame UU or UB. But, Stock Market would have a real big say here, and to some extent Dikes as well.


    Strategy of tactical denial:


    The Dutch

    As long as we deny new Dutch settlements by riverine ports or rivers, or ports capable of producing their East Indiaman, as well as making sure that our borders are not overwhelmed. Make sure we got a well garrisoned Great Person city near their border to withstand their Creative culture pressure. The Dutch Pikemen would only be a problem for the medieval period, and they may seek to use them againt us before we get redcoats.
    If we are to see a Age of Discovery naval invasion of any scale, it will be done by the Dutch.


    The Mayans

    They would be strong in the early game and well into the late Ancient to Medieval era (Decline by Dark Ages), this means we need to hae in mind their very effective workers. They can build long military roads, fortresses as well as chopping forests and jungle easily. Clearly a contender for early era wonder races. Militarily, they would be a real danger in the Ancient Era.

    The Portuguese

    Like the Dutch, these are strongest in the Age of Discovery. They will gt out their carracks well out before everyone else, most likely getting the circumsize bonus of 1 added move for their navies. They would get new colony ports before anyone else, would have the best maps to plan around and be economically self sufficient, as well as producing very lucrative trade routes. We need to avoid having the Portuguese producing Open Border agreements with as many as possible, that would be the main role of our diplomatic service. Their Feitoras will also generate a lot of wealth for them.
    Faster settlers and workers will make these the biggest nation in bulk. This is why our settlement strategy needs to focus on building external borders on defensive chokepoints towards them (Like a hill isthmus bridging two oceans, so we can move ships in between etc). I would say the Portuguese is the biggest long term risk, with their added map advantage, naval movement and massive settlement/work colonial economy.

    The Persians

    The Persians will like the Mayans, invade in the early years with their immortals, if we neighbor the Persians, we need bronze and horses asap. Their Apothecary will produce them a massive health bonus, which allows them to settle no-river tiles. Most likely, this, and the fact that the Dutch need the rivers for Dikes, could explain why these are natural allies, as the Persians would have more than enough health from Apothecary, and would rather pursue happiness. With effective workers and creative culture, we can see these as an major threat at the early stage and a dark horse throughout the game, where they can profit from the change of focus on more hot UU and UB civs.


    SUM

    I think we will see a "loser" each term. The Pre Ancient Era will see a loser either being conquered or being cornered to useless land. The Ancient Era will see a major early war putting one player out of the game. The medieval era will see a colonial race predestined by Portugal to dominate, if they are still in the game, and the loser here will either fall to a major war or to fall behind in the colonial race.The age of discovery will see a showdown between Dutch and English, and we can expect a major war here.

    The last war will be between the two main rivals by the end of the colonial era.
     
  2. CommandoBob

    CommandoBob AbstractArt

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    I dunno...we've got people in the equation, not just the civs.

    If you were to analyze the civs in the prior MTDG (Civ4) in the same manner and then compare it to the actual game as it was played, how would that match up?

    I know that sounds like a harsh question but is not meant as such. I just think that the people part of the game can be at odds with the civ traits and such. I am curious if that happened before. I have not examined anything in the prior game and do not know the teams, civs or the final outcome. (I could do my own analysis, but since I come from a Civ3 background I would not trust that analysis, because, in the end, I would not know what I was talking about.)
     
  3. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Just think about this more of a background primer on the relative advantages of particular civs. This is what we can analyze right now, the people part, land, resources, events and diplomacy plays in later. I am merely pointing out the relative advantage by era per UB, UU and traits, so there is no need to be harsh or lecturing about it, but more an idea on how to position our UU, UB and traits towards the others.
     
  4. CommandoBob

    CommandoBob AbstractArt

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    Ah, I can do that.

    You're pointing out likely strategies that each would probably use, so that we can try to counter them, somehow.
     
  5. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Yeah, something in that direction. I had no intention to dictate the entire game, that is why we play this. Nevertheless, there are specifics that impacts the game, based on the fact of the particular five civs, the size of the world, our starting position and how these five interact. The UUs, UBs and traits are the main indicators affecting this interplay, beyond the randomizers. So let us start with the determinants. :)
     
  6. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    Some points..

    1. there are no huts in this game

    2. maya need bronze working and hunting to make holkans...holkans are 1 move units....by the time they show up at our borders (if they do) we should be able to counter them with no problme even if we have no bronze with archers..archers are cheaper and we can build 1-2 ratio...it would be just silly of them to try a holcan rush at another civ, unless their capital is 10 or less tiles away...

    3. Persia is way more dangerous though..they can tech straight animal husbandry, as they start with hunting and if they get horses they only need wheel...Immortals are unstopable if we donot get copper because of they bonus they get against archers...actually it is better to defend with warriors against them...but there is not much we can do...we will scout the area around our capital for copper and try to get it asap if we have any...if we don't all we can do is hope there are no imoratls comming our way...and if they do, just get lots of warriors...a 3-1 ratio should do it...

    4. regarding later eras...most propably by the time we will get to redcoats and dikes some team will have an advantage and the UU's and UB's will hardly matter...but if we are in a good position, redcoats are by far the best UU in the game...we can dominate Industrial wars with them..
     
  7. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    1
    Ok, thanks for informing me on the huts. Then all we need is one or two early scouts for mapping the land quickly, to get a better informed development plan for our new cities.

    2 I agree Holkans are relatively weaker, but they are excellent for a low key guerrilla war of attrition, stealing workers and so on, so dont write them out quite yet. My fear is not a holkan rush, but a holkan war of attrition.

    3 I agree on the Persians being the main immediate threat. However, I do not think it is as simple having warriors or archers against them. I think we need some catapults with our stack, for the first strike defense etc, then we need axemen for the counter. I agree bronze is the most wanted resource now.

    4. Redcoats is the thing! However, still consider the naval supremacy in this gain, a lot of things can happen with islands, continents and so on, and our ability to deploy redcoats earlier rather than later is key here. If there is no deployment, there is no use. This is why we should watch the Carrack and the East Indiaman.
     

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