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Strategic Resources?

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by MARDUK80, Jun 1, 2011.

  1. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    Should there be more strategic resources; Stone, Copper, Saltpeter, Rubber? Should strategic resources eventually get depleted?

    Stone
    Improvement: Quarry
    +2 Hammer
    Found on: Grassland, Plains, Desert, Tundra, Hills
    Notes: Like Marble can be used to speed up wonder building, but not a luxury resource as Marble is. Also Walls and Castles build more quickly.

    Saltpeter
    Technology: Gunpowder; Improvement: Quarry
    Bonus: +1 Hammer
    Found on: Desert, Hills, Plains, Tundra(?)
    Allows: Musketman, Musketeer, Minuteman, Janissary, Cannon, Rifleman, Cavalry, Cossack, Sipahi, Frigate, Ship of the Line.
    Notes: Saltpeter occurs in deposits of different sizes, ranging from 2-6 points, and vary in visual size accordingly.

    Rubber
    Technology: Replaceable Parts; Improvement: Plantation
    Bonus: +1 Hammer
    Found on: Jungle, Marsh, Forest
    Allows: Anti-Tank Gun, Anti-Aircraft Gun, Artillery, Mechanized Infantry.
    Notes: Rubber occurs in deposits of different sizes, ranging from 2-6 points, and vary in visual size accordingly.

    After reading this topic; Is aluminum too important in this game? and remembered the SR's that were in CivIII and IV, I started thinking maybe there should be more of them in CiV too. Would make a big chance for the strategies...
     
  2. evirus

    evirus Warlord

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    i think strategic resources should provide discounts rather than being strictly required for certain units/buildings.

    in rise of nations for instance their are several static resources that you can gain access two that provide small bonuses, like increased range, more hitpoints, stuff like that.
     
  3. Save_Ferris

    Save_Ferris Admiring Myself

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    What about Copper? It would be needed for spearmen, axemen (which should be in), possibly pikemen.
     
  4. Megalomano

    Megalomano Chieftain

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    Stone is everywhere :confused: i dont think there is need to represent it on the map.

    EDIT:
    Rubber/Plastics can be seen as oil derivatives, not necessarily as resources.

    Saltpeter sounds more interesting, it would fill that empty space in Renaissance and early industrial eras.
    I don't think depleting resources like in Civ 3 would be a good idea, imagine being in the modern/future era and suddently there is no more Aluminum, maybe building units should "Use up" the resources, so if they are killed you no longer have the resource you used to build it, that way you should be more careful in your trades though.
     
  5. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    Yes, out of those three Saltpeter is my favourite and in my opion should be added to the game. Once in the game it would require you to expand, go conquer or carefully plan your trades to get it and would make whole new "pressure" to the renaissance era. I like Stone and Rubber too, but would leave Copper out. Axeman could be something fun to counter swordsmen and longswords but I would leave the Copper/Iron requirement out.

    Depleting sources would be my choice, but I would tie it in with difficulty levels; Settler-Chieftain-Warlord no sr depletion, Prince-King some sr depletion, Emperor-Immortal quite often sr's get depleted and Deity sr depletion is very likely. Slowly dropping from 6 to 0...

    Can anyone come up with some new and interesting strategic resources never before seen in Civ games? :)
     
  6. Tantor

    Tantor Warlord

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    Bringing in more strategic resources would be fun, but I also think some should be made obsolete during the game.
    For instance iron and warhorses were rare during the ancient era, but not now. Just like natural resources of salpeter and rubber was important before they could be produced through modern chemistry.
    My suggestion is that when a resource becomes obsolete everyone may build units without the required resource, but those who have it, will still receive a production bonus on the resource hex.....
     
  7. Karl_Rove

    Karl_Rove Pleb

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    well, with more resources and more requirements, isn't it also necessary to add in resourceless alternatives to poorer nations? With what you are suggesting, if I don't have saltpeter or rubber, I simply wouldn't be able to defend myself, would I?
     
  8. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    What would require stone (and how would it work it terms of quantification)?

    I like the idea of additional strategic resources, because it adds more strategy to the game, and because the idea of these resources actually having some sort of real value is a good one.
     
  9. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    Yes, Saltpeter woud be a important strategic resource. You would still have Lancers, Knights, Longswords, Trebuchet, Caravels, Pikeman and Crossbowman to go with (given you have iron/horses). Build Armories and gain exp for your troops. But to obtain this new strategic resource in a way or other would be essential. Same thing with Iron or Aluminum, you need it to survive. Saltpeter would add a lot more value/strategic importance to the Desert tiles/regions... So as Rubber to the Jungle tiles.


    Same as Marble; available with Masonry. The Wonder bonus stocks with Marble given a big boost to wonder building, but it would be quite rare to find Marble and Stone resources next to other. Perhaps it would be best if you couldn't trade Stone resources. It would only give the benefits to the city where the resource is.
     
  10. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    Marble is a luxury rather than a strategic resource, however. Should stone give a happiness bonus?
     
  11. SS-18 ICBM

    SS-18 ICBM Oscillator

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    I don't think every unit should require a Strategic Resource. Also, Stone is far too similar to Marble.
     
  12. CYZ

    CYZ Toileteer

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    I think stone should be a bonus resource, the quarry gives additional production to the tile.

    Since stone is a much more common material I'd say it should give like a 10% production bonus when building any buildings in that city.

    Additionally or alternatively it can give a 25% productionspeed increase for walls and castles in that city.

    It should also be a little more common than marble.
     
  13. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    I think it would be better just to be taken as a strategic resource. Stone gives +2 hammers (Marble just one) and the production boost to walls, castles and wonders.


    Perhaps limit the Saltpeter requirement just for early Gunpowder units; Rifleman, Cavalry, Cossack and Sipahi wouldn't need Saltpeter. Though Sipahi shouldn't have been in the list in the first place as it's a Lancer replacement.

    Stone worked well in Civ4. Liked the idea of two wonder bonus resources. Marble gave production boost to some wonders and Stone for others.
     
  14. SS-18 ICBM

    SS-18 ICBM Oscillator

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    I like the idea. Non-food bonus resources would be nice.

    That's possibly another reason not to build Musketmen. Longswords are already more powerful anyway and require an earlier resource.

    The entire point of many gunpowder-era units not requiring specific resources is to provide an opportunity for players who got screwed on resource distribution.
     
  15. Karl_Rove

    Karl_Rove Pleb

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    That kind of punishment to the player seems draconian. Civ 3 had similar resources and requirements (which is where I bet you're getting this idea from) but they always had resourceless alternatives i.e. guerillas. Keeping me with a medieval army simply because I don't have access (or in civ v, ENOUGH access) to rubber and saltpeter (especially SALTPETER, which is damn near everywhere) seems to me, as I have already stated, draconian, and I don't think that it would make the game any better.

    Now, if it were to go the way of Civ 3, with the strategy resource requiring units and their cheapo alternatives... that I could get behind.

    BTW, I totally disagree about Iron being essential. I've found it quite easy to survive and thrive without it, and have done so on many occasions in both SP and MP. Aluminum may be different, but I'm always swamped with excess Al so IDK.
     
  16. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    @SS-18 ICBM
    In my opinion Longswordsman's combat strenght should be dropped to 16. Making it as powerful as Musketman.


    @Karl_Rove
    It has been some many years since my last CivIII game, that I forgot the Guerrilla unit completely. Yes it would be best to go with CivIII style with this OR perhaps a new promotion for Archery, Melee and Mounted Units giving a attack bonus against all Gunpowder units could be the solution? In Civ4 there was a Pinch promotion giving +25% vs. Gunpowder Units. Making Saltpeter abundant could work too.
     
  17. SS-18 ICBM

    SS-18 ICBM Oscillator

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    You'll be pleased to know Stone is in the next patch.
     
  18. MARDUK80

    MARDUK80 Prince

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    Great! :)
    Stone Works and all, even better way implemented than I had imagined.

    Hopefully they'll add Saltpeter later in patch or expansion.
     
  19. killmeplease

    killmeplease Mk Z on Steam

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    artificial saltpeter mass manufacturing was developed well in 16th century so there is no scence in introducing the new resource. maybe just a bonus one, say +20% to gunpowder units production.
     

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