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Strategy for Science Victory in 140 Turns or less

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by civtrader6, Oct 15, 2017.

  1. Bro

    Bro Warlord

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    One trick I learned from the TSE map is that the AI will usually go after a ranged unit. For example if you have 2 cities close to each other, one of your own and one you are about to conquer, you can lure the enemy units towards your own city by moving a ranged unit outside the city center. Then when the AI approaches that ranged unit you will move it back inside the city. Now the AI will go for the units attacking his city and in this point you can again move the ranged unit outside of your own city's center and lure the AI units towards the ranged unit again. Rinse and repeat.
     
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  2. i_imperator

    i_imperator Imperator

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    Again Thank you very much very good advice, I will try these tips out and practice them a bit. I imagine It will take a bit of experience and practice to get a hang of it.

    @civtrader6 what was your policy-path in the Alexander game? I'm currently trying to replicate this but I notice that Military Tradition and the 50% boost to mounted production tends to slow down PP by quite a bit, the earliest I was able to get PP in my current game is T60 and I managed to get Feudalism by T78.
     
  3. civtrader6

    civtrader6 Warlord

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    @civtrader6 what was your policy-path in the Alexander game? I'm currently trying to replicate this but I notice that Military Tradition and the 50% boost to mounted production tends to slow down PP by quite a bit, the earliest I was able to get PP in my current game is T60 and I managed to get Feudalism by T78.[/QUOTE]

    Hmm, T60 is definitely too long for PP so you have to speed that up. I remeber there was a gap between Agoge (for slingers/warriors) and Military Tradition - as it took some time to research horses and get all the relevant boosts. The policy/civics choice was consistent with the detailed strategy I've got in one of the other posts.
    Essentially, I'd say you have to speed up culture, normally by:
    * making sure early settler is out as soon as possible, and start with a monument in your second city (a must)
    * there's a gap between boosting archery and researching horseback riding in which you can squeeze a monument in your capital too
    * get all of the early civic boosts (a must). Here, early empire will always come naturally with the above settler out. In the Macedon playthrough, the boost to state workforce (just-in-time) came from capturing a city from Greece with 3 archers and 2 warriors.
    If possible also get at least one of the following:
    * an envoy in a cultural city state
    * find a pillage a quarry
     
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  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I am more and more finding mass slingers is not the best option and say 3 archers 2 warriors and a scout outclasses 5 archers and a warrior.for speed of taking cities. I suspect archers are just seen as OP "look I can shoot stuff easy" while the reality of difficult terrain can really mess them around.

    Getting both of these is what you always want to aim for.... A scout can find Yerevan 25 tiles away from your city, declare war on it, pillage a mine and a quarry and get away no problems. The moment I see a culture CS i am clicking on its quest and changing production to match... if its sensible or only slightly insane to do so.
     
  5. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    @chazzycat
    So here is a good example from todays game (vic deity standard continents) I spent 2 turns to get on the cocoa because I literally had no prod on the coast. I started on the south riverbank on the coast.... I do not restart
    Started with a scout, warrior circled from north, scout went south, found france and sold cocoa to them for standard 6 GPT + 3 for the cocoa in cap square, so an additional +9 gold.
    My scout finds gold in a hut as well and scouts out Khmer capital so I have a good idea where I am going.
    After my scout I build a warrior because I have 2 close neighbours ... I buy 2 slingers start building a settler and steal a builder(3 charges) to start war with my scout.
    My scout is FANTASTIC ... it is now causing the seige while holding off a barb and my few other troops take the city
    I'm a little behind in culture but that will soon change as I will have 3 cities fast and one will be on a nicely hilly Killkiminjaro with any luck (depends on France)
    My scout found neither 3 CS nor a foreign continent but I needed it for my attack and its just so flexible... its turn 24 so taking a city by turn 25 is prerty good... And I forgot to deal with France for 2 turns.
    The game is won or lost on the first 50 turns, you really have to make the most use of what you can and not force culture growth/ builder build or whatever if its going to kill you
    upload_2017-11-17_15-56-9.png

    Turn 30 I get peace because I missed Killimanjaro and I guess Catherine is going to be cross with me. I will Envoy Kmer as this may help in the short term.. Looks like I'll get Bronze working eureka as a bonus and horses so I will likely get an encampment, captured city has already repaired its culture and I am on 4.6 culture with 2 monuments on the way and craftsmenship eureka will be got this turn. Life is good and certainly not dull. I am where I am because of gold not production so as I have said before... production is king but gold is god.
    upload_2017-11-17_16-12-9.png
    upload_2017-11-17_16-12-41.png
    I now think catherine likely can expand North while Khmer may not be able to expand so will come back to attack me. I'll maybe fight a little war with France for fun then come back to Khmer, I am in no rush, just wanna have fun.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2017
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  6. chazzycat

    chazzycat Deity

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    this is pretty hilarious. I'm sure glad I asked! Thank you
     
  7. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Np, but you get the idea... if I went scout builder settler I would have neither anywhere left to expand into nor likely survived... for me the main point I push is scouts are underrated.
     
  8. The Pilgrim

    The Pilgrim Deity

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    Thanks, Victoria! This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for. Unfortunately, I haven't had the time to put these insights in practice, but I will as soon as opportunity presents itself. I am struggling with districts placements and general planning. From what I understand it's better to lock them asap than wait to buy/expand into better adjacency tiles later. Is this always true?
    Also, you wrote you aim for 15 trade routes by t100, that means many CD's. Do they take priority over Campuses early? What should be the first district in a new city?

    Another question: which eurekas are absolute must and which ones could be skipped easily? Sometimes I find myself delaying Archery because I am waiting for that barb that could be killed by a slinger or Foreign Trades because I am yet to find another continent. I know these slow me down, I just don't have a good feel of when it's okay to let go yet.

    Last question (for now): is pangaea or continents are better for fast science victories? I am used to pangaeas - more trading partners and you can delay teching all the naval techs. Not sure about Civ6.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2017
  9. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    If you get a good adjacency ... say +4 you may consider building the campus earlier but waiting for the adjacency, not really. If you can get 3 envoys at 2 science city states earlyish that's +4 in every campus, much more powerful and if you can build those campi quickly then you will get better science faster

    Wow, when did I write that? Must be a while ago. I have gone off commercial districts. Gold is great but at the expense of science... no. I am definitely a campus person now.

    Pangea are better because you can kill more civs faster and wipe out bad tech civs. Trading partners are not that important for science victories, everyone will start hating you for all the warring. For science victories you needs lots of gold at the end and so you should be sending your trade routes to money city states, they give the best return. Great Zimbabwe is fantastic if you have a good spot as an alternative and chopping crabs and copper, looting tiles, peace deals and the neighbourhood swap card is also good.
    You should look through the GOTM games for great science advice but what @civtrader6 wrote at the beginning of this is perfect, he is far more practiced than I.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2017
  10. The Pilgrim

    The Pilgrim Deity

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    You didn't. I am being a fool. You wrote envoys but I somehow remembered trade routes and never bothered to re-read. Sorry about that. Thanks again. I am way off @civtrader6's timeline. Gotta go practice. :)
     
  11. Ozbenno

    Ozbenno Fly Fly Away Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    If anybody wants to try out these strategies in a (somewhat) competitive environment, the latest Civ VI HOF Gauntlet deals with a Science Victory.
     
  12. casualplayer

    casualplayer Warlord

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    Great stuff, and very helpful in weaning me off my Tall empire impulses. One addition I might make is to use your first few Slingers, or even your 1-charge-remaining Builder, to handle most of the close scouting while your initial unit goes wandering to find those first 3 City States, World Wonder and conquer target.
     
  13. myclan

    myclan Prince

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    First time to know that even slingers can take a city. Just think they are of no use until upgrading to archers. Maybe they are just not able to deal with units because of short range but cities are ok if forming a siege? Also be surprised that warrior can stand to form a siege. Previously I think only heavy chariots even swordmen are able to do that and it certainly will take a lot of time to get the technology. If I choose to go an early war I will produce 3~4 archers after craftmanship and 2 warrior if there are no resource to mine or 2 heavy chariots if there are any. It seems that in your situation with 1 or even 2 near neighbour (actually I often that situation too) it will be just too slow to start the war.
     
  14. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Sure 3 warriors is plenty, especially with a scout. Remember that the AI is kind enough to farm around cities and so attack then heal is a good option. When we say do not forget to pillage around cities, this is one of the things you cannot forget to pillage, even knights and horsemen, its often better to wait a turn before taking a city if it means a lot of your troops get their health back.
    Also remember, slingers are at 50% reduced damage so you need to attack more times, more war weariness
     
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  15. Bro

    Bro Warlord

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    The cities only have 10 strength in the beginning so a couple of warriors at that point can definitely take out a city. Even a scout can siege the city at that point.
     
  16. i_imperator

    i_imperator Imperator

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    I'm finding it really hard to do scout>settler> 3 slingers the barbarians are really giving me a hard time on emperor. I am trying my best to get the encampment up asap too.
     
  17. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    So if you are being attacked by barbs bronze working should be an early eureka and so animal husbandry, mining, bronze working would be a good path and make the encampment cheap if placed immediately (maybe buying a tile to do so.

    With regard to the barbs, my warrior goes 1 way, my scout goes another, if barbs start appearing the last thing you want to do is keep building a settler. If I am playing without a coast or mountain range I would be tempted to drop the scout. Warrior settler can also be good. Warriors make great defence... for a start barbs will attack you even if you are entrenched in +6 terrain for +12. The enemy will chase scouts or choose a warrior over water rather than a city, it's learning how they react and deal accordingly... early barb archers are a pain
     
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  18. chazzycat

    chazzycat Deity

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    what do you smart people think about the new Korean civ?

    I'm having a hard time convincing folks in that thread they are going to be ridiculously OP
     
  19. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Deity

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    The civ is ridiculously strong on the current patch. (maybe still second to Aztec, maybe even stronger)

    But no one can tell what Rise and Fall itself will be like...
     
  20. chazzycat

    chazzycat Deity

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    that's a good point. we shouldn't assume the current strategies will still be ideal with all the changes we don't know about yet.
     

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