Suggestion: Defensive Pacts
- Thread starter lunker
- Start date
Takagi Hiro
Prince
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2010
- Messages
- 516
Oh my goodness, yes, 100% this.
tu_79
Deity
They were made difficult on purpose. It's been said that it was too easy to exploit.
Workerspam
Prince
- Joined
- Aug 22, 2016
- Messages
- 331
Another option would be to have some kind of display indicator for all leaders with whom forming a Defensive Pact is not currently "impossible". This is a QoL kind of thing; similar to the leader display in EUI that shows who has what trade goods available.
You can currently spend every turn trying to form DPs with every leader; you wouldn't be gaining information that is otherwise unavailable.
You can currently spend every turn trying to form DPs with every leader; you wouldn't be gaining information that is otherwise unavailable.
They already do this. I've seen it quite a bit. Possible that you just aren't their type. 
Takagi Hiro
Prince
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2010
- Messages
- 516
Why, because I'm a human? Everyone else on the map seems to be their type.They already do this. I've seen it quite a bit. Possible that you just aren't their type.
Takagi Hiro
Prince
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2010
- Messages
- 516
True enough. And there have been times I've opened the window and it was available... without being approached. So if they do this, it's perhaps not working completely right.
ElliotS
Warmonger
I've been actually able to get some pacts recently, though never being approached. I'm digging the politics changes in the recent patches.
I think the AI generally wants to ally with a strong military who hasn't been aggressive (probably rare for a human player). Recently I got a fast ideology and went freedom-volunteer army, giving me an enormous military score, and I hadn't attacked anyone that game. Got offered 2 pacts in the same turn.
peterw1987
Prince
- Joined
- May 8, 2014
- Messages
- 457
It is natural that we and AI only want to have DP with strong military civ.
Try to build a ton of armies to see if anything changes for you
Try to build a ton of armies to see if anything changes for you
Txurce
Deity
The balance doesn't seem right. Lately I've had a very solid military, but have yet to enter a DP. Aggressiveness is probably part of it... but it doesn't seem to stop AI DPs.
Zanteogo
King
- Joined
- Nov 13, 2015
- Messages
- 989
DPs have fallen into the same problem as bribing other civs to go to war. Sure, you will sometimes still get the option, but it's so rare that unless you check every turn you will never catch it.
The problem is the AI has infinite patience and can "check" every turn. This is why you still see the AI doing both.
To be honest, the threshold for the AI to get the "impossible" status for all trade deals has become way too sensitive. Perhaps this makes for a more competitive AI, but at the cost of "fun factor". I imagine there is a happy medium somewhere.
The problem is the AI has infinite patience and can "check" every turn. This is why you still see the AI doing both.
To be honest, the threshold for the AI to get the "impossible" status for all trade deals has become way too sensitive. Perhaps this makes for a more competitive AI, but at the cost of "fun factor". I imagine there is a happy medium somewhere.
ElliotS
Warmonger
I've gotten multiple DPs this game as Aztecs warmongering everyone's face. Get a stronger military. No one wants to defend a weakling. (Even if there are times that they should.)
Txurce
Deity
Thatwas my point about the Aztecs -- they get DPs despite being warmongers.
But in the games I'm talking about, my military is competitive, but civs with worse ones have DPs, and I don't.
I would say there is a coonsensus that the current balnce of DPs is not fun.
lunker
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2016
- Messages
- 277
They already do this. I've seen it quite a bit. Possible that you just aren't their type.
;___; That's really how it feels some days...
I don't mind how rare they can be (for me I guess), but the problem is that I have to check every civ every turn for a DP opportunity. I guess it wouldn't be an issue if that's just the consequence of how I alone play, but I'm wondering if a lot of people have similar issues.
No. The AIs can never determine when a human is gonna break off a defensive pact. They just never will. Major conditions of the DP takes into account that the AI have to insure is that they will be:
- Unable to Declare War for the Duration. (Warmongers love this part despite its contradictory nature, because it prevents someone from attempting to confront the warmongering nation without another ally)
- Have to Protect An Ally (They consider neighbor proximity and other neighbor's threat in order to find if a DP is viable.
- on the defense. Without the ability to declare war, some civs who are pursuing other victories would rather ally with the most strongest military civ possible to them.
Txurce
Deity
Then you're agreeing that the mechanic favors the AI, to the point where it's very hard for the human to get a DP. So we agree.
ElliotS
Warmonger
There's certainly no consensus. Just claiming that one exists doesn't make it so.
I've gotten DPs as both aggressive and peaceful civs. The balance seems better now. I just beat a game with domination (technically culture, but that's only because the last civ was a tiny one out of the way I could have killed in 5 turns.) so it's not like there's too many to fight through every game.
You've been having a hard time lately trying for a Progress SV, so that's possibly influencing your judgement.
Txurce
Deity
Not agreing with a consensus doesn't invalidate it.
Similar threads
