Sullla's AI Survivor Season Seven - Game 7 Thread

[AcaMetis]

Imagine the point score - or lack thereof - if the actual game ended in a Monty cultural victory .

 

[need my speed]

I don't see why Pacal would be a favourite; he has relatively little land, and the primary land he has available to him (flood plains) will draw Montezuma's attention. They're both likely to found religions and subsequent diplomatic tensions, added to their border tensions - so war it is.

Frederick is described by one word: Mediocre. Or possibly 'average', 'boring', or 'meh'. A more competent Hatshepsut, one that doesn't roll over and die immediately the moment Montezuma makes first contact. Elizabeth is more competent economically-speaking, but she also borders Montezuma.

Montezuma, of course, isn't thát dangerous. It's not like he will win. But who stands to profit from all this? Catherine. Who is very good at peaceful expansion and then pivoting towards military expansion - and who has a lot of land available to her and some juicy Egyptian wonders or English gold/science-optimised cities to expand into.

Although I very much like the theory I read of Hatshepsut going for a very early war with War Chariots - but look at how far away she is from other AIs (Frederick is closer to Pacal than Hatshepsut is to Catherine, and both Catherine and Hatshepsut are the farthest away from others). I don't think Hatshepsut has it in her - but it would be fun.

Catherine wins (Domination in, oh, I think I either default to 350 or 315, I have no clue how to predict this anyway), Pacal dies first... I can't see Elizabeth surviving intact and Frederick should be more competent than Hatshepsut (and than Montezuma, of course... Of course? Unless? ), so Frederick gets second place.

 

[Plains-Cow]

Hatty's got this.

 

[Fippy]

Hatty's got this.

+3000 on her waiting for you

 

[Keler]

Spoiler :

screenshots

Tried to make another test with different map for fun.

WINNER

RUNNER UP

FIRST TO DIE

VICTORY TYPE

DATE

Catherine	Montezuma	Frederick	Domination	1989
Montezuma	Catherine	Elizabeth	Domination	1943
Hatshepsut	Catherine	Pacal	Domination	1940
Catherine	Montezuma	Hatshepsut	Space	1925
Elizabeth	Pacal	Catherine	Culture	1925
Pacal	Montezuma	Elizabeth	Space	1925
Pacal	Frederick	Elizabeth	Space	1917
Pacal	Montezuma	Elizabeth	Domination	1916
Elizabeth	Hatshepsut	Montezuma	Culture	1896
Catherine	Montezuma	Frederick	Domination	1834

In conclusion team evil outperformed team angels

1)Catherine 19
2)Pacal 17
3)Montezuma 15
4)Elizabeth 10
5)Hatshepsut 7
6)Frederick 2

 

[Keler]

As for the religions,

Budhism

Catherine found Budhism 5 times!!!
Frederick found Budhism 2 times!
Hatshepsut,Pacal and Elizabeth found Budhism 1 time.

Hinduism

Pacal found Hinduism 4 times, expected.
Elizabeth,Hatshepsut and Montezuma found Hinduism 2 times.

Judiasm

Hatshepsut found Judaism 6 times
Pacal found Judaism 2 times
Frederick and Elizabeth found 1 time.

3 of 10 games where Elizabeth,Pacal and Hatshepsut found Judaism after Hinduism.
Other 7 games saw 3 way split in religions early game.

 

[NickGabben]

View attachment 662828

Nice upside-down Pepsi logo!

 

[ManiaMuse89]

Pacal cultural victory from a boxed in start and 4th place on the scoreboard beating a Lizzy cultural attempt by 3 turns anybody? Can just imagine the comments on the stream if that happened.

Interestingly cultural seems to be a more common victory condition (or attempt) than space in this field. At least four of the AIs will go for cultural victories fairly regularly. Hatty builds lots of wonders though is usually quite late to put on the slider. Elizabeth can put on the slider quite early though not always with enough culture buildings. Pacal is a bit more situational but can do it as above with a boxed in 6 city empire. Monty will sometimes randomly flip on the culture slider in the modern era if he is doing well though usually ends up declaring another war and winning by domination instead. The only ones I have not seen attempt cultural victories are creative Cathy and Freddy.

 

[Kaitzilla]

No Monty game will be boring..cheers featherhead.

Yup, the first half of the game should be way spicier with Montezuma for sure.


For the newer people, Monty is the ultimate warmonger.
His plotting for Max Wars, Limited Wars, and Dogpile Wars is as high as it gets. (Technically DeGaulle plots DogPile wars slightly more often. DogPile wars are plotted against AI that are already at war with someone else)
His unique unit, the Jaguar Warrior 5, does not require bronze or iron to build.
His unit courage is high, though a step below Ragnar's units who thirst for blood.


The main reason Monty edges out Ragnar for aggression rating is he is fearless of how powerful his neighbors are.
iMaxWarNearbyPowerRatio= 130 means that when he is plotting a Max War against a close civ, he is willing to take them on if they have 130 * 1.5 = 195% of his soldier strength or less.
(1.5 multiplier is because for Max Wars, AI's consider their victim to have 2/3rds of their actual defensive power. For limited wars victims have their full defensive power)

With Aggressive AI turned on, the AI think their own power is 4/3rd's higher than it actually is.
So Monty in Civ4 Survivor will attack his neighbors that have less than 260% of his strength.
Even his iLimitedWarRand is 130!


His noWar thresholds are 0 for Annoyed, 30 for Cautious, and 80 for Pleased.
I think these effectively get adjusted down a bit with Aggressive AI and civs whose WarRands are less than 100, but I'm not sure.

If he founds a religion, he will quickly be -4 diplo with heathens.
If someone is 3, 4, or 5 places ahead of him on the scoreboard, he will be -1 hidden diplo with them.
0 Peace Weight
He also starts the game -1 hidden diplo with everyone.


There is literally nothing stopping Montezuma from early wars. (He can launch with just Jaguars? or does he need Chariots too?)
At least without metal Ragnar might be more docile, but not Monty!
As soon as he signs a peace treaty for 10 turns, he will plot war on someone else and make another war.

I'll try to link some his past games from Youtube that starts on his 1st war.

**Edit**

Spoiler Some Past Civ4 Survivor Montezuma Games :

Season 6 Game 8

Result:

Spoiler :

Season 5 Game 6

Result:

Spoiler :

Season 4 Game 4

Result:

Spoiler :

Monty had a Holy War declared against him

 

[Fippy]

Lizzy and Monty

Spoiler :

 

[Plains-Cow]

Lizzy and Monty

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

I imagine Lizzy as the cat.

 

[Nick723]

Alas, I thought this was today, but another week to wait!

 

[Gumbolt]

Running late
Elizabeth 1st
Catherine 2nd.
Pascal first to die.
T315 spaceship.
9 wars.

 

[Saxo Grammaticus]

Alas, I thought this was today, but another week to wait!

So much strategy and still a full week to go (had to check Twitch just to be sure)!

In conclusion team evil outperformed team angels

Or per Season 20, Villains trouncing the Heroes The main thing that strikes me is the close bond between Montezuma and Catherine, which is odd as they start as neighbors.

The only ones I have not seen attempt cultural victories are creative Cathy and Freddy.

The one time I saw Catherine turn on the slider, Montezuma ran her over!

With a week to go, I like Montezuma and Hatshepsut's odds of scoring points in this game. It is easy to focus on the latter, but the former is not faring all that much better. While I would like to pick Catherine for first, I am a bit antsy as I think she and Pacal are both substantially overvalued in the picks so far. That just makes me want to even the odds by picking an undervalued leader, but we have seen before that the favorite can deliver regardless of how they are valued...

 

[Gumbolt]

Next week. I am early.

 

[danjuno]

Running late
Elizabeth 1st
Catherine 2nd.
Pascal first to die.
T315 spaceship.
9 wars.

Interesting. Care to elaborate?

 

[Keler]

If Pacal does not die by Monty first, then Maya will be a ticking bomb for Aztecs. In that case, I see Monty coming up as runner up quite hard. Like very hard. I imagine if Catherine runs over Egypt and Montezuma runs over England, instead of turning his attention to Frederick or Pacal, crazy Montezuma might just attack Russia for fun. I really can't count on him. And in the long run I favor Pacal over Fredeirck for second place.
That is why I selected Catherine Domination victory with Pacal second. 325 turn with 11 wars. Elizabeth ftd.
This should be interesting game.
Still, under fair land share in terms of both food and productivity, low peace weight leaders almost always win 1v1 wars against high peace weight wonder builders.

 

[Gumbolt]

Interesting. Care to elaborate?

I hope English settle the copper. They have a great start. Monty attacks Pascal and hopefully English have a shared religion.

Catherine is just nicely tucked away. Not sure the Egyptians will be all that but I guess they may have the most land.

It's a very mixed field. Only one true warmonger on this map and that might get him taken out.

 

[lymond]

Interesting. Care to elaborate?

He's a Brit!

 

[Fippy]

Brits should also play in my casino
3000 free.