Tactics and Strategy Turns 100-120

[Kaleb]

From the military thread:

Oskemen - will finish the forge on the turn we get Machinery which will be handy.
Shymkent We can do a 2 pop whip to finish the Catapult in 4 turns, so we can use the overflow for a Crossbow.
Aktau - one turn on the HA, then work on Stable doing a 2 pop whip once it's back to pop 5. will finish off two HAs quickly after that
Atyrau - whip a Catapult or go for a Forge? (I would really like a forge here...!)
Pavlodar - ?? Barracks? Forge? more units?

Spoiler :

for next turn we have a few workers that we need to decide what to do with:
Worker by Oskemen > (I suggest, N,N, chop for 1 turn. Shymkent borders pop this turn so next turn he can move to the FP to cottage
Worker by Haz > N, to cottage
Worker by Aktau > how about S to the deer to road, seeing as he's here?

 

[Indiansmoke]

Oskemen - surely we will not grow working unimproved tiles...lets whip something.
Shymkent - 2 pop whip for cata sounds good..overflow in buildings (we are in organized), and we don't need crossbows, we need maces...Sancta are going for elephants.

Actau - yes

Atyrau- yes we need forge there, but have to decide whether is maoi first or forge..in any case military whips and overflow.

Pavlodar - forge?

Workers

by Oskemen - I suggest cottage for 1 turn (it is a shared tile with Oskemen we need a cottage there), next turn it can move to flood.
by Haz - yes cottage
By Actau - 1N (in the plains river forest) to farm for irrigation.

 

[Kaleb]

by Oskemen - I suggest cottage for 1 turn (it is a shared tile with Oskemen we need a cottage there), next turn it can move to flood.

yes, sure we whip once we grow again. I was thinking it would be good to chop for 1 turn so we can finish off the chop once the forge is done and we have Machinery to get a Mace out quickly.

If Shymkent is going to build Maces don't we want a Barracks first??

 

[damnrunner]

Atyrau - The plan is to build units and use pop whip overflow to build either the forge or Moai right.

I think forge 1st I think. It will make slaving more efficient.

 

[Kaleb]

btw I logged in after the Cav turn. Their Chariot has moved back to the hill - hopefully they'll give us an intel update before our turn. We need to remember that SANCTA can hit our axemen with a Chariot if they first build a road on that tile 1E of the Cow!

SANCTA's military value has gone up 7000 this turn and their score up 17. (ie plus 3 population) so they could have built up to 6000pts worth of units (like an Axe or a Longbow).

Current view:

Spoiler :

Stuff to decide on for coming turn (unless we change plans):
Atyrau > what to build? I suggest a Forge for overflow, then switching to a catpult
Spy > (on hill with Axe) NE,N or NW? - I prefer NE

Workers:
by Haz > N to cottage
by Aktau > N to chop (and then farm)
by Oskemen > N,N to chop 1 turn (then onto FP) or Cottage on spot for 1 turn

Other moves:
Old Spear > moves to Hazrat-e

 

[Indiansmoke]

Atyrau forge is good
spy NE
warrior sitting on that hill SW of new city is not needed there any more...move on forest hill to scout more or move back to Oskemen for hapiness.
The axe in the forest by new city take him in city?

Oskemen worker I am fine with both chopping for 1 or cottaging for 1.

Actau BTW is not going to finish that chariot we started? will we lose the one turn invested on chariot?

 

[Kaleb]

Oops sorry forgot about that warrior, will bring him back for garrison.

Axe should stay put - when their city pops they'll be able to see the forest tile. There's a worker there and he'll be vulnerable to a chariot steal. I would even move the catapult up for cover. The axe on the hill we can pull back.

Aktau can finish the chariot after stable is done

 

[Kaleb]

SANCTA have brought forward 3 chariots - one with Sentry promo

no soldier increase in demog, no boats spotted

Spoiler :

 

[damnrunner]

We should move up the chariot that we are keeping back right now. Right now our axes are going to be pretty weak if on defense. Especially without promotions. We currently have no spears in range right now - or am i mistaken? Our Sword will give decent defense but two chariots will probably kill it. The catapult (we do have on up their right?) will also be a decent defense unit.

Do we move the axe back into the city - or move up the sword and give the axe a woodsman promotion.

Also we should consider that Sancta might not going to attack us but is going to try and move the chariots around us to harass our rear. They could go SW, SW and then S, SW. That would be pretty hard terrain to case them down in.

In fact SW,SW is their best overall move for the next turn. They can still threaten the city. They can threaten the worker in the woods, they can move on further south, and they have a defense benefit from the river.

 

[cav scout]

SW, SW would be the most dangerous SANCTA move. We currently have an axe, catapult and worker on the forest and 2 axes and a sword on the city. We have a warrior SW of the city and our spear is 4 turns away still.

We should move the sword and both city axes to the forest, concentrating our forces there. Just the warrior will be left in the city. Instead of a chop the worker should road. I would save the promotions for now. We should also bring the chariot up of course. We could also upgrade the warrior to a spear after he reaches the city (gotta make sure we have enough money to do so).

This will allow us to hold the forest (the cat and the sword win defending) and also counters a S, S move to the hill- we just attack and clear them right off. Best of all it might encourage SANCTA to go S, SE to the other hill. They might think they can outmaneuver us and threaten the city that way. But if we road first instead of chop we would still be able to attack them on the far hill.

Finally, if they do go SW, SW we would be be prepared to attack them across the river (cat first, then sword, then axes). We can't let those chariots get into our land!

 

[damnrunner]

Spoiler :

SW, SW would be the most dangerous SANCTA move. We currently have an axe, catapult and worker on the forest and 2 axes and a sword on the city. We have a warrior SW of the city and our spear is 4 turns away still.

We should move the sword and both city axes to the forest, concentrating our forces there. Just the warrior will be left in the city. Instead of a chop the worker should road. I would save the promotions for now. We should also bring the chariot up of course. We could also upgrade the warrior to a spear after he reaches the city (gotta make sure we have enough money to do so).

This will allow us to hold the forest (the cat and the sword win defending) and also counters a S, S move to the hill- we just attack and clear them right off. Best of all it might encourage SANCTA to go S, SE to the other hill. They might think they can outmaneuver us and threaten the city that way. But if we road first instead of chop we would still be able to attack them on the far hill.

Finally, if they do go SW, SW we would be be prepared to attack them across the river (cat first, then sword, then axes). We can't let those chariots get into our land!

I think I agree with that. But I have one question. Can the worker finish a road in time? Won't it take 2 turns? Also if they attack will they auto target the axe even though the catapult is actually stronger. I recall that sometimes siege units are last to be targeted, even if they are stronger than other units.

Should we give one of the axes a woodsmen promotion. Or at least a combat 1 promotion. If they attack we can expect that one of our axes will take damage.

We should also move up the chariot.

Some other thoughts - what other mischief could Sancta bring. They coudl move up a few other units next turn which could force us to make other choices. Any thought on how that could play out and how to best prepare for it.

 

[cav scout]

You raise a good question about the catapult defending before the axes. Does anyone know for certain about this?

About the road:

1.) Next turn our workers starts to build the road.
2.) SANCTA plays their turn.
3.) When we are up again we have our worker finish the road before we move our combats units to attack SANCTA

What we are hoping for is that SANCTA will underestimate us and say:

"Hah! Kaz has overreacted to our chariot threat! They rushed units into the forest to protect their worker while he finishes chopping. It would be risky for us to go SW SW because their little forest stack could attack us. But if we go S, SE we can outmaneuver them!"

 

[Sommerswerd]

We should move at least 1 Spear up to the front. 1 Spear in the area would neutralize the SANCTA chariot threat.

 

[Indiansmoke]

Cav scout got it right...all units to the forest including our chariot..combat promo to all...and worker start roading on the forest.


BTW...imagine we had planted on th norhen hill

 

[Kaleb]

we need 27 from our allies to keep at 100% this turn. I reckon we can drop a little bit lower than that and still get Mach in 3 turns, but it's tight.

And chariots will target the Catapult first as it's the strongest unit. That's why I moved it there last turn.

What shall we build in Pavlodar btw?

 

[Indiansmoke]

Pavlodar forge and Oskemen sword

 

[damnrunner]

I would normally agree that Pav should go for a forge - but don't we want to spam out as many units as we can right now.

My vote would be for a catapult, or a spy (we need a 2nd one to get behind Angle).

 

[Kaleb]

I'd prefer a Catapult or a Spy in Pav right now and finishing the forge in Osk first. We can whip the forge and lost the wine. We'll still have 8 base so the Forge will give +2 and we can start on a sword or an axe before we finish machinery. Once we get machinery they will automatically turn into Maces and we can complete it very soon after get Machinery.

 

[Indiansmoke]

Catapult in Pavlodar is fine...I don't agree with spending anymore hammers on spy right now.

In oskemen I feel we need another unit to the front asap, that is why I say sword and also it works out better anyway.

How many hammers invested in forge?

If we do sword for 1 turn that would be 9 hammers on it so would leave 31 for a 2 pop whip...that is 37 overflow to forge ...46 with organized ...+ the 10 (8 base + 25%) = 56 hammers into forge

so we will have a sword in 2 and 56 hammers in forge...cannot see how slaving forge is better in any way.

 

[Kaleb]

How many hammers invested in forge?

can't remember and can't login but we're putting in 11/turn and we've got 4 turns left, so it must be 76-86 /120. So not enough for a 1 pop whip.

If we whip the forge we get +25 on the whip and then +25 on the overflow for a unit.

If SANCTA get Construction next they'll only get it 2 turns before we get Machinery. How many units do you think they can build and get to the front with another 10 turns let's say?