1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Team Game #2 - OCC Conquest only

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Fippy, Jul 31, 2018.

  1. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    Start we agreed on :)
    Spoiler :
    Settings
    Spoiler :
    As mentioned, we can only win by conquest (or lose).
    I forgot changing the name, sowy.

    Forum game means that everybody (no restrictions like diff level) who feels like playing turns can do so,
    after chatting with us what we are planning.

    Please no posted solo plays, as usual you can ofc play on your own but not post any info from your game here until we finished.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Tonny

    Tonny Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    146
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Netherlands
    I'm interested to play some turns
     
  3. Undefeatable

    Undefeatable Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2010
    Messages:
    822
    Crazy idea: if there’s food to the east, settle on one of the golds?
     
  4. Lain

    Lain Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2011
    Messages:
    669
    Never played OOC, not even once. Will only watch a bit in the beginning ;)
     
  5. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    We could spend one turn on moving 1e with the settler,
    and also move our warrior into that direction, who can give us some info from east before we settle next turn.

    Even if we find nothing new, settling on that gold would not be terrible imo..
    working 3 for -6 food seems a bit unrealistic with just 2 plains cows, we will also have to use at least 1 scientist at some point with PHI ;)

    + hill defensive bonus might come into play with those settings.

    :) Tonny, 1NE works too i guess (no bfc stone bothers us? probably not)
     
  6. Tonny

    Tonny Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    146
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Unfortunately the warrior won't reveal it on the first turn.
    Only if you would be willing to "lose" one turn with the settler going NE trying to find more food you could make a gamble. It's only 1 turn.

    lol... crosspost with @Fippy
     
  7. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2008
    Messages:
    19,959
    :popcorn:

    settling on gold not bad idea at all, UD. Stone would be so nice too, but who knows with food.

    I'd move warrior on Stone or 1SW
     
  8. Pedro78

    Pedro78 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2016
    Messages:
    938
    I'd probably move warrior on the stone just to make sure there's no great food resource down there, and then settle 1NE if nothing. Stone will come online soon enough even if not in BFC, and gotta keep in mind that there's most likely a strategic res 1NW of the Settler. Plus moving 1NE brings 6 new tiles with potential food. Working those three golds at once is a pipe dream anyway.
     
    Kaitzilla likes this.
  9. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    Done as Pedro wrote (and most suggested), warrior found nothing south and we settled 1ne..
    Spoiler :
    Wheat yay (can be wet with CS, bit long irrigation chain but okay), and coastal is also very nice especially with not many water tiles :)
     

    Attached Files:

  10. dutchfire

    dutchfire Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2006
    Messages:
    14,106
    Location:
    -
    Having a lighthoused lake is also nice, reasonable tile for most of the early game.
    First few turns we don't select tech, right?
    Agriculture first seems obvious.
     
  11. dutchfire

    dutchfire Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2006
    Messages:
    14,106
    Location:
    -
    Also, it's probably safe to be on the coast in case an AI settles a 1tile island! (Is Capitulation on?)
     
  12. Swordnboard

    Swordnboard Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2018
    Messages:
    194
    Gender:
    Male
    :goodjob: on the wheat.

    Some (rather boring) info from demographics screen:
    2 civs have mining. Neither the malinese nor the babylonians are in the game.
    At least 1, but no more than 2, civs are charismatic. Probably 1 or more creative civs, but can't know for certain until turn 3.
    A minimum of 3 civs (more likely 4 and possibly 5) are coastal, with 1 civ extremely coastal (only 3 land tiles in first ring of culture).

    I'm thinking agriculture->mining->AH seems pretty good. Even if no horses in the BFC, we should be able to jam out enough warriors for barb defense to avoid teching archery for now.

    How do others feel about some worker stealing/stifling in the early game, maybe trying to get a couple woody2 warriors? A little risky without aggressive AI for easier ceasefires, but might make our lives easier later on. I guess I would call myself slightly opposed for now, especially since we won't know much about the AI due to random personalities, but just wanted to throw that out there.
     
  13. dutchfire

    dutchfire Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2006
    Messages:
    14,106
    Location:
    -
    Without any calculations, I would think agriculture -> animal husbandry is best here, since we want to grow and cows are better than gold mines for that. (Also, AH could pop horses on the suspicious grassland W of the lake)
    Anyway, we still have some time to decide on this.

    I don't have much feeling for these settings, how important is barb busting? I would think that with Deity AI flying around, there would be a lot fog busted automatically. And since we don't have to move settlers out of our cultural boundaries, barbs are less of a problem.

    Anyway, for the next turnset, I think we only need to decide on (my suggestions in parentheses):
    Build: (Worker)
    Research: (Agriculture)
    Scouting: (Probably best to go far out. We won't settle cities so we don't need to look for spots.)
     
  14. Swordnboard

    Swordnboard Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2018
    Messages:
    194
    Gender:
    Male
    Ag->AH runs into issues with the worker having too little to do (About 4-5 turns where we can't do anything but make a grassfarm, which is OK not great). Mining has fewer issues with that, accelerates researching AH and other things, and we can always take off a gold mine when the cows get improved. But I haven't calculated too precisely or deeply either. I agree with worker, agriculture, and scouting far away/trying to meet people.
     
  15. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    Fogbusting (and building some warris) is good imo, Archery also costs hunting and we need lots of techs early.
    Granary highly valuable on low food but good hammers starts.

    Not sure on GLH, while trade routes are limited settled GM gives food hmm..

    AH before mining might lead us towards having not much of value to build for some time,
    SH failgold not so good without stone and no city costs. Monument not needed for a long time.
    Barracks could be okay thou, if we try reaching 8xp for HE.
     
  16. Pedro78

    Pedro78 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2016
    Messages:
    938
    Toughest part here is gonna be remembering that we're playing Lincoln and not Isabella ;)

    On a serious note though we should set our goals early and not be distracted by too many wonders. GLH is a no-no: trade routes are worth peanuts in OCC, the gpt from a GM are useless for most of the game, and +1 food later is not worth those early hammers.

    As we're PHI, I believe that we should just get the Mids ASAP and then beeline whatever military tech we want to "break out" with (or beeline CS-Edu for OU if we plan on attackin with renaissance units). We will have a lot of extra hammers early on, which should allow us to save some forests if we start on the Mids early enough. I'll try to think of some strategies tomorrow, but for now I can't stress enough that we should be wary of "distractions" and stick to our beelines -- we don't wanna play this one like dear Obsolete :p (which obvsl means no National Park before Cuirs).

    Anyways, should be fun :)
     
  17. Swordnboard

    Swordnboard Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2018
    Messages:
    194
    Gender:
    Male
    I agree on minimizing distractions: GLH is not nearly good enough to justify 260 hammer investment. Mids would probably generate a GE though, so that's an excuse for 1 outside-the-box wonder (or just rush the very inside the box Great Library). I also considered Great Wall and Espionage Economy, but without BFC stone it's too risky at this point.
     
  18. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    True ofc, but everyone dun be afraid to mention all options ;)
    Lively discussion i value more than winning.

    Key wonders / national wonders rarely change with this setup..
    Pyras, Glib (Aest can be used for trade as usual anyways).
    NE for sure if we can trade for marble, if not and we are happy with GP generation probably not urgent.
    HE if we manage getting an unit early, Ox is great with stone + cheap Uni so i think we should go thru Edu and use Lib.
     
  19. Pedro78

    Pedro78 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2016
    Messages:
    938
    Thoughts in no particular order --

    @Swordnboard Espionnage economy, imo, is a no-no in OCC. You'll always want to be ahead in tech, and will have access to abundant tech trading (partly because you're always at the bottom of the scoreboard, so WFYABTA is a lesser issue). Also, you will never have a holy city and won't have any culture in AI cities so most of the EP discounts are unavailable. Overall, it looks like TGW is a big early investment that isn't really worth it.

    With low food, high hammers and a PHI leader, we definitely want GLib, no matter if we have marble or not. Having the Mids will only make it better. Not sure about NE, it's probably not required but we might still end up building it because these hammers would be better spent building the NE than research.

    I'm not sure if we'll want Aesthetics for trade. Mostly because I believe there's a lot to gain from beelining CS really early. Allows for Bureau + Caste. Having Bureau makes building GLib easier aswell, and the more we wait, the greater the chances are that we'll be able to trade for marble (not so important).

    I'm pretty sure that early Oxford will pay off aswell. Having stone and being PHI makes it even more obvious. We'll probably have to tech at least to Rifling+Steel before the game is over, so there's no question that it'll pay off.

    It's a bit early to start discussing what units we'll first attack with, but I think it's very likely to be either Conqs or Rifles/Cannons (times very well with the bulbs, Oxford etc.). But it's probably worth it to explore other possibilities like trebs, especially if an AI is far behind in tech. This screams for some testing, but unfortunately I have very little time to play Civ currently.

    One thing to keep in mind is that with OCC we can get resources very cheaply from the AI (can do stuff like corn for iron etc. as we have only one city). So accessing strategic resources won't be a problem.

    I don't think the 5 national wonders limit is going to be a bottleneck as we're going for conquest. Depending on how much we want to grow and if we want to draft, we might have to build the Globe Theater at some point, preferably before the first war. Actually, I think we'll definitely have to build it because I can't imagine winning this game without drafting (Conqs might be useful at first, but I doubt we'll have the production to roll over the map with mounted units alone).

    Can't really think of anything else right now.
     
  20. Fippy

    Fippy Micro Junkie Queen

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2013
    Messages:
    9,858
    Gender:
    Female
    Think i like Agri - mining - wheel - pottery - AH for this start.
    Using gold mines stops growth, but can give us a granary faster (and good stuff we can build, AH gives prod from cows but not much we can do with those hammers).

    Then we could remove gold mines step by step for improved cows, or a regular farm if worker cannot improve cows already, but went thru the most important early teching and will not miss them too much.
     
    Swordnboard likes this.

Share This Page