Teching on higher levels / Internet

[Ignorant Teacher]

Hello all fellow players!

I have some troubles keeping up on tech on Immortal and I sometimes rely on the Internet to overcome that problem. The thing is that I've found out that I've been beelining computers on most of my games and I feel it is kind of a crutch. I don't like relying on such things.

How do you do to keep up in tech on Immortal and above? Sometimes, when all the stars align, it's not an issue, but in most games it is. In the end of the day, it all comes down to the learning curve and that must happen to everyone. For example, I've seen Dirk's deity doctors' game and his teching was awesome, much better than what I saw him doing before.

I'd like to hear from you how you managed to overcome the difficulties brought by moving up the levels and what advice you can offer.

 

[Loki Strikes]

Immortal I can pretty much command a tech lead all game if I want to (bulb intelligently, aim 150-200 beakers 1AD, use GA to power scientists, pretty much exclusively farms), I will be behind until aesthetics or a little bit after, but then its just not close typically, I will usually stop emphasizing research as much after steel or rifles and just stomp everyone maybe falling behind in tech, but at that point the game is one so I can catch up if I want to or just keep stomping people. Deity is different, I am typically behind until a philo bulb, and then I am on parity, falling behind a bit, and then trading back to parity, however I have seen players like Dirk and Rusten dominate Deity tech pretty much all game (largely through dark magic I am convinced)

With regards to advice, my game really stepped up a lot when I started being more liberal with farming my early cities in order to whip infrastructure/push out a lot of GS really fast in a golden age, emphasize monarchy/currency/COL too, however courthouses aren't always as urgent as most people think they are, I will often delay courthouses and instead decide to starve for a couple extra GS if I am small. Trade whore big time, always look for resource/wealth trades, map trade if you are first to paper, selling tech for $$$ is great, if there are enough AI's you can run 100% slider virtually the whole game, and of course 0% slider after writing till you have your library, also sometimes 0% just before academy/unis/oxford (when you don't have unlimited gold coming in)

 

[shyuhe]

Cottages take a long time to mature. Depending on your midgame strategy, it may not be a wise decision to cottage every green tile. GS fueled liberalism into a military push can lead to better teching overall. You can always cottage post emancipation.

Warring AIs also tech a lot slower because they'll bulldoze cottages for workshops. So bribing world wars will speed up tech rate relative to the world.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Expand better. Be it more efficient REX (both in terms of speed and ability to keep teching while expanding), or more efficient warring. The more land you got (while being safe diplo wise), the faster you will tech in the end (whatever improvements/style of play you use).

As games are very time consuming in these difficulty levels, I've founded that playing many starts to 1 ad is a good way to improve. Aim for the stats Loki provided, and try to grow 2 specialists in this time window.

 

[Kid R]

My main problem with the internet isn't I think I build it too much but I wish I got there first more often

 

[Dirk1302]

Hello all fellow players!

I have some troubles keeping up on tech on Immortal and I sometimes rely on the Internet to overcome that problem. The thing is that I've found out that I've been beelining computers on most of my games and I feel it is kind of a crutch. I don't like relying on such things.

How do you do to keep up in tech on Immortal and above? Sometimes, when all the stars align, it's not an issue, but in most games it is. In the end of the day, it all comes down to the learning curve and that must happen to everyone. For example, I've seen Dirk's deity doctors' game and his teching was awesome, much better than what I saw him doing before.

I'd like to hear from you how you managed to overcome the difficulties brought by moving up the levels and what advice you can offer.

Well take a look at DMOC's ultra challenge in my sig, i had 1000 bpt 1000 AD, that's really a lot.In ABigCivFan's domination game i had some 850 bpt 880 AD in a GA. That was really good teching too imo.

But it's so dependent on the map, in TMIT's early deity game training game we were playing a big backwards empire and i had only 275 bpt 1000 AD. In Dirk's deity game ptII i think i'll have good research but nowhere near 1000 bpt around 1000 AD. I doubt if i'll have that tech rate it in the Liz game you mention as i don't have too much land there.

In most of my games i keep up in tech by acquiring more land. That 1000 bpt 1000 AD in DMOC's game was nice but i had maxed out everything already, 1000 bpt 1500 AD is rather meagre on deity so i attacked Monty somewhat later. Leveraging the techlead in more land or some other kind of victory is more important than the techrate itself.

 

[Ignorant Teacher]

Thank you all for your help. I'll try to aim at getting 2 GPs and around 150-200bpt by 1AD. I'll start a thread with some openings hoping that you'll help me improve my early game, where I'll play some starts until 1AD and see what I could have done better.

 

[Kadazzle]

Usually on Immortal, I always have the tech lead either around Aesthetics (good teching map) or Civil Service (Bad teching map). Generally, most riverside grassland tiles get farmed, while the capital + one or two other commerce sites get cottaged. Bureaucracy is a big help when it comes. You can usually pump out a first settler anywhere from 2800BC->2200BC on Immortal, and I usually use that city to snag an important resource and build a library at pop 3 which it will then run a food resource + 2 specialists for a quick early GS which would normally be academy'd into my capital. The it's easy cruisin'.

 

[shulec]

You can always cottage post emancipation.

I am in the same boat as "Teach". If you say something like this, please mean it literally. (And if that is the case, please convince me!)

I tend to stop cottaging well before emancipation. My thought on cottges at this point are "if they aren't there now, it's too late". There are more advantages to windmills, workshops, and watermills in the later game.

 

[shulec]

I find that in my games, I can keep up with teching, but feel like I am getting killed on infrastructure. I look at my neighbors, and their workers are sitting around picking their noses, while their cities are at 10 to 14 pop and I am still trying to get to 5 to 8 population and build a weenie archer to accompany my resident (bad-ass) warrior to push up my happy cap.

Am I wrong to conclude that this is common, and as a result of this, city specialization is imperative?

All crying aside, I guess that I:
Tech at 75% efficiency, when I should could be at 90%.
Expand at 75% efficiency, when I should could be at 90%.
Work tiles at 75% efficiency, when I should could be at 90%.
Micromanage at 75% efficiency, when I should could be at 90%.
These things all need to be improved.

Diplomacy is key. I do well with this.
I don't get greedy with expansion or wonders.
I try not to do anything half-hearted. No, "Oh yeah, I should go for that!"

Share you thoughts, please.

 

[shyuhe]

I am in the same boat as "Teach". If you say something like this, please mean it literally. (And if that is the case, please convince me!)

I tend to stop cottaging well before emancipation. My thought on cottges at this point are "if they aren't there now, it's too late". There are more advantages to windmills, workshops, and watermills in the later game.

If you're playing on higher levels, your games are much more likely to go into the modern era. So post-emancipation cottages have plenty of time to grow.

 

[Ignorant Teacher]

If you're playing on higher levels, your games are much more likely to go into the modern era. So post-emancipation cottages have plenty of time to grow.

That's true. I played the Elizabeth LHC these days and I only built cottages in the capital until Emancipation. I have to say it worked super, especially because I had all the gold multipliers in the other cities when I revolted out of slavery. What do you think about that: prioritizing (whipping) the gold multipliers (except unis for Oxford) and building the research ones later?

 

[Kadazzle]

You MUST farm your early cities. It's very hard to get the infrastructure up in the time span you need if you cottage. Getting Granaries/Courthouse/Lighthouse/Libraries/Barracks and all the other shazz you need.

 

[shulec]

If you're playing on higher levels, your games are much more likely to go into the modern era. So post-emancipation cottages have plenty of time to grow.

Good to know. Thanks!

 

[KeloGBites]

I'm pretty much where you are, I seem to find games where I have a commerce resource at the capital or close by (Gold, Fur, Silver, Gems) I can hold tech parity and then zoom away after Liberalism, though I am starting to become somewhat addicted to Philosophical for the relative ease it gives in getting LibSteel which translates into a ridiculous advantage. But generally, yeah. Whipping has become more intensive, you do more math, and you actually keep an eye on Diplomacy (Holding a large enough military to act as a deterrent+expansion+ decent tech pace=no way it's going to happen).

 

[Grashopa]

I've never got to the internet. The game is usually over before that. Work on gaining an advantage early through bulbing and better expansion and get on the attack. A big hammer advantage will overcome any late game AI tech advantage.

 

[shyuhe]

What do you think about that: prioritizing (whipping) the gold multipliers (except unis for Oxford) and building the research ones later?

I don't think I've ever built gold multipliers before research multipliers, at least not in recent memory. You should be able to trade for a reasonable amount of gold on immortal. Selling resources can help too. I only build the gold multipliers if I'm going to rush buy or I have a large pre-state property empire. Otherwise, my capital is about the only city with a market (pre-liberalism ish).