Tenets and Faith

[Nightstar]

One thing I forgot to mention, but Anarchy is lasting twice as long as it does in 1.21.1, at least on Odyssey. Is this an intentional change?

 

[Xyth]

One thing I forgot to mention, but Anarchy is lasting twice as long as it does in 1.21.1, at least on Odyssey. Is this an intentional change?

Anarchy from revolutions (civics) or anarchy from reformations (tenets)? Or both?

 

[Xyth]

Here is the first update to 1.22dev2. Because Faith/Tenets/Reformations are complex systems, many files are involved. So rather than trying to keep track of which I've altered and noting installation paths for all of them, I've uploaded the entire Python and XML folders. Go to /History Rewritten/Assets/, delete the existing Python and XML folders and replace them with the ones from the update. I'll use this method for any future updates too.

Changes

• Pluralism: fixed missing description
• Tooltip for Faith Bar added (keeping it small and simple for now)
• Priest/Faith display on city screen is now functional (bar removed)
• Domestic Advisor now displays city faith (Specialisation page)
• Specialist tooltips updated to show faith instead of Prophet GPP
• Civic change advisor popup removed
• Faith no longer accrues during anarchy
• Fixed error when changing city production
• Faith from Priest specialists is now applied​

Known Issues

• Aspiration tenets sometimes give Temples negative yields
• Shrine income isn't being applied for some reason
• No custom messages yet for Reformations (domestic or foreign)
• Pilgrimage does not have a second effect yet
• Forbearance does not have a second effect yet
• Several Tenets do not have icons yet (magenta squares)
• Most leaders have Idolatry as their favourite Tenet (placeholder)
• Building tooltips still show Prophet GPP instead of Faith
• Relevant concept pages in the pedia have not been updated​

 

[Nightstar]

Anarchy from revolutions (civics) or anarchy from reformations (tenets)? Or both?

I'm pretty sure it's both.

Will the update break existing test games?

 

[Xyth]

I'm pretty sure it's both.

I'll investigate.

Will the update break existing test games?

Probably. I recommend playing on faster gamespeeds while testing this. Unlike Civil War, this new system uses files that can't be updated mid game.

 

[Nightstar]

I took a bunch of screenshots of bugs/problems I noted in a new game, but most failed for some reason.

For the two that did come out right, in the first you can see that the civic/tenet pop-ups are still there (and yes, it's both even though the screenshot only shows the one for Preservation). In the second, note the Faith progress bar tooltip. I'm generating 8 Faith/turn, and will get a Prophet next turn, but the tooltip says '8 of 100'.

What I can remember for the failed screenshots:

Even though I switched my Worship Tenet from Idolotry to Sacrifice when founding my religion, I'm still not getting access to Marble after building a Quarry on it and connecting it to my road network.

The tooltip for the Priest specialist shows it generating Faith, but the tooltip for the Add Priest *button* still says (Great Prophet).

There may have been some others, but I can't remember them now.

 

[Xyth]

For the two that did come out right, in the first you can see that the civic/tenet pop-ups are still there (and yes, it's both even though the screenshot only shows the one for Preservation).

Turns out I disabled the "You might want to review some of the civic options available to you" popup instead. Still looking for the proper one.

In the second, note the Faith progress bar tooltip. I'm generating 8 Faith/turn, and will get a Prophet next turn, but the tooltip says '8 of 100'.

Oops. Used the rate rather than the stored amount. That's why I shouldn't code stuff after midnight ><

Even though I switched my Worship Tenet from Idolotry to Sacrifice when founding my religion, I'm still not getting access to Marble after building a Quarry on it and connecting it to my road network.

Likely the same problem that's causing the issue with the Aspiration tenets. Something is being applied/removed twice, or removed but not reapplied. Still investigating.

The tooltip for the Priest specialist shows it generating Faith, but the tooltip for the Add Priest *button* still says (Great Prophet).

Yeah, that uses a different widget so it requires a different solution. Bit more complicated than I anticipated, as are the building tooltips. Will leave them for now, work on them later once most everything else is sorted. Let me know if you see Prophet GPP mentioned anywhere else though.

 

[Nightstar]

Next round:

Playing as a Philosophical leader, I'm not getting free Priests when a Great Prophet is born. Is that intended, since Prophets now use a different mechanic and are more numerous?

First screenshot: Contrary to the 'Known Issues' listing, my Shrine *is* giving me proper income (and yes, I confirmed that it *is* actually added to my treasury each turn). Perhaps the issue is only with captured shrines or ones for non-state religions?

Second screenshot: Spiritual leaders running Proselytism receive free temples upon founding a new city. Is this intended? In my next game I'll try to remember to test whether this also works before researching Divination. (And as a side note, the new temple does *not* have the food penalty that the one hard built in the capital does.)

Third screenshot: This one probably predates the current version, and may even be in base BTS; but the notification tells me of an event in a city I can't see (though the tile it's on has been explored, I haven't seen it since *before* he built the city on it).

Fourth screenshot: If possible, the column headers need updating. They don't even show the Military civic category, much less the new tenets!

 

[Xyth]

Playing as a Philosophical leader, I'm not getting free Priests when a Great Prophet is born. Is that intended, since Prophets now use a different mechanic and are more numerous?

I'm might be scrapping that particular Philosophical bonus, so I've not considered this yet.

First screenshot: Contrary to the 'Known Issues' listing, my Shrine *is* giving me proper income (and yes, I confirmed that it *is* actually added to my treasury each turn). Perhaps the issue is only with captured shrines or ones for non-state religions?

I'm starting to suspect it was caused by something in Worldbuilder, and not something in normal gameplay. Keep an eye out for it though.

Second screenshot: Spiritual leaders running Proselytism receive free temples upon founding a new city. Is this intended? In my next game I'll try to remember to test whether this also works before researching Divination.

Intended, but shouldn't be happening before Divination is known (I checked). Will fix that.

(And as a side note, the new temple does *not* have the food penalty that the one hard built in the capital does.)

A helpful clue.

Third screenshot: This one probably predates the current version, and may even be in base BTS; but the notification tells me of an event in a city I can't see (though the tile it's on has been explored, I haven't seen it since *before* he built the city on it).

Seems to be a quirk of BTS. Looking at the DLL source code, it's checking if the plot is revealed, but not if the plot is visible.

Fourth screenshot: If possible, the column headers need updating. They don't even show the Military civic category, much less the new tenets!

Hah, yes!

 

[Xyth]

2nd update to 1.22dev2. Three folders to replace this time (Config, Python, XML), all in /History Rewritten/Assets/. Includes the previous update, and will definitely break games in progress.


Changes

&#8226; Forbearance: second effect added (+25% chance to influence Rival Civilizations during Reformations)
&#8226; Idolatry: access to Stone/Marble properly restored when switching away
&#8226; Justice: renamed Judgement
&#8226; Proselytism: Spiritual leaders now need Divination to get their free temple
&#8226; Salvation: fixed an error when earning faith from combat
&#8226; Syncretism: changed second effect (No anarchy when reforming tenets)
&#8226; Aspiration tenets can no longer cause negative temple yields
&#8226; Change civic advisor should only appear for civics and not tenets
&#8226; New Tech Advisor (adapted from PlatyUI)
&#8226; Fixed Faith Bar tooltip
&#8226; Updated to Platy World Builder 4.06d
&#8226; Fixed a potential OOS error in multiplayer
&#8226; Several internal optimizations/fixes​

Known Issues

&#8226; No custom messages yet for foreign reformations
&#8226; Pilgrimage does not have a second effect yet
&#8226; Several Tenets do not have icons yet (magenta squares)
&#8226; Most leaders have Idolatry as their favourite Tenet (placeholder)
&#8226; Building tooltips still show Prophet GPP instead of Faith
&#8226; 'Add Priest specialist' button still shows Prophet GPP instead of Faith
&#8226; Relevant concept pages in the pedia have not been updated​

 

[The_Athenian]

Hey Xyth,

Started playing a game with China and had a couple issues.

First, met Korea, Seonduck, and there was no text, so they didn't say anything on first contact.

Then I tried to use a profit to cause a reformation, I click on the reformation button, went to the religion window, and selected some new stuff, but there was no button for reformation on the bottom right, so I clicked cancel. The window closed, and my prophet was gone

This was the first Dev. version you put out, haven't had time to post earlier. I will start a game with the new version and see what happens.



By the way, I love all the new changes. It's intense for a long time Civ player, almost overwhelming, in a good way, it's like getting an awesome new Expansion pack for HR.

Also, good choices on 2nd traits for Forbearance and Syncretism

 

[Xyth]

First, met Korea, Seonduck, and there was no text, so they didn't say anything on first contact.

Fixed for next update, thanks.

Then I tried to use a profit to cause a reformation, I click on the reformation button, went to the religion window, and selected some new stuff, but there was no button for reformation on the bottom right, so I clicked cancel. The window closed, and my prophet was gone

This was the first Dev. version you put out, haven't had time to post earlier. I will start a game with the new version and see what happens.

I've set it up so that if you close the Tenet Screen for some reason after using a Prophet, the next time you open it you can still change tenets and start the reformation. Odd that the Reformation option wasn't appearing though. Let me know if it happens again with the new update.

By the way, I love all the new changes. It's intense for a long time Civ player, almost overwhelming, in a good way, it's like getting an awesome new Expansion pack for HR.

Thanks! I'm really pleased at how it's turned out so far.

 

[Nightstar]

Then I tried to use a profit to cause a reformation, I click on the reformation button, went to the religion window, and selected some new stuff, but there was no button for reformation on the bottom right, so I clicked cancel. The window closed, and my prophet was gone

This was the first Dev. version you put out, haven't had time to post earlier. I will start a game with the new version and see what happens.

I've had the same thing happen in the second dev while playing as Solomon (Judicial/Spiritual) and Hammurabi (Creative/Judicial). No such problem with Ramesses (Creative/Industrious), so I suspect the problem lies in some interaction with the Judicial trait, probably the No Anarchy aspect.

 

[Xyth]

I've had the same thing happen in the second dev while playing as Solomon (Judicial/Spiritual) and Hammurabi (Creative/Judicial). No such problem with Ramesses (Creative/Industrious), so I suspect the problem lies in some interaction with the Judicial trait, probably the No Anarchy aspect.

Ah, that will almost certainly be the problem. I'll see what I can do.

 

[Nightstar]

This has nothing to do with the new Faith system, but I noticed a few strange things with Natural Wonders in my last test game.

First off, Mount Everest is listed as also being a Desert tile, and the two Peak tiles next to it seem a little odd. The one to the east is listed as a normal Peak, but also has a -25% defense modifier. The one to the north has the Eisriesenwalt Natural Wonder on it (and should it even be possible to get Natural Wonders on adjacent tiles?), but doesn't show the name on the tooltip.

And when I built a city next to them, it got the Great Wall effect around its borders (presumably from Mount Everest's 'No Barbs in borders' effect).

 

[Nightstar]

Okay, here's an aspect of the same situation that *does* have to do with the Faith and Tenets system:

In the screenshots you can see that I haven't quite founded my religion yet and thus still have the Animism tenet. However, the city with two Natural Wonders is not getting the free Priest specialist(s).

 

[Xyth]

Apologies for the lack of response or updates this week. Family visiting, toddler teething, and blocked drains to solve. I've solved the problem with Judicial leaders and currently embroiled in sorting some behind-the-scenes stuff in order to get replacement tooltips working. Have also had to reimplement the Tech Splash screen (borrowing Platy's and adapting for HR). Not had a chance to look at the Natural Wonder and Animism issues yet.

 

[Xyth]

First off, Mount Everest is listed as also being a Desert tile, and the two Peak tiles next to it seem a little odd. The one to the east is listed as a normal Peak, but also has a -25% defense modifier.

Mount Everest (and the other mountain NWs) are not true peaks, but terrain features just like the other NWs. This means their underlying terrain is still visible. Everest should only be on Tundra or Snow though, I'll get that fixed.

The one to the north has the Eisriesenwalt Natural Wonder on it (and should it even be possible to get Natural Wonders on adjacent tiles?), but doesn't show the name on the tooltip.

It is possible to have NWs adjacent or nearby, but it should be very rare.

And when I built a city next to them, it got the Great Wall effect around its borders (presumably from Mount Everest's 'No Barbs in borders' effect).

Seems the Great Wall art is tied to the 'No Barbarians' effect and can't be disconnected. Guess I'll have to think of a new bonus for Everest. Pity.

In the screenshots you can see that I haven't quite founded my religion yet and thus still have the Animism tenet. However, the city with two Natural Wonders is not getting the free Priest specialist(s).

Found the issue, will be fixed in the next update.

 

[rsab]

New on this forum, I have to apologize for my english skills first of all.

Congratulations for this wonderful mod. I'm enjoying it so much. Thanks Xyth.

About the tenets system, I'm still having problems with the access to marble and stone, even once I've switched away the Idolatry tenet. It seems that only cities founded after the change of this tenet would be able to get these sources.
It was marked as a problem solved on the last update but it doesn't look like this to me.

I would suggest also to change the Philosophical trait, since it's very annoying getting always the same kind of GP. It makes so difficult trying to get an specific GP for an specific use. I can remember someone else already noticed this problem in this forum.

Ah, and I would find useful to get the sources classified in the civilopedia: crop, material, animal, marine, luxury... sometimes I'm not sure which classification is deserved to an specific source until it's worked (so you can check it on the city screen).

Once again, thanks for HR.

 

[ales_]

Your English might not be ideal (mine isn't either) but it's perfectly understandable.