More Terrains / Terrain Features / Bonus Ressources [IMPLEMENTED]

[raystuttgart]

About Natural Environment:
I did missed it. Where is that topic?

It is one of my uncounted unpublished concepts ...
I try to not publish too many ideas at once - only as much as necessary - because I would be discussing / writing myself to death in the forum.

 

[Fürstbischof]

Shallow Coastal Waters and Coral Reefs look great. Can't wait to see these on random maps.

 

[ConjurerDragon]

The picture of the fog next to the forests looks great

When Coral Reefs can be placed in the middle of the ocean can they appear anywhere on "ocean" tiles? Because in the real world coral reefs grow from the remains of the beings living in them and are usually found in tropical or sub-tropical waters (so e.g. not around Ice-, Green- or Newfoundland). The northernmost american is as far as I know just north of Bermuda.

Do you allow Storms/Tornados to break/destroy/remove reefs in a square? That usually is the way that atolls get a way in over time.

 

[raystuttgart]

When Coral Reefs can be placed in the middle of the ocean can they appear anywhere on "ocean" tiles?

Currently yes ...
I simply have not yet configured anything else.

usually found in tropical or sub-tropical waters

That is easy to configure by using "Latitude Settings".
(Just like Jungle is also not generated in the high North / deep South)

Do you allow Storms/Tornados to break/destroy/remove reefs in a square?

No, because after a couple of turns all Reefs would be gone ...

That usually is the way that atolls get a way in over time.

I know but I do not want that for gameplay.

 

[Nightinggale]

Do you allow Storms/Tornados to break/destroy/remove reefs in a square? That usually is the way that atolls get a way in over time.

Actually atolls are volcanoes forming islands. After they go extinct, they stop growthing (obviously). The lava is heavier than the surface it ended up on top of and over time it will sink through. At some point the top will end up as a reef and depending on conditions like water temperature, corals might form on top. It then sinks further and the corals keep building on top. At some point the corals will be in a tower, which becomes too high to remain stable. At that point it might be destroyed, usually in harsher than usual conditions like a storm.

So you are right that storms can in theory destroy atolls. The issue is however the scope of time. A game lasts a few centuries. That's an instant in geological terms and significantly shorter than the lifetime of atolls. Same with coral reefs. While they might get damaged by a storm, they regrow too and for something as significant as forming new ones or killing off some, the timescale of the game makes it something we shouldn't consider. The game predates ships with toxic (anti-barnacle/coral) paint and they will not be exposed to big metal ships with giant propellers.

In short: coral reefs in the game should be permanent and not something, which can vanish.

 

[raystuttgart]

In short: coral reefs in the game should be permanent and not something, which can vanish.

Fully agree.
It would also be bad for gameplay to have them destroyed by Storms.

 

[raystuttgart]

Ladies and Gentleman,
a small sensation: Mangroves.
A "Terrain Feature" that can exist on both: Land (Marsh) and Water (Large Rivers).

Credits for Graphics:
Caveman 2 Cosmos mod
(I do not know the original creator)

Gameplay description:

• It allows Land Units to pass Large Rivers (but also dramatically slows them down).
• It allows Boats (that can already sail on Large Rivers) to still pass there too (but also dramatically slows them down).
• It gives more "Valuable Wood" but also reduces "Food" (both on Water and Land)

So the decision is up to you the player:

• Will you cut it down to clear the path for your Boats or to increase Food production?
• Will you leave it there as passage for your Land Units and as source of Valuable Wood?

 

[raystuttgart]

Hi guys,

here is the next new Terrain Feature: Kelp
(Generated on Coast and Shallow Coast.)

Credits for Graphics:
Caveman 2 Cosmos mod
(I do not know the original creator)

 

[raystuttgart]

Hi guys,

now we also have Terrain Feature: Bog.
(A softer version of Swamp. It is generated in the same areas.)

Credits for Graphics:
3D Graphics: Caveman 2 Cosmos mod
2D Button: Created it myself.

It also has Furs instead of Premium Furs.
(So you can go hunting there to get some food.)

For gameplay:
It should allow "Swamp areas" to generate some food by Hunting

 

[raystuttgart]

And finally - 13 years after the Releases of Civ4Col - the Llamas have returned to the Andes ...

Small explanation:

• Llamas can be Generated on Mountains and Hills of Terrain Savannah.
• Llamas are not bred like Sheep - since the Europeans did not do that. Instead they can be hunted and give lots of Yield Fur.
• On a Hill Plot with Llamas Yield Sheep is removed. - No Sheep breeding possbile there.

 

[raystuttgart]

Ok and here comes the next.

Terrain Feature Rock Reefs.
(Really not a nice place - and a real obstacle to all Ships.)

• Can be generated on Coast and Shallow Coast
• Affects Movement Rules and causes Damage per Turn, bad Plot Defense

Credits for Graphics:
Caveman 2 Cosmos mod

 

[Arkona]

yeah for that i have post for some time

 

[ConjurerDragon]

What about bog iron? Would that be a +1 iron to bogs generally or mean that the iron bonus resource could appear on bogs?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bog_iron

 

[raystuttgart]

What about bog iron?

Currently it would not work well for gameplay.

Because Iron Ore would allow to build a Mine but any Mine being built on Bog remove the Terrain Feature "Bog" (and make the Mine worthless).
So it is conflicting each other.

Summary:

Terrain Features should never give "Metals".
(Because Mines remove Terrain Features.)

 

[raystuttgart]

Small spoiler of my current modding ...

The vicious Guinea Pig !
The true danger of the New World !

Behold for the dangerous Wildlife and Natural Environment coming with Release 3.1 !!!

 

[modmod]

Because Iron Ore would allow to build a Mine but any Mine being built on Bog remove the Terrain Feature "Bog" (and make the Mine worthless).
So it is conflicting each other.

What if Bog became terrain plot instead of terrain feature?
Swamp/ bog/ marsh/ moorland looks quite interchangeable (for terrain/ t feature).
And there is an extra of moorland which also can be agricultural.

By wikidiff:
https://wikidiff.com/marsh/bog
https://wikidiff.com/moorland/swamp

So based on that bog/ moorland are fit a bit for agriculture, while marsh/ swamp is more wet.

 

[raystuttgart]

What if Bog became terrain plot instead of terrain feature?

We already have the "Wetland" as Terrain.
It can have Terrain Features "Bog" and "Swamp".

Just read this thread and you will find all 3 of them.

Even if we put a tiny bit of Iron on Bog it will be bad for gameplay.
Because Bog is not generated on Hills - only in Flatlands with Rivers.

I could already give "Bog" a bit of Iron and prevent a Mine to remove it.
(It is possible in XML to configure such stuff.)

But it is confusing to players to have such exceptions and really not worth it for gameplay ...
Bog and Swamp are basically intended to be removed by the Player unless they have valuable Bonus Ressources (like e.g. Deer and Beavers)

They are not intended to be "permanent" Terrain Features, because their Terrains are also not intended as "permanent" Terrains.
(People are supposed to use the "Drain Feature" of WTP more often.)

• "Wetland" is intended to be drained to "Grasland".
• "Marsh" is intended to be drained to "Savannah".

---

Summary:

All of that already exists.
And it has all been designed / implemented with certain game concept and balancing in mind.

Please have some patience until it is ready to be at least tested internally.
The full concept is not even implemented yet.

 

[modmod]

But it is confusing to players to have such exceptions and really not worth it for gameplay ...

Agree.

 

[Nightinggale]

One more aspect nobody mentioned: bog iron is generally of a lower quality than iron mined in mountain mines. We can decide not to include bog iron in the mod with the claim that the quality is too low for some of the tasks we use ore for.

 

[raystuttgart]

1 Yield of Iron Ore on a plot (or even 2) is really not worth building a Mine for gameplay ...
It does simply not make any sense for balancing.

And again, you guys need to understand something about the new "Terrain Overhaul":
(Which also ties into the "Health Overhaul" - which also wants to have them removed.)

Some Terrains and Terrain Features are intended as "obstacles" that the Player is supposed to remove step by step.
(They are not supposed to be valuable and beneficial - they are instead supposed to be annoying and obstructive - unless they sometimes have nice Bonus Ressoures.)

Bog and Swamp are basically intended to be removed by the Player unless they have valuable Bonus Ressources (like e.g. Deer and Beavers)

They are not intended to be "permanent" Terrain Features, because their Terrains are also not intended as "permanent" Terrains.
(People are supposed to use the "Drain Feature" of WTP more often. Which will also remove those Terrain Features.)

• "Wetland" is intended to be drained to "Grasland".
• "Marsh" is intended to be drained to "Savannah".