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The Circus, an early Rock Band

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Einiweini7, May 9, 2019.

  1. Einiweini7

    Einiweini7 Chieftain

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    The importance of the 19th century travelling circus on culture and entertainment can not be overstated. It brought animals that were biblical, peoples that were culturally fascinating and entertainment to communities on such a grand scale that they would desperately travel 75 miles by cart to see it. Many circuses failed within the first two years.

    I would like to see a circus purchased by faith that could add +5-25% culture and 1 amenity to a city for 10 turns. Sometimes the Amenity issue can take many turns to permanently resolve, so at a cost (with an exceptionally realistic historical narrative), you could expend faith by buying a unit to stabilise a city and increase cultural output with a successful performance. It would only perform on a city without the buff in place but once it drops they can return.
     
  2. Boris Gudenuf

    Boris Gudenuf Deity

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    Neat idea!
    But the traveling and temporary nature of the circus stay might better be modeled by making it a Project similar to Brazil's Carnival: doesn't require any particular District since the circuses set up in any vacant lot/pasture, and while going, the "Circus Project" would provide Amenity and Culture to the city.

    Connected to that, and available possibly at Steam Power Tech, would be a Wonder: Barnum & Bailey Traveling Circus. When completed, the city it is built in would have a Winter Quarters for the circus like the original circus had in Sarasota Florida, and would provide Culture and Amenity from Entertainment to every city in your Civ connected by road/railroad to that Winter Quarters City.
    It might also provide, realistically, some kind of Military bonus: the German General Staff sent officers to study the original traveling circus, because Barnum and John Ringling could move a mass of equipment, people and animals by rail faster and more efficiently than anyone: the circus' model for traveling kitchens, advance parties, and specialized transport railcars was copied by most of the armies of the late 19th century (late Industrial Era in the game).
     
    qadams likes this.
  3. tanktop4158

    tanktop4158 Chieftain

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    yea I like that, but better there needs to be some counter to both.....something like the music executive or lawer, which can remove the rock band, that he has free access seems lame
     
  4. Zenstrive

    Zenstrive Ocean King

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    you can easily put unit in districts and wonders to stop the tides of rock bands

    Also the idea of circus may have been abstracted in the tourism linked to international trade routes.
     
    SammyKhalifa likes this.
  5. Trav'ling Canuck

    Trav'ling Canuck Deity

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    Isn't that by itself, though, an odd game design issue?

    If the AI stationed it's units properly, the player would never be able to make use of rock bands. If the player takes the time to station their units properly, the AI can never make use of rock bands, at least not against the player.

    At best I can view this as the micro-management equivalent to providing players with a start menu slider:
    a) No Rock Bands (= you don't buy them and you station your units over your districts & wonder)
    b) Player Only Rock Bands (= you buy them but prevent the AI from using theirs against you)
    c) Full Rock Bands (= you buy them and don't block the AIs)

    But at least with a slider your choices would impact AI-AI relations and (ideally) the AI would know not to buy rock bands if it wasn't going to be able to make use of them.

    As it is, I'm not sure how to understand the current game design, other than as a mechanic purposefully tilted in favour of the player to help the player win games they otherwise wouldn't and win faster than they otherwise would.
     
  6. Boris Gudenuf

    Boris Gudenuf Deity

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    AI's don't buy games, players do: you can never go wrong as a game business tilting the game in favor of the player . . .
     
    Trav'ling Canuck likes this.
  7. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

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    . . . yet.
     
    Trav'ling Canuck and Reckoner like this.
  8. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I think a circus is more entertainment than culture. It was designed to entertain rather than educate. An elephant was there to wow you and an elephant man to disgust you. Horse riding, acrobats and clowns were the majority of the acts.
    A circus was in itself its own culture, here in England we have a class of travellers called showmen, most circuses have gone but the showmen families retain their traditions to a degree.
    I have wondered for a while about as a civ progresses, what an arena turns into, horses or horsepower and one could include the big top in that slot.

    Rock bands are certainly more cultural in my view but also entertainment. I guess they have stretched the rope a lot with rock bands, were they the thinnish end of the wedge for a circus argument, probably.

    More importantly, we do not need any more tourism in the game.
     
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  9. Boris Gudenuf

    Boris Gudenuf Deity

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    Your last statement, @Victoria, is the key: I've won too many Cultural Victories long before Rock Bands would be available for any further 'boost' to Tourism OR culture to be necessary.

    I think the traditional traveling circus would be an interesting Entertainment option, if needed in the game, but I've never seen either my AI opponents nor myself ever have any major problems providing enough Amenities/Entertainment, either.

    IF there were an earlier Culture/Tourism requirement in the game, a possibility would be the 'superstar' lecturers and touring entertainers of the Industrial Era: singers like Jenny Lind and lecturers like Sam Clemens (Mark Twain), the 'Rock Stars' of their day, produced, possibly, as a specialized type of Great Person . . .

    Parenthetically, IF we did need more Tourism, we could realistically start it much earlier in the game: when Solon visited Egypt in the 4th century BCE (Classical Era) he was entertained by 'touts' at the Pyramids and the Sphinx with many of the same stories that modern Egyptian tour guides use on tourists today, because the pyramids were already over 1500 years old and objects of wonder to contemporaries.

    I think it's useful to explore Options, if for no other reason the to give the Design Team - whether for Civ VI DLCs or Civ VII - some ideas to work on, even if they aren't necessarily required by the current state of the game.
     
    Victoria likes this.

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