The Cultural Department - Term 1

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Cyc

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The Cultural Department - Term 1

culture11.jpg
 
As the Department of Culture (DOC) is unique in the sense that it did not exist in the civ2 game, the goals of the Department still need to be defined. The latest draft of the constitution states that decisions about expansion and cultural city improvements are to made by this Department. It also grants this Department power to override a governors decision for the construction of a cities cultural improvements. Basically, the Department sees this authority as one being used in situations where our cultural borders are being threatened by a rival faction. The need to increase culture in a given area or city should be addressed in a timely manner to prevent cultural flips (cities or borders). There may be other motivating factors for implementing this authority, but it will not be used on the basis of a whim or some petty arguement.

The DOC will encourage, no strive for, the development and advancement of improvements and wonders that will build an enduring cultural identity. At present, the DOC goal is to seek the path that will bring our nation to greatness other civilizations will come to respect.
 
Listed below are improvements and wonders that the DOC will set as default endeavors. They are listed in order of importance in regard to a strong cultural stance. As these are only the default lists, decisions can and will be made that do not directly match the lists. They are posted here only to reflect game structure and scoring.

Improvements

temple
library
cathedral
university
colosseum
research lab

Wonders

Cure for Cancer
Newtons Great University
Globe Theatre
The Great Library
The Oracle
The Pyramids
Hanging Gardens
Sistine Chapel
Copernicus' Observatory
Longevity
Hoover Dam
Magellan's Great Voyage

Small Wonders

Heroic Epic
Forbidden Palace
Appollo Program
Iron Works
Wall Street
 
As President of the First term, I feel like I have to contribute here a little. Great work with the list of (In importance order?) cultural structures.

To get the most of our cultural buildings they should be built as early as possible. Every Cultural building will get a Cultural Bonus when they have been there for 1000 Years.

The bonus is the same as the original Culture Value (Cp per Turn).

So that would make (with the 1000 Year Bonus):

Temple = 4/turn
Library = 6/turn
Cathedrals = 6/turn
University = 8/turn
Colosseum = 4/Turn

And some important wonders(with the 1000 Year Bonus).

Great Library = 12/turn
Forbidden Palace = 4/Turn (pretty sure...)

So the Great Library is great to get, as it comes early, and for the Techs and Money boost it provides.

I think that Temples, Libraries, Cathedrals and Universities is a must in our Uncorrupted cities. Not necessarly in that order...

If we will have any corrupted cities my list of cultural improvements they must have is not that long. Temple is the only MUST-have cultural improvement for them I think. Unless they are border cities...


Wonders I consider as Must Haves (should be built in this order)

Great Library
Sistine Chapel or Sun Tzu's (Or both)
Thery of Evolution
Hoover Dam
Longevity

Keep up the Good Work

/the President
 
Thank you for your input, Mr. President. as your pm box is full and i can't get through to you with an email, i'll ask you here. Just for the record, what version patch are you using and where can i find your bonus information so i can catch up on my reading? Your points per turn came out a match when compared to the manual, but it calls for a different bonus. The wonders are listed by points per turn also. That's why i stated in order of importance. calculating out the points generated from a wonder that was built thousands of years before a wonder with higher points per turn is not something i had the time to do yesterday. Which is why i only listed the top 12 wonders in order of culture points per turn. If you want my personal favorites in the wonder department, i would say Oracle, Great Library, Sistine Chapel, and Cure for Cancer. oh, and i forgot, Hanging Gardens. I mainly wanted to set up a policy base for easy reference. Where any of the citizens could go and find the basic stance they could expect from the DOC. Nothing mentioned in the first two replies are written in stone. (I thought I mentioned that:) ). anyway please reply to my above question. thank you.
 
I just had a couple of comments on this discussion about which culture improvements are the most important. I know it is usually taken as a given to build a temple in all cities, but let me make a case for libraries. I have played in several games where I was able to secure several luxuries early (3-4). In those cases, the Temple is not so critical for happiness purposes. The library, on the other hand, produces more culture, 50% more for 33% more cost. Borders expand much faster, and if you are whipping to produce them they each take two pop anyway. Also, if we are scientific, it is just one shield and one pop! So even a totally corrupted city could crank one out quickly. The science bonus is just the icing on the cake.

Also, the 1000 year bonus is double the original culture/turn, I have tested it out. Getting Libraries done in the early BCs, when it is still 30-50 years/turn, is a big plus. It only takes 20-30 turns to get the bonus, rather than 100 turns after 250 AD.

Obviously this will depend on our situation, what civ we choose, and how many luxuries are available, I just wanted to put some ideas out there.
 
It's good to see the Cultural Department hard at work with preparations for developing a rich cultural heritage for our people. This warms my heart! :hammer:

The military department will do all that we can to help protect these great national treasures: our wonders, our libraries, our temples. We concur with the Culture department on the need to expand our borders by culture, on the grandeur of the Heroic Epic, and the lavishness (and utility) of the Forbidden Palace. The Great Library too will be a boon too our culture, allowing us to save budget dollars for propogation and protection.

I recognize we will not need a barracks in every city (although Sun Tzu's would be very nice!), this pales in comparison to the need for culture, and yet I'm likewise sure our president will not leave culturally significant border towns undefended.

Peace,
General Charis
 
“could it be that I have found my home at last, home at last.”

Yes, the game has started, and our cultural borders have already expanded from the immense culture founded in our glorious capital, Fox Nest. The birthplace of a nation, our fortress in the hills of Phoenatica, the spawning place of our future core cities, and our capital, Fox Nest will be the rock that steadies our growth. May all our citizens see the great flag atop our capitol from the mountains and forests and farmlands of Phoenatica. I will join the people in a toast, ‘Fox Nest, our home.’
 
First screenshot ---

In viewing this screenshot, the DOC would need to explore SE and NW from Fox Nest for possible city locations. NW being the priority. From what I can see, the only placement I could recommend is on the hill, 1 move SW of the warrior. This would create a good wonder-building or cavalry-building city once we got it irrigated and populated. Other than that the DOC sees no good spots at this time. The fish is lost and Fox Nest needs all the resources within its borders, unrestricted by other cities.

We could produce a settler naturally (if not, then waiting one turn) by working the two-food grassland tile next to the mine with our next growth (in 1). Then send it NW with no protection. I recommend against this, and agree to switch to a warrior, to explore the NW and set up for the initial protection of the next city. After this warrior is produced, then a settler (to follow the warrior’s path) should be next.

This is the official stance of the DOC, although as I have stated previously, we stand behind the president’s decision.
 
As a representative of The Spice Traders Guild, our merchants support the use of their goods in the construction of temples and libraries, so that we our culture can grow, and claim new resources, as well as research new techs.
 
Today was the second series of moves made by our president in the Civ3 Demo game. The amount of turns played was increased by demand, as stated in the constitution. The game moderator, the duck, sanctioned this. Basically the amount of moves was increased to allow the placement of the next city. In doing so, we doubled the amount of cities in Phoenatica, adding to Fox Nest a costal core city named Eyr, after our great Domestic Advisor.

The year is 2800 BC and our culture point total is up to 28. This is not bad compared to the number of moves. We owe all of these points to the Palace of Fox Nest. Our World Ranking is 75, and combined with the fact that our citizens are of course, the most cultured of any nation known in our world today, this is a very high score.

We have 2 warriors in the field and two in production. As we are allowed 8 military units at this time, we could basically double our army without dipping into the budget. Having lost one of our units to the barbarians in the north country, our exploration suffered a setback. Due to a unique set of circumstances, some of our leaders wish to form a small band of warriors to send up there and investigate more thoroughly. More exploration is needed in the NW and in the SE. In the NW, grassland and cattle have been found. In the SE, mainly jungle and hills have been found, but by the looks of the map, there may be a rushing river to help supply future cities.

In the Science Department, we are spending one-third of our income on knowledge of iron working. One of our warriors found a friendly tribe in the south country, who taught us the advance of ceremonial burial. This is great for the DOC as now temples may be built in our cities to lift the spirits of the people and bring them hope.

So, with the exception of the loss of our gallant warrior to barbarians, this has been a great day in Phoenatica.
 
Today we had a “we love the President day” celebration, as it was his birthday. Eyrei filled in for him at the helm and did very well indeed, increasing our viewable area about 400%. The land remains very hilly to the south and very mountainous to the north and farther east. We have found an inland sea to the east, a large lake to the north, and plenty of resources. 2 deposits of iron, 2 dyes, and 2 more incense. Although most of these will take time to secure, it is feasible to do so. As we are in a mountainous area, gold is everywhere. I count 8 deposits of gold, 2 of which have been secured. Cattle, wheat, game, and fish are abundant throughout the explored area, and there are 3 locations inhabited by wild horses.

We have again doubled the amount of cities for the Phoenetian Nation. Shailonegha was settled out on the northern coastline and will thrive on spice and fishing. Khatovar was settled on a hilltop, resting on a mother load of gold that will help finance a future army. A fifth city will be settled in two moves. Located north of Khatovar and East of Shailonegha, this city (already named PDX) will flourish among the local cattle and wheat farmlands fed by a river originating in the hills. It will also be fairly close to our northern neighbors, the Americans.

Yes, we have met 5 other nations. The afore-mentioned yanks to the north and the Romans, Aztecs, Babylonians, and Greeks to the south. All seem impressed with our culture, except of course the Aztecs, who are unimpressed.

A lot of trading went on during the course of the 19-move session. Heavy tech trading and selling in a wheeler-dealer day has put us technologically advanced with 164 gold in the bank. We’ve been able to keep our science rate at a low 30% with no luxuries, so we need only spend 7 of our 12 gold income, netting a fiver each turn. We spend 3 on science, send 2 as payment to another nation, and lose 2 to corruption.

Our world rating is 115, 5th of the known 6 nations. As our army is average or better, I believe the 5th place rating is due to a slight population drop due to our expansion. This should even out shortly. Our Cultural point total is now 72 in the year 1910 BC, which is about average for the known world.

We have 12 military units. 7 in the field, 3 protecting our cities, a worker, and a settler. Of the 10 army units, 9 are warriors and 1 is a spearman. In production, we have 1 warrior, 1 worker, 1 settler, and one temple.

What a glorious day for our young nation. It seems to be turning into a robust game, destined to be a race for real estate and growth – military might and gold. Stay tuned….
 
The DOC has read and appreciates the retraction posted by the Office of the Military. We also recognize the ability of the Military Department’s Leader to motivate and mobilize vast armies on a global scale, and to direct them in successful campaigns. We wish to express our desire to alleviate any undue inter-departmental stress that may have arisen recently. And finally, we will seek a path to better communication with the Military Department in all endeavors at the departmental level.
 
We must concentrate on having temples to increase our cultural influence, minister, and I dont see any indication of a wonder being started:eek: .

The loss of early wonders could be detrimental to our cause
 
Our recent military analysis made some strong calls for what is needed to support upcoming actions. In there is a dot map and some thoughts for priorities.

The one thing that concerns me, as I know it will the department here, is the suggestion that Wonder 'building' may not be on our agenda. Wonder 'acquisition' however, is quite a part of those plans.

The difficulty is that, well, we have such poor prospects for citiy production in our young empire. There is almost no site that has: good food (to even get beyond size 3), good production squares, *and* close enough to the capital to have good net production.
In other words... we may well need to rely on our capital for troop production rather than wonder building. With 10 shields production, the equation is simply 30 immortals or a 300 shield wonder (since the plan is to crank vet warriors and upgrade them by cash, with shields as our rate-limiting-factor). You can imagine what impact 30 vet immortals would have on the growth, power, and ultimately culture, of our civilization, compared to something like the Gardens.

With our dearth of good sites near the capital, are there any other thoughts here for building culture in the short-medium term? Or is it recognized that our day will come a little later, and use a strong early campaign to secure middle age and industrial wonders.

Hmmm... perhaps this is its own answer? "Culture" is not hurt by corruption, and if we focus on building temples quickly in ALL captured cities (good from so many points of view), we can in fact really forge ahead nicely in culture. (Didn't really recognize this as a solid plan until in the middle of writing this post) It would be more the "national" culture plan rather than the one-city approach.

General Charis
 
In looking at what we can do to improve the culture of our young nation in the most efficient manner possible, let us not forget that we will soon have the ability to store our knowledge in Libraries. Due to our naturally scientific nature, these are cheaper than temples, yet produce even more culture! The added benefit of increasing our learning rate is a bonus.

At this point, with science in the 30% range, it would take a city with 7-8 trade to make the library science bonus exceed the maintenance cost, (7 trade at 30% = 2 science, +50% = +1 science, making up for the 1 gold in maintenance). However, with the gold sources and other bonuses near some of our cities, that should be very feasible.

The Culture bonus, however, is even more important. By building them early, we can achieve the 1000 year bonus that much sooner, while the turns are still many years each that 1000 years goes by even quicker!

Justus II
Deputy Culture Minister
 
Originally posted by Justus II
In looking at what we can do to improve the culture of our young nation in the most efficient manner possible, let us not forget that we will soon have the ability to store our knowledge in Libraries. Due to our naturally scientific nature, these are cheaper than temples, yet produce even more culture! The added benefit of increasing our learning rate is a bonus.

At this point, with science in the 30% range, it would take a city with 7-8 trade to make the library science bonus exceed the maintenance cost, (7 trade at 30% = 2 science, +50% = +1 science, making up for the 1 gold in maintenance). However, with the gold sources and other bonuses near some of our cities, that should be very feasible.

The Culture bonus, however, is even more important. By building them early, we can achieve the 1000 year bonus that much sooner, while the turns are still many years each that 1000 years goes by even quicker!

Justus II
Deputy Culture Minister

The Domestic Department fully intends to construct libraries in all cities not officially recognized as military training centers as soon as possible. Rush building will be utilized, and our citizens will be made temporarily unhappy, but once they realize the glory of our cultural superiority, they will be satisfied with their sacrifice.
 
The year is 1400BC and the Total Cultural Value of the great lands of Phoenatica is 130. Listed below are the individual values:

Fox Nest - 114 for the Great Palace and a temple
Shailonegha - 10 for a temple
PDX - 6 for a temple
Eyr - 0
Khatovar - 0

In reading all the postings, I've come to the conclusion that you're all right. I don't know how you did it, but pretty much 100% of the citizenry is absolutely right. Which brings me to me...

Looking over my recommendations for city placement, I must say, what did they put in my drink? Even I wouldn't use the same spots, simply because I easily found new ones. But i won't bore you with that.

I will say that I am feeling highly unqualified for the position of Leader. With every step forward, it appears to be two steps back. I am thouroughly enjoying the Privilege of Cultural Minister, but maybe the position shouldn't be so vocal in matters that are seemingly outside the parameters of the Cultural Department. I would like to tone down my role in the development of our nation to be more in line with observer, responding to matters of Culture when asked by the President or Cabinet, and of course writing the Cultural Report.

This brings up our Deputy Minister of Culture, Justus II. I would encourage Justus II to try to attend some chats and become familiar with the swift moving operations of a turn session. This will also allow the nation to become more familiar with him. Welcome aboard, Justus II.

BTW, i have moved up to Khatovar and hope you all can come up and see us sometime. We'd love to have ya. Thank you and good night.
 
As there was a request for a screenshot with future city development marked, I’ve uploaded one here:

edit: see URL at bottom....next edit: that's only working half way
let me go find some help
I'll put this bad quickie in here till i can get the good on up and in
it's at the bottom, image002.gif


I believe securing the eastern front iron deposit is a priority. Egypt will soon be moving in to claim it and our territory [A]. After the iron, then securing the resources west of the inland sea (still to be named) . One of the original suggestions early in the game, (I can’t remember who suggested it), is south of Fox Nest in the hills [C]. The newly discovered coastline will make for a good city site having fish, forest and mountain. Again in the hills [D]. The far west tip, SW of Shailonegha, a city could use the forest to build and become a strategic point. Not only would it secure the coast, but would give early detection of NW naval activity [E]. The gold deposits on the southern shores of the inland sea will help give a boost in alleviating the monetary drain we are sure soon to feel. And the city will help expand our SE border [F]. Finally, because it’s soon to be a hot spot, we should secure the dye fields as we cross the mountains to the NE [G].

This will mean 3 quick settlers from Khatovar. We will also need workers for the southern cities. Roads to cities and [C] should be built out from the eastern desert tile of Fox Nest. All cities should be placed quickly to stop the advance of Egypt, Greece, and Rome. Barracks are a priority in cities [A], , and [C]. [D] and [E] should work on temples and get an immortal or spearman from one of the barracks. [F] and [G] are to far off to worry about at this time.

I am aware of the war effort in Phoenatica. I voted to fight. The time draws near when our men will have to leave their loved ones to face another man’s sword. The training and equipping of our men will be a sight to see. As the war draws closer, the fever will run higher. There is nothing like the advance of a heroic army to help us learn of the culture in foreign lands. Soon we will be eating of their foods, and wearing their fine woven materials, and riding their horses. Let us prepare for the Immortals.
 
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