The Donald Trump Friendship and Positivity Thread

[Hrothbern]

Why poverty and not other disadvantages?

Inequality is imo getting evil when it is coming from oppression.

But how do you separate inequality caused by collateral damage of a system from inequality caused by intended oppression ?

Using poverty is something that you can aplly in a practical way, with procedures based on things you can measure.

 

[miaasma]

I like how he’s making an effort more than previous presidents to secure our borders. I like that he’s against affirmative action programs.

Edit: let me clarify that I support “affirmative action” for people born into poverty, but not based on your ethnicity or sex. Obama pushed for both of those things.

what a take

Be more specific than “other minority protections “

don't be obtuse

 

[metalhead]

“Facing discrimination” is subjective. Being below the poverty line isn’t.

It's not subjective, it has been studied and measured and proven by objective evidence. It's not any less objective than seeing how terribly society uses and often abuses people in poverty.

So I really don't understand why you'd want to eliminate compensating for one type of discrimination in favor of compensating for another.

 

[Sommerswerd]

You realize I’m a minority myself? “Facing discrimination” is subjective. Being below the poverty line isn’t.

An important thing to consider is what the purpose of the anti-discrimination measure, program, regulation etc., is. I think that sometimes folks get tunnel vision on the goal being solely "fighting poverty", when that is not always necessarily the goal, and certainly not the only goal.

Facing discrimination isn't really subjective in this case, but I do agree that the process of applying to university should, on the whole be made simpler, less ambiguous, and less classist.

When I applied to college, some of the larger schools had literal one-page applications that were more like a 1040-EZ... name, address, SSN, parent's income, GPA and LSAT score, names/contact info of any alumni relatives, not much else... whereas other schools had applications that were dozens of pages and asked for multiple writing samples, letters of recommendation, you name it... So to be fair, you can find "simpler, less ambiguous, and less classist" if you're looking for it.

It's not subjective, it has been studied and measured and proven by objective evidence. It's not any less objective than seeing how terribly society uses and often abuses people in poverty. So I really don't understand why you'd want to eliminate compensating for one type of discrimination in favor of compensating for another.

Yeah, again it depends greatly on the goals. If we are trying to create a police force that is less likely to racially profile people who appear to be Muslim or Middle Easterners, it doesn't matter much that we screen applicants with a preference for those in "poverty and nothing else". If anything, giving a preference for "poverty and nothing else" in that context would probably make the problem worse, not better.

 

[Farm Boy]

Well, conflicting goals is a reality of governance. We tend to get hung up on poverty because poverty causes, directly and indirectly, immediate and multigenerational pain that is significantly addressable making somebody less povertous. Happiness can be bought, up to a point. It's mostly the point where not having money causes pain, but same difference.

So, if we're going to get hung up on something, usually, poverty is a pretty good thing to get hung up on. The principles are pretty stubborn too. I might be stupid or something, but generally speaking, people will at least follow the logic of a "fair shake" and adjusting to people's conditions. She needs this because that. You don't need this because you don't share the same condition. If you did, or she didn't, you're on the same page again. People will tolerate some discrepency and still call it fair. Prejudicial treatment on who rather than what is so utterly normal it's mundane. Nepotism is everywhere, and it sucks when people do it with their own money in annoying ways. When it's done with my money, our money, it possesses all the fairness of corruption.

 

[Arakhor]

Moderator Action: This is a valid conversation, but it's off-topic in this thread. Please move it elsewhere. Thank you.

 

[Kyriakos]

I don't see anything positive in Trump, but Melania is hot

 

[Ferocitus]

Donald Trump's trade war will hit the Commies hard where it hurts.
How "rare" can they be if China produces 95% of the world's supply of rare earths.
The USA will use coal thank you very much, Comrade Xi!

 

[FriendlyFire]

GRATEST speaker of all time
(apparently they couldnt get enough Deploreables to turn up so they hide the empty seats with large curtains. Trump is an amazing speaker, who knew the brain was more important Learn so much)

“I have broken more Elton John records, he seems to have a lot of records. And I, by the way, I don’t have a musical instrument. I don’t have a guitar or an organ. No organ. Elton has an organ. And lots of other people helping. No we’ve broken a lot of records. We’ve broken virtually every record. Because you know, look I only need this space. They need much more room. For basketball, for hockey and all of the sports, they need a lot of room. We don’t need it. We have people in that space. So we break all of these records. Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.”

 

[Valka D'Ur]

You've probably heard me say this before, but have you listened to his rallies? Like, really listened and tried to figure out his appeal? While being as non-judgmental as possible?

If not, I highly recommend it. From experience, booze helps a lot - it quiets down the analytical side of your brain that says "this doesn't make any sense" or "that has terrible implications". Just sit back and take in the emotions of the crowd as they respond to him, and try to let yourself be carried along as much as you possibly can.

This Jacobin article does a better job than I can of explaining how Trump emotionally appeals to people. Technically I'm supposed to spoiler the link because it contains a swear word, courtesy of Trump himself.

Spoiler Jacobin article on Trump rallies :

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2016/11/trump-speeches-populism-war-economics-election/

Here's a key bit:


I remember when he said this and was blown away by how politically brilliant he had been by saying "I love the poorly educated!" In doing so, not only communicated his support for a large, disadvantaged, and derided population, he got the media to remark on that comment in a way that helped drive home his populist message about how the elites disdain the masses and only he cares about them. The media responded in a predictably sneering way, suggesting that he insulted his base but also, in some cases, seeming to communicate that it is ridiculous to love the poorly educated as a group. That sort of sentiment is the sort of thing that drives people to vote against their class interests.

Trump uses the word "love" all the time. That article again:


So yeah, he communicates empathy and concern for people all the time. He has rhetorical carrots along with sticks, and displays them expertly to get people to feel "love" back for him.

Except he doesn't mean a word of it, at least not in the sense people think. Of course he "loves" poorly educated people, because many of them have no idea they're being lied to.

I like how he’s making an effort more than previous presidents to secure our borders. I like that he’s against affirmative action programs.

Yes, I'm sure that when the American border control stops legitimate Canadian fishing boats because they're worried about Mexicans sneaking into the U.S. via lobster boats from New Brunswick, it's all a misunderstanding and the real reason for this harassment is just to exchange chowder recipes.

U.S. Border Patrol says it won't stop checking Canadian fishing vessels

GRATEST speaker of all time
(apparently they couldnt get enough Deploreables to turn up so they hide the empty seats with large curtains. Trump is an amazing speaker, who knew the brain was more important Learn so much)

What an amazing word salad (the quoted material, not your post).

 

[GoodSarmatian]

How "rare" can they be if China produces 95% of the world's supply of rare earths.

Not sure if serious, but I'll respond anyway: Rare earths are called rare earths because they were difficult to identify and seperate when they were discovered. They're pretty common almost everywhere except in Europe, and China only has such a high market share because they undercut prices.
North America has large deposits and the USA could break China's monopoly. It would be expensive and require subsidies, smart protectionism and the kind of long-term strategic investment that seems to be anathema to modern US capitalism.
Since that's clearly not possible, rising prices could also lead to increased rare earth extraction in Canada, Australia, Brazil or South Africa (the country and the region in general).
Has he already announced tariffs on Africa, Australia and Brazil ?

 

[Ferocitus]

Not sure if serious, but I'll respond anyway: Rare earths are called rare earths because they were difficult to identify and seperate when they were discovered. They're pretty common almost everywhere except in Europe, and China only has such a high market share because they undercut prices.
North America has large deposits and the USA could break China's monopoly. It would be expensive and require subsidies, smart protectionism and the kind of long-term strategic investment that seems to be anathema to modern US capitalism.
Since that's clearly not possible, rising prices could also lead to increased rare earth extraction in Canada, Australia, Brazil or South Africa (the country and the region in general).
Has he already announced tariffs on Africa, Australia and Brazil ?

I have been following rare earth trends for a long time as some are used in wind
turbines (one of my early research interests). As principal ingredients for high-
powered magnets they are also used in satellites, aircraft and other military
tech.

The US and many other countries were becoming peeved with China's dominance in
the supply of those metals and China opened up supply a little to appease them.

I agree that there will be a shaking out, especially if China again limits
supply and that there will be increased interest developing mines/industries in
the countries you mentioned.

There is also a lot of marine prospecting for rare earths. Japan has found some
new rich sources, however, they are in very deep water (>3km) which makes the
extraction difficult to say the least.

Edit: I don't know what Trump has announced about tariffs specific to those metals.
Even if he had, it will take months until the man arrives with the official phrase book
so we can try to translate his mumbo-jumbo into an Earth-like language.